How to convert a Hindu

[VajraYosid]

Even so, my mother is a gaudiya vaishnava, the sect most often compared to Abrahamism.

 

[Vinayaka]

Even so, my mother is a gaudiya vaishnava, the sect most often compared to Abrahamism.

Then maybe it's an individual's approach. We're all skewed by the individuals that we meet. I have met individuals that did remind me of Abrahamism in a couple of ways, but I've also met devotees whose behaviour had no resemblance. Just as the sects within Hinduism are incredibly diverse, so are the people.

 

[ratikala]

namaskaram :namaste

In my view, it seems that Vaishnavism is somewhat similar to Abrahamic religions.

what particular aspects make you say this ?

Even though it is still a Dharmic path, a lot of things and mentalities that some people here on the forum view as Abrahamic are actually found in Vaishnavism too.

in otherwords what similarities do you see?

 

[ratikala]

namaskaram :namaste

In my limited experience, the diversity of Vaishnavism is far and wide. I think Tirupati or Sri Rangam, or some of the wonderful Kerala temples would be quite different from Swaminarayan or Gaudiya Vaishnava ones. So this idea may be closer to true just for particular schools. We can never forget the wide diversity that we are. So most likely both observations have some validity.

I can see a crossover in that some principles of sanatana dharma are upheld by all faiths , but even these are only upheld according to the understanding of the practitioner .
however I dont see it in the beleif structure .

 

[ratikala]

Then maybe it's an individual's approach. We're all skewed by the individuals that we meet. I have met individuals that did remind me of Abrahamism in a couple of ways, but I've also met devotees whose behaviour had no resemblance. Just as the sects within Hinduism are incredibly diverse, so are the people.

very much so , ... I have met individual christians and mulims who's behavioral reverance to god was in some ways simmilar , but as far as belifs went that was where the similarity ended .

yes , this diversity allso depends very much on the level of a persons commitment and realisation (even within the one tradition).

 

[Vinayaka]

however I dont see it in the beleif structure .

Me neither. So perhaps the individuals I met were still in the conversion process, and still held onto some 'stuff', or had lived where Abrahamism had a long term stronger influence, and impact. But those were only 3 or 4 people of some 500 I've met. So indeed it's an incorrect generalisation.

 

[Ignotus]

Just something to be aware of, on here, and in real life.

I love the stories of Jesus and the lessons he taught through his actions. Although that page from the link reminded me of why I have not been able to be Christian with a clear conscious. One of the reasons anyway.

I have a few copies of documents from my own people regarding this subject. My father's people were allowed U.S. citizenship unless they denounced their affiliation to their previous beliefs, language and cultural practices. Christian conversion came hand in hand with the purge of past beliefs. Especially as the needed witness of your execution to these conditions. Don't get me wrong there was a couple good Christians at the time and location. Though the double wammy of church and state obliterated much of who we were. I read what the Christians there though of the traditions of my people. I know why they thought this way and thats because they had their own Christian/Western culture. It was like night and day in comparison. I know they thought they were doing the right thing. That fact does not make it justified though. My grandmother was reformed. She didn't speak our language again until her last years on earth.

This is no way meant to sound like an attack on Christianity. It is a fact, what has happened has already happened. We are still picking up the pieces from those days and many trying to reconnect to who we once were. There is many devout Christians with in the people too, they welcome people in the church rather than convince them.

Even though I may feel this way personally about evangelization. How do the Dalits feel on this subject I wonder? Seems like becoming something else than Hindu may be liberating, no?

 

[Vinayaka]

How do the Dalits feel on this subject I wonder? Seems like becoming something else than Hindu may be liberating, no?

If food, false promises, fear of hell, etc. is liberating, I suppose so.

I actually don't think many would know the difference. One reason is that they easily ger 'converted' right back to Hinduism when the Arya Samaj comes along to restore their faith. I'm also not really sure what happens on the ground in individual circumstances. When you're in a poverty situation, you are pretty much naive to whatever might happen. Food is food, and who really cares where it comes from.

I presume, 'my people' means native American or first peoples?

 

[Ignotus]

If food, false promises, fear of hell, etc. is liberating, I suppose so.

I actually don't think many would know the difference. One reason is that they easily ger 'converted' right back to Hinduism when the Arya Samaj comes along to restore their faith. I'm also not really sure what happens on the ground in individual circumstances. When you're in a poverty situation, you are pretty much naive to whatever might happen. Food is food, and who really cares where it comes from.

I presume, 'my people' means native American or first peoples?

Very interesting about the Dalit's. I have been curious on the Indian caste and Hinduism. I have done some reading about conversion to Hinduism to my curiosity how non-indian Hindu's are seen within the caste. Would they be without a caste? How does that work. I wonder due to pure curiosity, I have nothing but respect and I am ignorant on the subject. Though I guess this may be a question for another thread.

Yes, one of the tribes of America’s first people is what my story (my people) is referencing too.

 

[nameless]

How do the Dalits feel on this subject I wonder? Seems like becoming something else than Hindu may be liberating, no?

how so? caste system exists among christians in india too, they are not allowed to enter the churches of other groups also wont do intercast marriages.

 

[nameless]

I have been curious on the Indian caste and Hinduism. I have done some reading about conversion to Hinduism to my curiosity how non-indian Hindu's are seen within the caste.

caste-system is not associated with religion, it is cultural product, christians in india also follows caste system. Fortunately, caste-system is getting fainted day by day.

 

[Ignotus]

how so? caste system exists among christians in india too, they are not allowed to enter the churches of other groups.

I am not exactly sure "how so", that is why I asked. Very interesting, still not allowed to enter other caste's church. My post was generally about evangelization and it's effect of my own people. I don't want to derail this thread. Perhaps I can ask a Dalit on the subject of Dalits and evangelization in the future.

Thanks

 

[Vinayaka]

I have done some reading about conversion to Hinduism to my curiosity how non-indian Hindu's are seen within the caste.

I'm a western adoptive, as are most of the Hindus on here. Like Nameless said, the whole idea of caste is disappearing, and it has little to do with the religion. You need to read more books written by the Hindus themselves. Might I suggest, "What is Hinduism?" by Himalayan Academy.

I was a pandaram priest, so treated like a temple priest by some. To be fair, there are some who still hang onto caste as a construct, but generally they are the older folk. So there were a tiny few others that treated me with scorn, but they are really rare. Most people could care less, and to them, a white guy like me is just another devotee of Siva.

 

[Vinayaka]

Yes, one of the tribes of America’s first people is what my story (my people) is referencing too.

I'm truly sorry for your peoples' loss, and also for the knowledge lost to the rest of humanity. It's sad when smart stuff gets destroyed.

 

[Ignotus]

caste-system is not associated with religion, it is cultural product, christians in india also follows caste system. Fortunately, caste-system is getting fainted day by day.

Caste-system is not associated with religon? I didn't want to keep this up but I would love to hear your explanation of "Purush" and how the Rig Veda is not related to Hinduism. Send me a message so we don't derail this thread.

 

[Ignotus]

I'm a western adoptive, as are most of the Hindus on here. Like Nameless said, the whole idea of caste is disappearing, and it has little to do with the religion. You need to read more books written by the Hindus themselves. Might I suggest, "What is Hinduism?" by Himalayan Academy.

I was a pandaram priest, so treated like a temple priest by some. To be fair, there are some who still hang onto caste as a construct, but generally they are the older folk. So there were a tiny few others that treated me with scorn, but they are really rare. Most people could care less, and to them, a white guy like me is just another devotee of Siva.

Ok, I give in, this is too interesting not to want to know. How Is the caste system not related to religion when the different parts of Purush became what the caste represented? Are you saying that it was taken out of context for thousands of years?

 

[Vinayaka]

Caste-system is not associated with religon? I didn't want to keep this up but I would love to hear your explanation of "Purush" and how the Rig Veda is not related to Hinduism. Send me a message so we don't derail this thread.

Think 'guild'. That's more what the original varna system was. In Europe, 'guild' was something top be proud of ... until it deteriorated into 'class', because some guilds became more powerful, and used that power. There are parallels.

 

[Ignotus]

I'm truly sorry for your peoples' loss, and also for the knowledge lost to the rest of humanity. It's sad when smart stuff gets destroyed.

Thank you for the sentiments. I agree with you in whole.

 

[Ignotus]

Think 'guild'. That's more what the original varna system was. In Europe, 'guild' was something top be proud of ... until it deteriorated into 'class', because some guilds became more powerful, and used that power. There are parallels.

Very interesting, I often witnessed the notion that disassociation of caste and religion in India was creation through the upper caste for western ears. Though I never truly knew what was the truth on all this as I am not Indian, nor am I Hindu. This subject is incredibly interesting to me. I didn't mean for that question to go so far into discussion to take away what this thread was truly about. Sorry

 

[Vinayaka]

Thank you for the sentiments. I agree with you in whole.

Reading and knowing about that piece of nasty history is a prime motivating factor for me to speak out about conversion so strongly. It is everybody's loss when a species goes extinct, a language goes extinct, a faith gets extinguished.

Now you have me curious. Here where I'm from (Alberta, Canada) the closest thing to a Dalit is indeed first nations peoples. They are at the bottom of the heap here. So I'm wondering if there is a personal connection to the Dalit's plight on some emotional level?