Jesus is not God

[Jimmy]

Yes, “the way” to Whom?
John 14:6 continues (NIV):
“No one comes to the Father except through me.”

And Who taught him that truth?

At John 8:28,29, Jesus said, “I do nothing of my own initiative; but just as the Father taught me, I speak these things. 29 And the One who sent me is with me; he did not abandon me to myself, because I always do the things pleasing to him.”

Even that, Jesus said, was “granted” by the Father to him. (John 5:26….”For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted also to the Son to have life in himself.”
As Jesus further stated at Matthew 28:18 (after his resurrection): “ All authority has been given me in heaven and on earth.”
If Jesus was God, he would have had the authority from the beginning.

It’s not a wise move to take what belongs to Jesus’ God and attribute it to Jesus.

And by the way, I’m not “a Jehovah“ (that’s similar to if I said, “you’re a Jesus”); I am just one of His servants / witnesses / people, trying to follow & imitate His Son, ie., be a Christian, the best I can.

Hey, at least we agree on evolution!

Take care.

I don’t think evolution happened. I’m no longer Christian and believe the world began around 1980.
Post in thread 'Should I Remain Christian Or Revert To My Old Path?'
Should I Remain Christian Or Revert To My Old Path?

 

[Ignatius A]

I don’t think evolution happened. I’m no longer Christian and believe the world began around 1980.
Post in thread 'Should I Remain Christian Or Revert To My Old Path?'
Should I Remain Christian Or Revert To My Old Path?

You think the world began in 1980? So then where was I in the 60s and the 70s?

 

[Jimmy]

You think the world began in 1980? So then where was I in the 60s and the 70s?

Wherever the memory tells ya

 

[Ignatius A]

Wherever the memory tells ya

But if the world didn't exist I couldn't have existed so how could I have memories?

 

[Jimmy]

But if the world didn't exist I couldn't have existed so how could I have memories?

God gave them To ya obviously just as he gave you your life

 

[Ignatius A]

God gave them To ya obviously just as he gave you your life

Oh i see you were born in 1980.

 

[Jimmy]

Oh i see you were born in 1980.

No

 

[Trailblazer]

Does anyone want to see my list?
of over a hundred times the New Testament, uses the word [ son ] in reference to Jesus, and the word [ father ] in reference to his father in heaven.

I'd like to see your list, but don't go to any extra trouble for me because I already know that the Son is not the Father.
Any logical person would know that even without the New Testament.

 

[YoursTrue]

I'd like to see your list, but don't go to any extra trouble for me because I already know that the Son is not the Father.
Any logical person would know that even without the New Testament.

To be honest, before I studied with Jehovah's Witnesses I heard about Jesus -- I knew people celebrated Christmas (I was Jewish) -- wondered why they had Christmas celebrations at public school and not Chanukah or other religious things -- I knew very little about Jesus. (Christmas celebrations sure didn't explain anything.) So when I learned what the Scriptures said I was very happy. Take care. Thanks for your comment.
(Oh, and P.S. as a paid singer in a very large church I saw Jesus hanging on the wall on a cross and wondered whatever did he do to deserve that? -- no one explained it to me until I studied with Jehovah's Witnesses.)

 

[Ignatius A]

I'd like to see your list, but don't go to any extra trouble for me because I already know that the Son is not the Father.
Any logical person would know that even without the New Testament.

Correct the son isn't the father but he is God. Any true believer would know that.

 

[Trailblazer]

Jesus said he was. That's in the bible btw

Where does Jesus say "I am God?"

 

[Trailblazer]

John 14: 9. You need to wake up

Wake up and smell the coffee.
That is NOT Jesus saying that He is God the Father, that is only what YOU think it means.
A multitude of other verses show that Jesus is NOT God.

John 14
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

"he that hath seen me hath seen the Father" does not mean that Jesus was the Father. It means that Jesus was a mirror image of the Father.


Please note that Colossians 1:15 says that God is invisible.
Jesus was visible so that is one way we know that Jesus was not God.

The attributes of God became visible in Jesus.
Jesus was a perfect reflection of God, a mirror image of God, but not God incarnate.

Colossians 1

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

What is the Bible definition of image?

In Hebrew, the word translated "image" is not "a deceptive illusion." Rather, image means "the likeness of one subject expressed in another." This difference is important. It means, "the likeness of one subject, God, expressed in the other, man." The verse indirectly says that man is very much like God.

What the Bible says about Image

 

[Trailblazer]

Correct the son isn't the father but he is God. Any true believer would know that.

The Father is God. The Son is the Son of God.
Anyone who was not duped by the Trinity doctrine would know that.

There is no such thing as 'God the Son' in the Bible

 

[Ignatius A]

Where does Jesus say "I am God?"

It means just what he

Wake up and smell the coffee.
That is NOT Jesus saying that He is God the Father, that is only what YOU think it means.
A multitude of other verses show that Jesus is NOT God.

John 14
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

"he that hath seen me hath seen the Father" does not mean that Jesus was the Father. It means that Jesus was a mirror image of the Father.


Please note that Colossians 1:15 says that God is invisible.
Jesus was visible so that is one way we know that Jesus was not God.

The attributes of God became visible in Jesus.
Jesus was a perfect reflection of God, a mirror image of God, but not God incarnate.

Colossians 1

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

What is the Bible definition of image?

In Hebrew, the word translated "image" is not "a deceptive illusion." Rather, image means "the likeness of one subject expressed in another." This difference is important. It means, "the likeness of one subject, God, expressed in the other, man." The verse indirectly says that man is very much like God.

What the Bible says about Image

Jesus said just want he means. If you have seen me you have seen the father. Who is the father?

 

[Ignatius A]

The Father is God. The Son is the Son of God.
Anyone who was not duped by the Trinity doctrine would know that.

There is no such thing as 'God the Son' in the Bible

God the father God the son God the Holy Spirit.

For years I've dealt with people like this that can read but can't understand.

John 1: 1 John 1: 14.

 

[walt]

Wake up and smell the coffee.
That is NOT Jesus saying that He is God the Father, that is only what YOU think it means.
A multitude of other verses show that Jesus is NOT God.

John 14
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

"he that hath seen me hath seen the Father" does not mean that Jesus was the Father. It means that Jesus was a mirror image of the Father.


Please note that Colossians 1:15 says that God is invisible.
Jesus was visible so that is one way we know that Jesus was not God.

The attributes of God became visible in Jesus.
Jesus was a perfect reflection of God, a mirror image of God, but not God incarnate.

Colossians 1

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

What is the Bible definition of image?

In Hebrew, the word translated "image" is not "a deceptive illusion." Rather, image means "the likeness of one subject expressed in another." This difference is important. It means, "the likeness of one subject, God, expressed in the other, man." The verse indirectly says that man is very much like God.

What the Bible says about Image

I agree with you 100%

King James Bible
John 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

The first scripture says not seen the second scripture says seen it is obvious we cannot determine Jesus Is God from these two scriptures!

 

[Ignatius A]

I agree with you 100%

King James Bible
John 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

The first scripture says not seen the second scripture says seen it is obvious we cannot determine Jesus Is God from these two scriptures!

So Jesus lied when he said if you have seen me you have seen the father? And John lied when he wrote that the word was God and that the word became flesh and dwelt among us?

 

[walt]

Yes, I would wholeheartedly agree… but you are referring to the earthly manifestation of The Word as a man. The one who: AMPC Phil 2:6 Who, although being essentially one with God and in the form of God [possessing the fullness of the attributes which make God God], did not think this equality with God was a thing to be eagerly grasped or retained, 7 But stripped Himself [of all privileges and rightful dignity], so as to assume the guise of a servant (slave), in that He became like men and was born a human being. 8 And after He had appeared in human form,

However, as The Word - The Eternal - Emmanuel - God with us - it is a different story.

Remember, you are a tri-part being - spirit, soul and body. Your spirit is the greatest, then your soul and lastly your body but all of you is still one.

The Trinity is developed in the third and fourth century.. their creeds and the documentation explain:

• The Father, the Son and the holy spirit are one God co-equal and co-eternal. this is Never Said by Jesus, by any Apostle, by any of Jesus friends, by any people that did not agree with him, by anyone in the entire Bible from Genesis to Revelation.
• First I listen to Jesus instructions: Jesus calls himself the son of God and explains this belief, Jesus says my father who is in heaven and this and the Bible uses the words son for Jesus and father for God over 100 times in the New Testament.
• Jesus gives details of who the Father is in his prayer at John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
• The Trinity is something you have to figure out to be true, it is not a specific instruction or teaching by Jesus! I start with Jesus!

 

[Ignatius A]

The Trinity is developed in the third and fourth century.. their creeds and the documentation explain:

• The Father, the Son and the holy spirit are one God co-equal and co-eternal. this is Never Said by Jesus, by any Apostle, by any of Jesus friends, by any people that did not agree with him, by anyone in the entire Bible from Genesis to Revelation.
• first I listen to Jesus instructions: Jesus calls himself the son of God and explains this belief, Jesus says my father who is in heaven and this and the Bible uses the words son for Jesus and father for God over 100 times in the New Testament.
• Jesus gives details of who the Father is in his prayer at John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
• The Trinity is something you have to figure out to be true, it is not a specific instruction or teaching by Jesus! I start with Jesus!

That's when it was properly understood but the Trinity has existed forever.

 

[walt]

That's when it was properly understood but the Trinity has existed forever.

• First Prayer and I listen to Jesus words alone, to form my beliefs.
• Second I listen to the words in the rest of the New Testament to form my beliefs. [ making sure if I can, the belief agrees with Jesus words ]

May I ask you how you do it please?