Jesus

[sojourner]

If Jesus was indeed in Heaven with the Father before His emergence in the flesh, then why has God always emphatically declared that there is no God besides Him? I just don't see how God would change. God is the same yesterday, today and forever.

How does the existence of Christ negate God as God? Who wrote the part of the Bible where they had God say that there is no God besides God? someone to whom God Incarnate had not been revealed, perhaps? One can only talk about God from one's own perspective. God had not revealed God's self as incarnate at the time of that particular writing, so how could the writer have known anything about God, other than what he knew?

 

[may]

If Jesus was indeed in Heaven with the Father before His emergence in the flesh, then why has God always emphatically declared that there is no God besides Him? I just don't see how God would change. God is the same yesterday, today and forever.

you are right God has not changed he will always be the true God psalm 83;18 and Jesus never claimed to be God , listening to false teachers does not lead to everlasting life , but listening to Jesus does , and he never claimed to be God, he said he was Gods son John 10;36 sticking to what Jesus taught is the way to go and if religious leaders teach otherwise then it is false teachings not based on Gods word the bible. i have found a faithful class of people who are really faithful to Jesus matthew 24;45-47 and Jesus is blessing them with all his belongings. why? because they are faithful and they have not watered down and corupted his teachings .they are faithful ones .

 

[sojourner]

you are right God has not changed he will always be the true God psalm 83;18 and Jesus never claimed to be God , listening to false teachers does not lead to everlasting life , but listening to Jesus does , and he never claimed to be God, he said he was Gods son John 10;36 sticking to what Jesus taught is the way to go and if religious leaders teach otherwise then it is false teachings not based on Gods word the bible. i have found a faithful class of people who are really faithful to Jesus matthew 24;45-47 and Jesus is blessing them with all his belongings. why? because they are faithful and they have not watered down and corupted his teachings .they are faithful ones .

It's all in your hermeneutics. You've found a group of people whose hermeneutics agree with your own. That's great! It's sad, however, that you all can't seem to allow others a different hermeneutic. Most Christians, historically, buy into the exegesis of the Trinity from scripture.

 

[may]

It's all in your hermeneutics. You've found a group of people whose hermeneutics agree with your own. That's great! It's sad, however, that you all can't seem to allow others a different hermeneutic. Most Christians, historically, buy into the exegesis of the Trinity from scripture.

i am afraid you are wrong , those faithful ones are in agreement with Jesus and the bible not with my thoughts, and yes ,you are certainly right to say that most so called christians buy into the trinity . and the bible foretold that these things would infiltrait the congregations. there is only one channel to follow and it is the faithful channel matthew 24;45-47 and the illustration of the wheat and the weeds growing up and not seeing which is the wheat and which is the weeds untill the harvest, then it will be very clear who is a wheat and who is a weed. when they are growing up they look the same but Jesus said not to uproot the weeds untill the harvest , because it may uproot the wheat

 

[may]

double post

 

[sojourner]

i am afraid you are wrong , those faithful ones are in agreement with Jesus and the bible not with my thoughts, and yes ,you are certainly right to say that most so called christians buy into the trinity . and the bible foretold that these things would infiltrait the congregations. there is only one channel to follow and it is the faithful channel matthew 24;45-47 and the illustration of the wheat and the weeds growing up and not seeing which is the wheat and which is the weeds untill the harvest, then it will be very clear who is a wheat and who is a weed. when they are growing up they look the same but Jesus said not to uproot the weeds untill the harvest , because it may uproot the wheat

You really need to get over yourself. Your use of the phrase, "so-called" belies your judgmentalism. Faith is not based upon who's "right" and who's "wrong." Faith is not something that is imparted to us by our intellectual understanding of what's written in the Bible. Faith is a gift from God to us.

 

[xexon]

May,

I love Jesus, but I do so in a way that leaves most people who follow him bewildered.

I know Jesus VERY well. I understand both the path and the direction he pointed out, and I've not cracked open a bible in many many years.

Jesus was just as human as anyone. What sets him apart is he knew his connection with the creator. He has immersed all that he was, into all that is. He became one with the father. That is the path he points to. It is his invitation to also become one with the father.

We are all children of God. This title is not exclusive to Jesus. Neither is the term Christ. A Christ is just a name for one who has made this journey and merged themselves into the absolute.

An "enlightened" person, if that helps.

I've spoke on this before, but Jesus was never meant to be worshipped, only followed. What he became... is what you will ultimately become yourself. Perfected.

Religion has made the terrible mistake of making Jesus into a deity. This only subtracts fom anybody's ability to follow his path with any clarity.

Christianity is only producing Christians now. Their well has been dry from the beginning. They know only ritual.

Jesus would produce Christs, because he has the living flame within, and is able to transmit it to others. One candle to another.


x

 

[may]

You really need to get over yourself. Your use of the phrase, "so-called" belies your judgmentalism. Faith is not based upon who's "right" and who's "wrong." Faith is not something that is imparted to us by our intellectual understanding of what's written in the Bible. Faith is a gift from God to us.

how can they call themselves followers of christ when they have taken on manmade doctrines . i see what i see , but i can see that the faithful ones are shining brightly because they have remained faithful , and i can also see that they are being blessed with all of Jesus belongings.matthew 24;45-47 i am only seeing what is quite clear to me , its got nothing to do with me as a person judging anyone that is not my place to do that . only Jehovah and Jesus christ have that job to do .remember i am not one of the annointed ones who will get to be with Jesus ruling as kings and priests in the heavenly kingdom . but i am quite willing to be fed by that channel because Jesus is feeding them with lots of Good tasty spiritual food . and i am not the only one who sees the channel to follow there is a GREAT CROWD from all nations doing the same as me ,its the way to go , there is only one channel and it belongs to faithful ones.

 

[may]

May,

I love Jesus, but I do so in a way that leaves most people who follow him bewildered.




x

most of christendom say that Jesus is God ,this is not true it is not based on bible teaching. the trinity teaching is not bible teaching it is manmade doctrine. so because i stick to the bible and know that God is the most high and he has a name Psalm 83;18 and i also know who Jesus christ is John 3;16 most people are bewildered by this simple bible teaching and think that they have got to make a big mystery out of God by teaching something else . dont be misled by the trinity teaching it is not true bible teaching it is manmade

 

[wizanda]

Why must we call him (jesus) in acts it relates how Bar-jesus means fake prophet....so shouldn't we at least call him, by something that couldn’t be deemed as false possibly?

Yeshua means Salvation as word in Hebrew....it then also clearly relates back to Zechariah as being the same Jeshua as Yeshua, like Jah African, Yah Hebrew.

Mat 7:22-23
(22) Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
(23) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Though that is related to asking God for entry to heaven and being denied; it also applies on this name thing, as how many people even know his real name and meaning.

 

[sojourner]

how can they call themselves followers of christ when they have taken on manmade doctrines . i see what i see , but i can see that the faithful ones are shining brightly because they have remained faithful , and i can also see that they are being blessed with all of Jesus belongings.matthew 24;45-47 i am only seeing what is quite clear to me , its got nothing to do with me as a person judging anyone that is not my place to do that . only Jehovah and Jesus christ have that job to do .remember i am not one of the annointed ones who will get to be with Jesus ruling as kings and priests in the heavenly kingdom . but i am quite willing to be fed by that channel because Jesus is feeding them with lots of Good tasty spiritual food . and i am not the only one who sees the channel to follow there is a GREAT CROWD from all nations doing the same as me ,its the way to go , there is only one channel and it belongs to faithful ones.

When you make statements like "so-called Christians," it is a judgmental statement on your part. If judging isn't up to you, how do you justify the statment, "so-called Christians?"

You say, "I am only seeing what is quite clear to me." Yet, I'm seeing what's quite clear to me. They are not the same viewpoint. How can you account for the difference, unless you are standing in judgment of the perspectives of others?

 

[A. Leaf]

Also Jesus promises the father, well according to St.Luke Ch24 v49

 

[paulbates]

interesting debate, i agree i went to a catholic school and the teachers tried teaching me that the son of god is god himself. who do you belive is more important tho god or jesus.

 

[paulbates]

interesting debate, i agree i went to a catholic school and the teachers tried teaching me that the son of god is god himself. who do you belive is more important in the bible god or jesus.

 

[may]

When you make statements like "so-called Christians," it is a judgmental statement on your part. If judging isn't up to you, how do you justify the statment, "so-called Christians?"

You say, "I am only seeing what is quite clear to me." Yet, I'm seeing what's quite clear to me. They are not the same viewpoint. How can you account for the difference, unless you are standing in judgment of the perspectives of others?

There are many religious organizations that profess to believe in God and Christ,
By their beliefs and conduct, have the churches of Christendom proved worthy to be God’s representative? Regarding doctrines, the denominations of Christendom believe in the Trinity, immortality of the soul, and hellfire, which are all of pagan origin. They have also adopted many pagan rituals into their religious services. They have even blotted out the name Jehovah from their Bible translations, thus showing that they do not want to be God’s representatives. As regards conduct, Christendom supported both sides of the belligerent powers during the two world wars. Their clergy blessed the troops and the weapons, in effect offering millions of their fellow believers as sacrifices to the god of war. Instead of advocating the Bible’s high moral standards as they should, the clergy have openly supported homosexuality and condoned other immoral practices, which are condemned by the Bible.................. like i said i see it as it is, and from a bible viewpoint it does not look good . but i am not a judge that is for Jehovah and Jesus to do that Job. it is my place to do my best to stick to bible teaching and i can see that Jesus is using a faithful people to feed me with lots of good spiritual things from the bible matthew 24;45-47 . and believe it or not i am humble enough to do that . and believe me most people are not willing to be humble and feed from the channel Jesus is using.
At Matthew 7:18-20, Jesus declared: "A good tree cannot bear worthless fruit, neither can a rotten tree produce fine fruit. . . . Really, then, by their fruits you will recognize those men." We can use this criterion to identify the organization that represents God today.

 

[sojourner]

Regarding doctrines, the denominations of Christendom believe in the Trinity, immortality of the soul, and hellfire, which are all of pagan origin. They have also adopted many pagan rituals into their religious services.

Early Biblical stories, as well as early understanding of the divine (in the Hebraic tradition) derive from earlier Babylonian and assyrian myth, and we can track the similarities. The creation story in Genesis came from earlier "pagan" accounts. So what? Neither Christian belief, nor its parent Judaism are as pure as you seem to think.

They have even blotted out the name Jehovah from their Bible translations, thus showing that they do not want to be God’s representatives.

The original Hebrew word is not "Jehovah." In one early tradition, it's Elohim (the gods, or the God). In another early tradition, it's YHWH. (Since original Hebrew contains no vowels, the later Masoretes added vowels to the text, to make it YaHWeH.) The word, Jehovah is a much, much later construct of German origin, placing the vowels of one word in the middle of the consonants for another word, ending up with Jehovah. (Out of respect for the Jewish tradition of not speaking God's true Name.) The name Jehovah was taken out and replaced with the more accurate term "God" (for elohim) and LORD God (for YHWH elohim).

but i am not a judge

and believe me most people are not willing to be humble and feed from the channel Jesus is using.

Here, you are clearly making a judgment as to what the "correct" channel is. You are passing judgment on who is "in" and who is "out."

We can use this criterion to identify the organization that represents God today.

And how do you determine (by this particular criterion) which is which? One still has to make a judgment as to what one feels is "worthless" or "fine." The Church has made all kinds of mistakes. That's normal -- it's a human organization. That does not indicate that the fruit the Church produces (love, forbearance, compassion, mercy, inclusion, kindness, a servant spirit) is "worthless." (BTW, in what way is making a summary judgment against organizations not one's own showing forbearance, compassion, kindness or inclusion?)

 

[sojourner]

interesting debate, i agree i went to a catholic school and the teachers tried teaching me that the son of god is god himself. who do you belive is more important tho god or jesus.

Jesus is God. Therefore, no comparison as to relative importance can be drawn here.

 

[may]

Early Biblical stories, as well as early understanding of the divine (in the Hebraic tradition) derive from earlier Babylonian and assyrian myth, and we can track the similarities. The creation story in Genesis came from earlier "pagan" accounts. So what? Neither Christian belief, nor its parent Judaism are as pure as you seem to think.

quote] i would say that we can track false religion with ancient babylonish beliefs,that is why false religion is called BABYLON THE GREAT in the book of revelation, and Gods people are told to GET OUT OF HER revelation 18;4 and yes as you mentioned many religious leaders have followed false worship as the bible informs us . and the bible also informs Gods people to stay away from false worship , but we can see that in times past and today religious leaders lead the people astray

 

[may]

(Out of respect for the Jewish tradition of not speaking God's true Name.) The name Jehovah was taken out quote] this says it all , a jewish tradition of not speaking Gods name ..............this was not a command from Jehovah God it was a manmade tradition and look at the problems it has made. Jehovah wants his name to be made known not to be shoved into the background Psalm83;18 traditions of men make alsorts of problems, but Jehovah will have his name made known and he is , regardless of jewish manmade traditions.

 

[may]

Here, you are clearly making a judgment as to what the "correct" channel is. You are passing judgment on who is "in" and who is "out."

And how do you determine (by this particular criterion) which is which? One still has to make a judgment as to what one feels is "worthless" or "fine." The Church has made all kinds of mistakes. That's normal -- it's a human organization. That does not indicate that the fruit the Church produces (love, forbearance, compassion, mercy, inclusion, kindness, a servant spirit) is "worthless."quote]the bible tells me that there would be a channel that Jesus is using matthew 24;45-47 and yes i am saying and seeing that i have found that channel because of their fruitage and because i can see that they are being blessed with understanding , the bible always comes true , and he can use imperfect men to do it . faithfulness leads to great blessings especially in the times we are living in now .