If there is a life after death.....

[Little Dragon]

I believe that there will be another life after this life is over, but it will not be in this world. It will be in the spiritual world.

You know what. I think you might be right. This world is very very strange.

 

[Trailblazer]

I was lucky, I was never indoctrinated as a child. My father was firmly against religious belief and I was privately educated until my teenage years. I didn't know what Easter was about until I was 16 I think. When my new school did Easter celebration stuff, which included the resurrection story.

I was also lucky since I was never indoctrinated as a child, not into any religion. Both my parents were raised as Christians but they both dropped out long before their children were born. All I know about Easter was that we got to go eat a fancy dinner at the college cafeteria. I don't know when I learned what Easter was celebrating. I never even thought about it until much later into adulthood. I know nobody believes me, but I never even read one page of the Bible until about 11 years ago.

For one year of high school my mother took me out of public school and sent me to a Catholic school. That was pretty scary for me since I had no idea what was going on. The next year my mother put me back into a public school, where the students were predominantly Jewish, but nobody talked about religion there.

 

[Trailblazer]

You know what. I think you might be right. This world is very very strange.

I think that the spiritual world will seem strange to us since the only world we have ever known is the material world.
Going from this world into the spiritual world can be likened to a baby being born from the womb into this world, lots of surprises!
I think we will get used to it since we will have no choice but it is still scary to me since I don't like change, even a good change.

 

[Bird123]

I beg to differ .. we are all sinners .. and sin leads to suffering of ourselves and others.


G-d is not a person.
We effectively imprison ourselves.

So a Being capable of creating Universes sits down one day and decides I'm going to create Billions of sinners so they can suffer and hurt.

Does your Math really add up? Religion labels everyone as damaged, sinners or rotten so that you need them to fix you. Is this really goodness that they are teaching? Teaching this from childhood, many hold onto this view for a lifetime. Are you a rotten sinner for your entire life? If so, doesn't this make your god come up lacking in so many ways?

Compare your view to what is actually going on.
A Being capable of creating Universes decides to create children. Why? God know what most parents know. Children make life Grand!!

God wants His children to acquire Great wisdom and knowledge. One can tell their children what to do ,however one learns best through experience and their own free choices. If one's choice is not free, one would just choose to do the opposite when one did acquire free choice just to Discover what those choices really mean.

God creates a Time-based causal universe because the results of choices can teach His children what the Best choices really are. This physical universe was never created for God. It is for US!!

Wisdom is acquired along the journey to Discover knowledge. All choices and every side of all choices must be available to be chosen. God will return our choices not as punishment, but in order that one Discovers what our choices really mean.

God counts on His children to make some bad choices. More is learned through bad choices than almost any other thing. One learns what not to do.

In God's world, God makes a multilevel classroom because kiddies can teach kiddies. God wants interaction. If one refuses interaction, one gets lonely. The dimensions of Gender create many sided interaction. Adversity and challenges create a need to learn, grow and move forward. The dimensions and dynamics of God's world for us are amazing.

There is way too much to learn in one mere lifetime. Kiddies will experience it all through many lifetimes with many parameters. In time, kiddies with Discover what the Best choices really are. Each will be able to create a Heavenly state not only for themselves but for others.

God's system also teaches kiddies to Love Unconditionally. In time, one will realize that If God is going to return our choices that Unconditional Love is what one really wants to return. Unconditional Love is the basis of all the best choices. Unconditional Love doesn't just give the other everything they want. Unconditional Love always does what is Best for the other.

How does God really see His children? They are Wonderful Works of Art!! There is no one in the Universe Like them nor will there ever be. They are all Loved and very special in God's eyes.


So which is God? Which is High Intelligence? Which is the Higher Level? Which really leads to a Heavenly state in reality?

Mankind values so many petty things that do not lead to a Higher Level. Question everything. We are all meant to Think rather than blindly accept and follow.

Don't you want your children to be able to stand on their two feet filled with Wisdom and Knowledge making the Best choices? God is leading His children to that High Level. I say If you see others making bad choices, do not hate, judge, condemn, wrath, anger, revenge, or pay back, but through Love and Kindness teaching and guiding them to the Best choices which will bring the Best results for all. If you value those petty things mankind holds so dear like they are evil rotten or even sinners, what will you be teaching the kiddies? It certainly isn't goodness!!

That's what I see. It's very very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

Of course.

When it comes to specifics, you've been saying precisely nothing all along ─ a thing I've constantly pointed out to you, though you appear to do nothing with the knowledge.

And as I've said in the past, discover WHAT answers? WHAT is the question to which this thing you speak of is the answer?

But you've never addressed the questions that matter ─ such as

Does God exist in reality, the world external to the self which we know about via our senses?

If so, where in reality may God be found and interviewed?

If not then God exists only as a concept, notion, thing imagined in an individual brain, no?

Please explain those matters and make them clear to me, and please don't go wafting off into vague nothings as has been your past practice.

Please bird123 make it fit in my box of beliefs. More reality exists beyond your box of Beliefs. The answers exist outside your box. When will you be brave enough to venture into Undiscovered country in order to see what is out there? If you limit your view to your Beliefs, how can you ever Discover anything new.?

What I have said to you now and in the past will always be vague when you refuse to see or even look. In the event you simply do not understand anything I have been telling you, then you just must be patient. One must learn how to crawl before one can walk. One must also look up and forward with the widest of views instead of a limited box shielding you from everything around you.

Perhaps, a good starting point for you is to Discover who you really are. You are a Spiritual being trapped in a physical body. Think!! Figure it out. Discover who you really are.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[muhammad_isa]

Does your Math really add up? Religion labels everyone as damaged, sinners or rotten so that you need them to fix you..

Religions can't "fix you" .. only G-d can do that, if you choose to draw closer.

Are you a rotten sinner for your entire life?

rotten???
We all continually sin .. but sin comes in many "shapes and sizes".
The important thing, is to ask for forgiveness, and not be proud and arrogant.

If you value those petty things mankind holds so dear like they are evil rotten or even sinners, what will you be teaching the kiddies? It certainly isn't goodness!!

Believers do not all think alike, and some are more knowledgeable than others.
It is not a case of putting down others, and thinking you are pure..
..as I say, we are ALL sinners.

 

[Bird123]

God also guides people who are sincere seekers, those who make an effort for God and His Messengers.

“Whoso maketh efforts for Us,” he shall enjoy the blessings conferred by the words: “In Our Ways shall We assuredly guide him.””
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 266-267

If I state the Truth and you do not like the Truth, Any reaction of feeling you or anyone else has is created not by me. If you feel pain, pain is a sign something is wrong? What could that be? Truth must conform to whatever you want it to be and it doesn't.

You forget, I am not dealing with Beliefs nor feelings around beliefs. Further, I carry no EGO issues as you about being right.

MATH!!! It must add up!!! It is about What Is.

I have experienced no pain, anger, hate, or control petty issues.
You have all my Love and Kindness regardless of any of your choices or beliefs. I'm unconditional. If I can be unconditional, why would you think God isn't?

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Trailblazer]

You forget, I am not dealing with Beliefs nor feelings around beliefs.

You are dealing with Beliefs, since beliefs are all you have.

Further, I carry no EGO issues as you about being right.

I carry no EGO issues about being right. I just believe what I believe, just as you believe what you believe.

 

[Saved by grace 2]

In my opinion, we don't need to believe in the Abrahamic God in order to be moral people or to experience peace in the afterlife. In fact, I don't believe in the static location of a heaven or hell, and I reject the notion that we sin against this God and hence deserve to be condemned to hell for all eternity. As a former Christian, I learned to let go of what I consider the fearmongering tactics of Christianity (fear God, sinning against God, going to hell). And once I did that, my mental health and emotional well-being significantly improved. It was a slow process of detoxing from a lifetime of Christian indoctrination, but I finally experienced inner peace in my life, which is something I never experienced as a Christian. For the record, I was a devout evangelical Christian for thirty years and genuinely believed in God for a decade before I converted to Christianity at the age of seventeen. I was also a street preacher and an evangelical team leader for many years, while I was a Christian as well. I was deeply indoctrinated in Christianity, so it was difficult for me to be freed of it.

True Christianity in ones life begins with Being flooded with God's love, and his peace., thru receiving forgiveness of sins and then the we receive the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit whom is Love, Joy Peace, Kindness, goodness, gentleness, etc.. Our part is to believe (have Faith) in The Lord Jesus Christ and to repent (turn from our ways, and surrender to God). Real Christianity is about relationship. God reveals himself to the individual in such a powerful way that there can and will never be anything nor anyone who can sway them from the truth. and that would cause one to reject God. It does not mean we don't struggle in our faith at times, and we can sometimes have doubts at times, but Always the Holy Spirit convicts us, and reminds us who we are in Christ. And restores us to fellowship with our Loving father thru his conviction, his Love and his Peace. I pray that Holy SPIRIT will bring you to a true faith in Jesus Christ. We are saved by Grace thru Faith and Kept in Fellowship with God thru Faith and God's Grace.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

True Christianity in ones life begins with Being flooded with God's love, and his peace., thru receiving forgiveness of sins and then the we receive the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit whom is Love, Joy Peace, Kindness, goodness, gentleness, etc.. Our part is to believe (have Faith) in The Lord Jesus Christ and to repent (turn from our ways, and surrender to God). Real Christianity is about relationship. God reveals himself to the individual in such a powerful way that there can and will never be anything nor anyone who can sway them from the truth. and that would cause one to reject God. It does not mean we don't struggle in our faith at times, and we can sometimes have doubts at times, but Always the Holy Spirit convicts us, and reminds us who we are in Christ. And restores us to fellowship with our Loving father thru his conviction, his Love and his Peace. I pray that Holy SPIRIT will bring you to a true faith in Jesus Christ. We are saved by Grace thru Faith and Kept in Fellowship with God thru Faith and God's Grace.

Kindly keep your preaching and proselytizing to yourself. I'm not interested in being lectured about Christianity. And you might consider reviewing Rule 8 of the forum rules, which prohibits preaching and proselytizing. It could save you from being reported for it if you followed its specific guidelines.

 

[Trailblazer]

MATH!!! It must add up!!! It is about What Is.

What is is What is according to you, so it is an ego projection. You totally miss that.

 

[Dimi95]

You are dealing with Beliefs, since beliefs are all you have.

So do you , since belief is not all you have.

I carry no EGO issues about being right. I just believe what I believe, just as you believe what you believe.

"If you find yourself relating to the following point, it's likely that your ego is at the wheel:
*You have a persistent need to be right during arguments. "

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

You are dealing with Beliefs, since beliefs are all you have.

Personal beliefs are what everyone in this thread has, despite some attempts to piously state their beliefs as if they were definitive facts.

I just believe what I believe, just as you believe what you believe.

That, in my opinion, is the right attitude to have compared to someone stating their personal religious beliefs as if they were irrefutable facts.

 

[Trailblazer]

So do you , since belief is not all you have.

I know that all I have are beliefs. The difference between me and @Bird123 is that I admit that is all I have.
He denies that is what he has and calls his beliefs knowledge.

"If you find yourself relating to the following point, it's likely that your ego is at the wheel:
*You have a persistent need to be right during arguments. "

I just believe what I believe and it is either true or false. I do not insist that it is true.
I have no need to be right. Beliefs cannot be proven right or wrong.

 

[blü 2]

Perhaps, a good starting point for you is to Discover who you really are. You are a Spiritual being trapped in a physical body.

Question 1: Please define "a spiritual being" for me.

Question 2: What objective test will distinguish this "spiritual being" from an imaginary one?

 

[Saved by grace 2]

Kindly keep your preaching and proselytizing to yourself. I'm not interested in being lectured about Christianity. And you might consider reviewing Rule 8 of the forum rules, which prohibits preaching and proselytizing. It could save you from being reported for it if you followed its specific guidelines.

I thought This was a Religious Forum to discuss similarites and yes differences. And my intent was to help you not hurt nor anger you.. Telling you the truth is my purpose.
But I am dumbfounded that you are here on this site that discusses religion and are offended when someone tallks and defends their Christian beliefs which you made clear you rejected. You reject Christianity. I stand by it, This is the true Faith by which I believe with my whole being! These are my beliefs! Not because I simply read it and believe but because I was transformed by the Power of God and then later read in Romans 8:16 That "the Spirit of God witnesses with our Spirit that we are Children of God". God reveals himself to those that belong to him. This is the Word of God.

 

[Dimi95]

Kindly keep your preaching and proselytizing to yourself. I'm not interested in being lectured about Christianity. And you might consider reviewing Rule 8 of the forum rules, which prohibits preaching and proselytizing. It could save you from being reported for it if you followed its specific guidelines.

Just as his interpretation is some form of preaching so is yours, but you don't consider your interpretation as such.Rather , you point at rules,when you don't like the answer.

Why bother about it , when you left it?

 

[Dimi95]

I know that all I have are beliefs. The difference between me and @Bird123 is that I admit that is all I have.
He denies that is what he has and calls his beliefs knowledge.

As do I.

How can knowledge be defined?

I just believe what I believe and it is either true or false. I do not insist that it is true.
I have no need to be right. Beliefs cannot be proven right or wrong.

Science can be proven right , and so the procces of evolution? Or?

 

[Little Dragon]

I was transformed by the Power of God

Indeed? Care to discuss how exactly?

 

[Little Dragon]

Just as his interpretation is some form of preaching so is yours, but you don't consider your interpretation as such.Rather , you point at rules,when you don't like the answer.

Why bother about it , when you left it?

One can always add, IMO. After any claim about the natures and wills of God(s) and their relationships with mankind. That will not violate rule 8.