I Can Not Respect A God who Allows Children to Suffer

[Just_me_Mike]

That sounds so wrong. Why do we need to be forgiven for the way that God made us?

On purpose.

That's the beauty of this, we don't!
God according to the bible is only going to save a select group. It is a selfish self serving God, that does things his way, according to his laws and justice. If anyone teaches anything different, they aren't reading the bible.

 

[painted wolf]

Jesus needed to come, because God set the world up so that man would fall, when man falls they will either fall for good and be destroyed or they will be saved. Problem is, once we fell we could never save ourselves. Hence all the sacrifices in the OT pointing to a perfect sacrifice to come.

Since I believe Jesus and God are one and the same, it harmonizes perfectly with the bible in that only God could actually save us. So God in order to show his love for us, took on human form and experienced our pain and punishment for us.

To complicate things more, Jesus did all the suffering and payment BEFORE the world was ever created, and when he came in AD/BC time period it was just a demonstration of what he had already done before the world began. That is completely supported from the language of the bible. There is NO church zero zilch that teaches that, as they are mostly bound by their dogma and theology.

In fact, Abraham or anyone from the OT could not have been saved if Jesus hadn't died before the world began. Salvation is the same for them as it is when Jesus came and demonstrated what he had already done.

Anyway, off topic, but there you go...

Bit Rube Goldberg don't you think?

wa:do

 

[Comicaze247]

Well first off, I cannot respect a "god" that I don't believe in For me, because I don't believe in him, he doesn't exist for me to respect him.

However, I will respect the concept of "god", and the fact that there are people who do believe in it. I can also respect what their belief in "God" does for them.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Bit Rube Goldberg don't you think?

wa:do

Amazing people call my ideas this or that, but I have no idea of these people. I just read the bible to come up with this stuff.

I take it that was an insult, but no worries, your one of my favs PW. You know why? You made me persevere and learn to like Jay a whole lot! Thanks...

 

[painted wolf]

Amazing people call my ideas this or that, but I have no idea of these people. I just read the bible to come up with this stuff.

I take it that was an insult, but no worries, your one of my favs PW. You know why? You made me persevere and learn to like Jay a whole lot! Thanks...

It wasn't meant as an insult... just an outside observation.

And you are quite welcome.

wa:do

 

[Just_me_Mike]

It wasn't meant as an insult... just an outside observation.

And you are quite welcome.

wa:do

I looked up Rube, and yeah I guess it is isn't it

 

[tarasan]

That's the beauty of this, we don't!
God according to the bible is only going to save a select group. It is a selfish self serving God, that does things his way, according to his laws and justice. If anyone teaches anything different, they aren't reading the bible.

nah mate I completely disagree with your hyper calvinistic interpretation XD

 

[Just_me_Mike]

nah mate I completely disagree with your hyper calvinistic interpretation XD

Provide the scripture or start another thread, explaining what you disagree with, and how the bible supports your views. Anytime :yes:

 

[Archer]

Amazing people call my ideas this or that, but I have no idea of these people. I just read the bible to come up with this stuff.

I take it that was an insult, but no worries, your one of my favs PW. You know why? You made me persevere and learn to like Jay a whole lot! Thanks...

This is a view that can be substantiated but it is not the whole story.

There is a group that believe they are the elect and have been chosen but that being the case why in the hell do I have to run them and their poison off when they bring their crap door to door. I guess they are just out lying because they believe there is no way in hell for me to know God.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

This is a view that can be substantiated but it is not the whole story.

There is a group that believe they are the elect and have been chosen but that being the case why in the hell do I have to run them and their poison off when they bring their crap door to door. I guess they are just out lying because they believe there is no way in hell for me to know God.

My take is any group or official group that institutionalizes has gone beyond arrogance and into stupidity. The idea that one person could understand the entire scripture enough to claim a denomination seems very opposite of what the bible seems to speak of.

In fact I am sure on the last day MANY are going to be surprised they do not get chosen. Me included, but I hope not...

Point being, church teaches if you do x and y, you are saved, a child of God, basically dictating to God when they get saved. Utter non-sense if one really examines the bible, so in that last day many in the church will be left wanting...

 

[Archer]

It says so right here:

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

 

[painted wolf]

In a book... what if the book is wrong?

wa:do

 

[Archer]

In a book... what if the book is wrong?

wa:do

What if it is not?

If wrong I have lost nothing and perhaps helped someone in their life. I die and my body lives on forever in the world and continues the great eternal circle.

If I am not wrong? Same thing but with a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

 

[MSizer]

What if it is not?

If wrong I have lost nothing and perhaps helped someone in their life. I die and my body lives on forever in the world and continues the great eternal circle.

If I am not wrong? Same thing but with a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

You make it sound so simple and benign, but it is anything but harmless. Beliefs foster behaviour, and religion fosters the upholding of faith against contradictory evidence. That is fundamentally dangerous.

 

[Archer]

You make it sound so simple and benign, but it is anything but harmless. Beliefs foster behaviour, and religion fosters the upholding of faith against contradictory evidence. That is fundamentally dangerous.

But that covers the entire spectrum. Atheist to fundamentalist. Terrorist to volunteer.

Any belief can be taken to the extreme. Look at Stalin!

It is very interesting that is it always the faithful that many bring up but what faith were the Japanese following? The Germans? The Russians? It is not about religion.

Please stop spreading hate because the fault is not with a faith it is with humanity.

 

[IF_u_knew]

I consider the explanation for the problem of evil using free will to be an ignorant one, but even if it were true, many innocent people, including children and non-human animals suffer as a result of things not caused by the free will of humans.

Babies were partially crushed and suffocated in collapsed buildings in Haity recently. A God who could allow such a thing is a horrific character IMO, and one to whom I could ever show any respect, no matter the consequences.

How do you justify worshipping a God who allegedly allows this?

God depends no more upon your respect of Him than does He depend on the worship of those around you. Suffering is a part of life. That it only gets worse is mankind's fault and not the fault of God. Don't like that people are suffering? Then do something to help ease the sufferings rather than placing the blame on God.

 

[MSizer]

God depends no more upon your respect of Him than does He depend on the worship of those around you. Suffering is a part of life. That it only gets worse is mankind's fault and not the fault of God. Don't like that people are suffering? Then do something to help ease the sufferings rather than placing the blame on God.

I'm sorry, I was busy on the morning that the hospital crushed Haitian newborns. I tried to make the first flight out before the quake, but my future telling device had not been working until it was too late.

If you can't see how an omnimax benevolent god is responsible for it, you've got some thinking to do.

 

[MSizer]

But that covers the entire spectrum. Atheist to fundamentalist. Terrorist to volunteer.

Any belief can be taken to the extreme. Look at Stalin!

It is very interesting that is it always the faithful that many bring up but what faith were the Japanese following? The Germans? The Russians? It is not about religion.

Please stop spreading hate because the fault is not with a faith it is with humanity.

You're missing my point. Yes, Hitler and Stalin were not reasonable men, absolutely true. But religion glorifies unreasonable beliefs. That's dangerous.

 

[Archer]

You're missing my point. Yes, Hitler and Stalin were not reasonable men, absolutely true. But religion glorifies unreasonable beliefs. That's dangerous.

No it glorifies faith. Faith is a strong thing do you have faith in anything?

 

[IF_u_knew]

I'm sorry, I was busy on the morning that the hospital crushed Haitian newborns. I tried to make the first flight out before the quake, but my future telling device had not been working until it was too late.

Excuses Excuses !!