I'm against abortion myself, but....

[doppelganger]

Well, I just know I have heard women who have admitted to having abortions past 4 months. If laws have changes, it seems to be more by state than anything.

Right, they are legal in a few states (though very rare even at that). And, of course, there are still illegal late term abortions even in states that outlaw them . . . :cover: . . . which is really dangerous.

 

[Draka]

Here's another link that does describe that there are, in fact, procedures for all terms during the pregnancy.

Abortion Procedures : American Pregnancy Association

 

[Draka]

Right, they are legal in a few states (though very rare even at that). And, of course, there are still illegal late term abortions even in states that outlaw them . . . :cover: . . . which is really dangerous.

I just wish that no one would even consider such a thing. If, perhaps, medical science hadn't come up with these neat little sick ways of aborting a 6 month or 7 month old fetus, then perhaps it wouldn't be attempted as much. I just don't understand why, at that point, they just don't give birth and give up the child if they don't want it that much anyway. Why go and do something gruesome like that?

 

[doppelganger]

I just wish that no one would even consider such a thing. If, perhaps, medical science hadn't come up with these neat little sick ways of aborting a 6 month or 7 month old fetus, then perhaps it wouldn't be attempted as much. I just don't understand why, at that point, they just don't give birth and give up the child if they don't want it that much anyway. Why go and do something gruesome like that?

I would suspect for one or both of the following reasons: (1) they don't have as visceral a response to the gruesomeness of it that you and I have; and/or, (2) they are in circumstances such as fear or pain that are experienced as severe enough to take precedence over whatever visceral reaction or the other potential consequences they anticipate having .

 

[DallasApple]

In Texas you can abort up to 25 weeks.But after 15 weeks you can not simply go to an abortion clinic.It has to be done in an "ambulatory" surgical center or a hospital.25 weeks is 6months pregnant.

Blessings

Dallas

 

[logician]

I just wish that no one would even consider such a thing. If, perhaps, medical science hadn't come up with these neat little sick ways of aborting a 6 month or 7 month old fetus, then perhaps it wouldn't be attempted as much. I just don't understand why, at that point, they just don't give birth and give up the child if they don't want it that much anyway. Why go and do something gruesome like that?

How many women really wait this long to abort? It would seem most would be done very early on. A lot of women want to abort before it is even generally know they are pregnant.

 

[Quiddity]

Wousers, glad I wasn't part of this one. :run:

 

[MEMNOCK]

The whole abortion argument comes down to just another example of human arogance and ignorance. Do we call an acorn an oak tree? Do we call energy particles in space a star? No we don't...but through our own self species glorification, humans are above everything else. The bottom line is it should be left to the person who will eventually give life to it. Everyone else who believes otherwise needs to be beaten and crucified. Isn't that what happened to the last guy who wanted to save everyone from sin?

 

[Draka]

How many women really wait this long to abort? It would seem most would be done very early on. A lot of women want to abort before it is even generally know they are pregnant.

True, it happens in less than 1% of all abortions, BUT that's still a few thousand done every year in the U.S. May be a low number in the grand scheme of things, but it's still too high for me.

 

[MEMNOCK]

I just wish that no one would even consider such a thing. If, perhaps, medical science hadn't come up with these neat little sick ways of aborting a 6 month or 7 month old fetus, then perhaps it wouldn't be attempted as much. I just don't understand why, at that point, they just don't give birth and give up the child if they don't want it that much anyway. Why go and do something gruesome like that?

I do agree with that Draka, once the fetus can survive outside the womb it is no longer a fetus but a baby. I only support the early stage abortions.

 

[Father Heathen]

In my opinion, I believe murder is the killing of a sentient, conscious, thinking, self-aware being. This excludes zygotes, embryos, etc. Besides, it would be nice if all that compassion and concern was shifted over to the millions upon millions of real, actual, already born children out in the world who are abused, neglected, starving, etc.

 

[Draka]

In my opinion, I believe murder is the killing of a sentient, conscious, thinking, self-aware being. This excludes zygotes, embryos, etc. Besides, it would be nice if all that compassion and concern was shifted over to the millions upon millions of real, actual, already born children out in the world who are abused, neglected, starving, etc.

Careful with the self-aware thing. Some people will be more than happy to point out that some scientists say that a child is not self-aware until at least two years old. I happen to disagree with that, but so I've been told.

 

[rheff78]

ALright, I've been out of picket for a few days. Sorry. TO get back to the OP. I understand what all the pro-choicers are trying to say. Draka, I know pro-choice sounds like anti-life or something like that. The titles aren't really great. You could use what Soyleche and I have come up with if you want. No, pro-choice does not mean anti-life. It means you support the right of a woman to choose to terminate a pregnancy. If you wouldn't ever do it, I applaud you you. Great. BUT, if you think a woman has the right to choose than that makes you pro-choice. Again, what you would do personally is irrelevant. It's what you support that matters. There is no I'm pro life personally but. No. You either support the right to choose or not. There's not gray area. Or chartrues or ack with white polka dots. Black or white. Do you or don't you?

 

[logician]

The real point is that is it's the woman's beliefs that are important, not someone else's, some religion's , or a nanny state. The woman has a right to control her own body.

 

[rheff78]

SO that would obviously make you pro choice. You're right, those are her beliefs. If she believes she has a right, or any other woman to abort a pregnancy, she is pro choice.

 

[Magic Man]

Rheff, there is gray area. That's all there is to it. Not everybody feels the need to categorize everyone into two groups. There's more to it than one yes or no question.

 

[rheff78]

I would usually agree with you. Most people can't be lumped into nice neat little groups. But, IMO, there is no gray area on this subject. You either support the right to choose or not.

 

[Magic Man]

I would usually agree with you. Most people can't be lumped into nice neat little groups. But, IMO, there is no gray area on this subject. You either support the right to choose or not.

And that's fine. When someone makes the statement that started this thread, then you can say to yourself "I consider that person to be pro-choice". There might be more to it for them, and so they hesitate to call themselves pro-choice. If you want to label them that way for your own benefit, then go ahead, but they don't have to themselves, and there's no reason to want to make people categorize themselves without an exception.

 

[rheff78]

Well obviously. Hey, I did make at least on person understand my point of view. Anyway, like I was saying even though THEY don't categorize themselves that way, that's the way they are. It's like this. Do you support our right to own guns or not? You either do or don't. You can't say I dno't personally want to own a gun, but I dno't care if otehrs do. Than you support the right to own a gun. There's no gray area there. The same applies here.

 

[Magic Man]

Well obviously. Hey, I did make at least on person understand my point of view. Anyway, like I was saying even though THEY don't categorize themselves that way, that's the way they are. It's like this. Do you support our right to own guns or not? You either do or don't. You can't say I dno't personally want to own a gun, but I dno't care if otehrs do. Than you support the right to own a gun. There's no gray area there. The same applies here.

That's like saying "They don't categorize themselves as immoral, but that's the way they are." That's only the way they are to you. Others don't see it that way. I probably have a different set of morals than you do. If I do something that I don't consider immoral, but you do consider immoral, then I'm only immoral to anyone who shares your set of morals, or at least that particular one. To all others, I'm not immoral. You realize that no matter how many times you say that there's no gray area, it's not going to magically become true, right?