If Jesus was God, explain this verse...

[sojourner]

No sources, no nothing. Just faith-based scholarship.

"Faith-based?" I don't understand. Reputable bible scholarship isn't "faith-based." It's an historic fact that Constantine made Christianity the state religion of Rome in 313 c.e. It's also a fact that the gospels were written prior to that date. Nothing "faith-based" about it.

 

[sojourner]

Jesus is not God, He is the Son of God, savior of mankind, He is the only way to the Father, no one gets to heaven but by Jesus, so for us humans He is God. He did pass the test, as you say which was'nt really a test, and made a way for the flesh which is sinful to enter heaven, To answer with logic is'nt logical , one must have faith. Jesus and the Father are one and the same in spirit.

Yikes! Sounds like theology according to Jack Daniels. :drunk:

 

[sojourner]

I'm sorry, but I'm not faith-based - I'm fact-based.

:biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh:

Oh! <gasp> <snort> Whew! ::wipes eyes:: ::gets up off floor:: ::reattaches a** that's been laughed off::

Thus far you've presented us with nothing factual except the fact that you appear to have been suckered in by some conspiracy-theory type web sites.


But perhaps you don't really have faith in them, either?:sarcastic

 

[Poeticus]

Namaste,

Lord Yeshua N'zareth > Yahweh

M.V.

:run:

 

[gzusfrk]

Yikes! Sounds like theology according to Jack Daniels. :drunk:

Its the theology of the new king james. I am not familiar with the theology of jack Daniels.

 

[rusra02]

No it doesn't. If it did, the council at Nicea wouldn't have come to the conclusion they did. When it comes to biblical exegesis, we ought to be wary of words like "obvious" and "clear." It's usually a sign that the one using those words hasn't done her or his homework.

So you believe a group of men presided over by a pagan emperor in the 4th century bears more authority than God's inspired Word. Since Constantine had enriched those Bishops, they would have done pretty nearly anything he asked, and they did. The common people of that time, whose pockets the emperor had not filled with gold, had no trouble understanding the relationship between God and his Son.

 

[Windwalker]

So you believe a group of men presided over by a pagan emperor in the 4th century bears more authority than God's inspired Word. Since Constantine had enriched those Bishops, they would have done pretty nearly anything he asked, and they did. The common people of that time, whose pockets the emperor had not filled with gold, had no trouble understanding the relationship between God and his Son.

This is full of errors and pure speculations. Constantine did not 'preside' over the council of Nicea. He merely told the bishops in essence, "you guys go figure this out, just come up with some standard we can pull the ranks in behind and administrate this whole thing". He had no theological voice. It was purely to bring a Roman-style administration into things, which is what happened.

And as far as the 'common people', the only reason the proto-orthodox groups which became the Catholic church proper took the day in this, is because they had in fact large followings. It's not like the masses believed something totally different, and suddenly they were forced to believe something entirely different. Yes, of course they were those who did, as there are today, but the point was to create a standard. Not to impose some foreign beliefs into this. They took the impetus of the stream and used it to standardize. They didn't create it.

 

[Monotheist 101]

BTW, if God is all-powerful, how is it impossible for God to become human? Logically, isn't that limiting God?

The way I look at it..human beings are imperfect...IMO God is always perfect.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Matthew 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

If Jesus was God, why was he tempted by the Devil? Can God be tempted by the Devil, his own creation?

Granted, he passed the test. But if he was God... Why was there a test in the first place? Does God need to test himself?

Are God and Jesus really one in the same? Please answer logically how this is possible given the verse above.

Satan is designed to test the mettle of humans. If God became man, then Satan was obligated to test him. And if Satan was obligated to test him, then imagine how his circuits would be scrambled after that event? Going from adversary of man to adversary of God all because of Jesus's dual nature.

I believe there is a reason Jesus "saw Satan fall as lightning from heaven", and not because it was antediluvian.

 

[sojourner]

Its the theology of the new king james. I am not familiar with the theology of jack Daniels.

"The New King James" doesn't have a theology. Theology is developed out of the bible, in part. Therefore, it's not "the theology of the New King James," it's the theology you've come up with; it makes no sense.

 

[sojourner]

So you believe a group of men presided over by a pagan emperor in the 4th century bears more authority than God's inspired Word.

I believe that the church leaders at Nicea were more astute about the tradition than you are.

 

[Aamer]

Jesus is not God, He is the Son of God, savior of mankind, He is the only way to the Father, no one gets to heaven but by Jesus, so for us humans He is God. He did pass the test, as you say which was'nt really a test, and made a way for the flesh which is sinful to enter heaven, To answer with logic is'nt logical , one must have faith. Jesus and the Father are one and the same in spirit.

"To us he is God" makes no sense. God means the creator. The one who created the heavens, the Earth, the Universe. That is the God I'm talking about. I see no biblical evidence that that God is Jesus. Or that they are the same. The whole Jesus is God in the flesh but is also the son of God is completely illogical. It's clear they are not the same, according to the Bible anyway. I can prove to you that the Bible doesn't support this popular man made fantasy of them being the same entity. Can you prove to me that they are? Using biblical verses only! Not opinions, theories or excuses.

 

[rusra02]

This is full of errors and pure speculations. Constantine did not 'preside' over the council of Nicea. He merely told the bishops in essence, "you guys go figure this out, just come up with some standard we can pull the ranks in behind and administrate this whole thing". He had no theological voice. It was purely to bring a Roman-style administration into things, which is what happened.

And as far as the 'common people', the only reason the proto-orthodox groups which became the Catholic church proper took the day in this, is because they had in fact large followings. It's not like the masses believed something totally different, and suddenly they were forced to believe something entirely different. Yes, of course they were those who did, as there are today, but the point was to create a standard. Not to impose some foreign beliefs into this. They took the impetus of the stream and used it to standardize. They didn't create it.

What you are saying is at odds with the following: “The Council of Nicaea met on May 20, 325 [C.E.]. Constantine himself presided, actively guiding the discussions, and personally proposed . . . the crucial formula expressing the relation of Christ to God in the creed issued by the council, ‘of one substance with the Father.’ . . . Overawed by the emperor, the bishops, with two exceptions only, signed the creed, many of them much against their inclination.”—Encyclopædia Britannica (1970), Volume 6, page 386.
Again fro the encyclopedia Britannica: “Neither the word Trinity nor the explicit doctrine appears in the New Testament . . . The doctrine developed gradually over several centuries and through many controversies.”

 

[Muffled]

Matthew 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

If Jesus was God, why was he tempted by the Devil? Can God be tempted by the Devil, his own creation?

Granted, he passed the test. But if he was God... Why was there a test in the first place? Does God need to test himself?

Are God and Jesus really one in the same? Please answer logically how this is possible given the verse above.

Mat 4:1 says that He was tempted of the Devil. The preposition men a lot. "by" would mean that He ws actually tempted; "of" means that the devil could only attempt to tempt Him.

Heb 4:15 For we have not a high priest that cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but one that hath been in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

God and Jesus are the same spirit. The body has no part in God. John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship in spirit and truth. Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

 

[gzusfrk]

"To us he is God" makes no sense. God means the creator. The one who created the heavens, the Earth, the Universe. That is the God I'm talking about. I see no biblical evidence that that God is Jesus. Or that they are the same. The whole Jesus is God in the flesh but is also the son of God is completely illogical. It's clear they are not the same, according to the Bible anyway. I can prove to you that the Bible doesn't support this popular man made fantasy of them being the same entity. Can you prove to me that they are? Using biblical verses only! Not opinions, theories or excuses.

Your statement is a little perplexing to me, since I believe they are not the same entity, there is the Father and there is the Son. This is the best I got,. 1 John chapter 2 verse 23, "Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father,the one who confesses the Son has the Father also".

 

[Awoon]

Matthew 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

If Jesus was God, why was he tempted by the Devil? Can God be tempted by the Devil, his own creation?

Granted, he passed the test. But if he was God... Why was there a test in the first place? Does God need to test himself?

Are God and Jesus really one in the same? Please answer logically how this is possible given the verse above.

It's funny that Jesus is in the wilderness by himself for 40 days rapping with Satan then comes out the winner of a test or temptation? Who was there with the video camera and tape recorder to prove any of it?

Also Jesus is never quoted in the Bible saying any of that happened.

 

[Aamer]

Your statement is a little perplexing to me, since I believe they are not the same entity, there is the Father and there is the Son. This is the best I got,. 1 John chapter 2 verse 23, "Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father,the one who confesses the Son has the Father also".

It sounds to me like whoever rejects Jesus does not have the support of God. And whoever accepts Jesus has the support of God. I don't think this verse in any way proves that Jesus and God are the same. But then again I must have misunderstood you earlier or confused you with someone else. I thought you were saying that they ARE the same.

 

[Aamer]

Mat 4:1 says that He was tempted of the Devil. The preposition men a lot. "by" would mean that He ws actually tempted; "of" means that the devil could only attempt to tempt Him.

Heb 4:15 For we have not a high priest that cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but one that hath been in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

God and Jesus are the same spirit. The body has no part in God. John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship in spirit and truth. Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

The "of" and "by" is the same in this case. It's only because King James is a poorly written, literal translation from the Greek in outdated English. Either way, God can not be tempted. God doesn't test himself. He's the creator. It's beneath him. And yes that's not my opinion. It's in the Bible.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Matthew 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

If Jesus was God, why was he tempted by the Devil? Can God be tempted by the Devil, his own creation?

Granted, he passed the test. But if he was God... Why was there a test in the first place? Does God need to test himself?

Are God and Jesus really one in the same? Please answer logically how this is possible given the verse above.

This is an old question thepeccabilityversustheimpeccabilityofChris.

 

[Katzpur]

Matthew 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

If Jesus was God, why was he tempted by the Devil? Can God be tempted by the Devil, his own creation?

God the Father was the Creator of the Devil, not Jesus Christ.

Are God and Jesus really one in the same? Please answer logically how this is possible given the verse above.

No they are not. One is the Father and the other is the Son and the Son is not the Father.