Huge gap between humans and animals

[tas8831]

you just conceded the entire discussion....

thank you

I don't think you understood what he wrote.

 

[tas8831]

OK, selecting what?

If one is going to engage in this discussion, one should have a basic understanding of what they are arguing against, no?

Natural selection is basically an observation of differential reproductive success. Writing 'selection' is shorthand.

 

[tas8831]

Okay. Then explain how evolution is not accidental - using natural selection.

I might suggest you peruse this site for a bit:

Mechanisms: the processes of evolution

 

[Thief]

You still have not clarified this post. But then maybe you cants. I am still interested in the phrase " I eat the lesser forms"? "The lesser forms in the physical support this form in the physical" I suspect you are trying to place yourself above others but keeping it cryptic. Which is lesser the one that can support life or the one that can only consume life? Nothing is lesser when we are dependent on each other. That would truly be arrogance without understanding.

we saddle and bridle horses .....break their 'spirit'
they take us wherever we desire to go

we take the freedom to hunt in pack from the dog
we collar and chain the animal
we forbid he bite the hand that feeds him
and we expect loyalty

we cage little birds for their love song
that creature will never find the mate he sings for
no nest....no eggs....no offspring
he will die confined....in solitude

we kill bugs just because we don't like them

and God said to the angelic.....Man is created less than you
therefore .....seek after him that he not stub his toe nor dash his head

One third of heaven said .....nay
that Man is less.....he should be made to serve us

there is nothing wrong with that logic
we do so....unto anything less than us
even unto each other

to whom do we bear resemblance?

a fight broke out....swords drawn....brother angel against brother angel

one third of heaven lost their positions....
over an argument about something that looks like ......us
They want us dead

two thirds of heaven lost their brothers over that same argument
about us
They might not care.....
about us

and to whom do we bear resemblance?

to say anything less.....is naive

so I believe

 

[Thief]

I don't think you understood what he wrote.

oh yes I did

 

[Gridiron Man]

Natural selection doesn't have an 'end goal'.
Every off-spring has mutations, are you the same as your mum or dad? No, there will be differences, I have smaller ears than my Dad but I am taller. If I compare with my Grandfathers I am even more different, the last one I have a photo of is my Great granddad and the difference is even more stark. So the species is changing over time, and those changes are random in so much as you don't know what the changes might be.

But it is then that natural selection comes in. I the changes I've described in my family tree the changes are quite benign and will make little difference although you may argue that me being taller helped me get a mate.
However, let us look at giraffes; in the plains of Africa, food is scarce and the animals that have the longest necks can reach the most food. So when a random mutation gives an off-spring a slightly longer neck that off-spring does well. His brother may have been unlucky and had a mutation that gave him a shorter neck - maybe he died early because of starvation. So only longer necked animals are successful and breed.

You cannot show you have smaller ears or are taller because of a mutation. When you mix two different things together at roughly 50/50 you get variation. Interracial breeding is a good example.

On the giraffes, if the food is so scarce and hard to reach that longer necks are needed to survive, adolescent giraffes(it take a 4 years to reach full grown), that are shorter would never reach adult hood because they would be starved out by adults.

 

[Gridiron Man]

Yes variations occur, here's the proof

Mix any two different things and you get variation. You are nothing more than a chemical mixture.

Sodium and chlorine gives you salt. Nothing to do with mutations.

Hydrogen and oxygen gives you water. Nothing to do with mutations.

Red and yellow make orange. Nothing to do with mutations.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You cannot show you have smaller ears or are taller because of a mutation. When you mix two different things together at roughly 50/50 you get variation. Interracial breeding is a good example.

On the giraffes, if the food is so scarce and hard to reach that longer necks are needed to survive, adolescent giraffes(it take a 4 years to reach full grown), that are shorter would never reach adult hood because they would be starved out by adults.

Where do you think those differences came from in the first place?

 

[Gridiron Man]

Wow! We see variation in almost all species. If there was no variation there would be no need for genetic matching of people waiting for organ transplants.

variation exists. We don't all run at the same speed. We don't all have the same ability to lift weights. Name and trait and it will be varied.

DNA is our chemical structure. Mix any two together and you change the structure. You call it mutations when its nothing but a variation from the original. Its the result of mixing two different DNA's. Mixing two of anything gives variation. You are a mixture of your parents. You are a variation of what your parents are due to the mixture of their DNA. No mutations needed.

Salt isn't a mutation of sodium and chlorine, its a mixture of both chemicals. No mutation needed.

 

[Subduction Zone]

DNA is our chemical structure. Mix any two together and you change the structure. You call it mutations when its nothing but a variation from the original. Its the result of mixing two different DNA's. Mixing two of anything gives variation. You are a mixture of your parents. You are a variation of what your parents are due to the mixture of their DNA. No mutations needed.

Salt isn't a mutation of sodium and chlorine, its a mixture of both chemicals. No mutation needed.

DNA is not a"mixture". Once again, where do you think the variations came from?

 

[Gridiron Man]

DNA is not a"mixture". Once again, where do you think the variations came from?

Your DNA is not a mixture of your parents? DNA is a mixture of chemicals. You are a variation of your parents. No mutation needed.

Salt is not a mutation of sodium and chlorine. Its a mixture of those chemicals.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Your DNA is not a mixture of your parents? DNA is a mixture of chemicals. You are a variation of your parents. No mutation needed.

Salt is not a mutation of sodium and chlorine. Its a mixture of those chemicals.

You really have no clue. Learn what DNA is and then join the discussion.

 

[Gridiron Man]

You really have no clue. Learn what DNA is and then join the discussion.

DNA is nothing but a chemical mixture, a chemical structure. Mix any two different DNA's together and you get a chemical variation. No mutations needed.

 

[Gridiron Man]

You really have no clue. Learn what DNA is and then join the discussion.

DNA isn't magical. Its nothing more than a chemical mixture, a chemical structure. When you mix chemicals, you get variation. No mutation needed.
By definition is DNA life or part of the chemical reaction we call life?

 

[Subduction Zone]

DNA is nothing but a chemical mixture, a chemical structure. Mix any two different DNA's together and you get a chemical variation. No mutations needed.

Wrong try again.

Blue eyes and brown eyes are not due to a "mixture".

 

[Subduction Zone]

DNA isn't magical. Its nothing more than a chemical mixture, a chemical structure. When you mix chemicals, you get variation. No mutation needed.
By definition is DNA life or part of the chemical reaction we call life?

No one said that it is. I asked you where the variations that we can see came from and you told me that you have no clue at all as to what DNA is.

 

[Gridiron Man]

No one said that it is. I asked you where the variations that we can see came from and you told me that you have no clue at all as to what DNA is.

Don't be dishonest. I told you exactly what DNA is. Its a chemical structure. Its not magical.
Mix two different things together and you get a variation. Each of your parents' DNA is slightly different. Their DNA mixed to produce you. You are a variation of your parents. No mutation needed.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Don't be dishonest. I told you exactly what DNA is. Its a chemical structure. Its not magical.
Mix two different things together and you get a variation. Each of your parents' DNA is slightly different. Their DNA mixed to produce you. You are a variation of your parents. No mutation needed.

You have no clue and you cannot answer questions. DNA is not a "mixture". There are discreet genes within DNA. You cannot mix genes. And the DNA that you received from your parents has on the order of one hundred mutations in it.

 

[Gridiron Man]

You have no clue and you cannot answer questions. DNA is not a "mixture". There are discreet genes within DNA. You cannot mix genes. And the DNA that you received from your parents has on the order of one hundred mutations in it.

DNA is a chemical structure. Mix any two and you get a chemical variation. You are a variation of your parents DNA mixing, they are a variation of their parents DNA mixing, and so on. No mutations needed.
DNA is not life, but needed for life.
Water is not life, but needed for life.
Life is nothing but chemical reactions, DNA is noting more but chemicals in that reaction.

 

[Polymath257]

DNA is our chemical structure. Mix any two together and you change the structure. You call it mutations when its nothing but a variation from the original. Its the result of mixing two different DNA's. Mixing two of anything gives variation. You are a mixture of your parents. You are a variation of what your parents are due to the mixture of their DNA. No mutations needed.

Salt isn't a mutation of sodium and chlorine, its a mixture of both chemicals. No mutation needed.

No, mutations aren't from *mixing* the DNA, but from actual changes in the DNA. Furthermore, the DNA of a child is NOT just a *mixing* of the DNA from the parents: it is simply not true that *all* of the DNA from the parents appears in the children. In fact, the child's DNA is has about half the DNA from each parent.

So, no, I am *not* a mixture of my parents. I am a *merging* of them. But, in addition, there are mutations: actual changes in the DNA between what was in my parents and what is in me.

And no, salt is NOT a 'mixture' of sodium and chlorine: it is a chemical composition made from them. Again, that is a different thing than a mixture. Similarly, a mixture of hydrogen and oxygen gases is NOT the same as water vapor. They need to be chemically combined to make water.