Not really,if a Man is to be put to death for communicating with Jinns that there is no credible evidence of would seem rather disturbing to me especially when no solidevidence could be presented.
Secular law vs. Islamic law.
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Man sentenced to death for sorcery.
- Thread starter Father Heathen
- Start date
Secular law vs. Islamic law.
I prefer the Secular one but just out of interest Unexplained Mysteries - Britain's last witch trial in 1944 the last Woman to be convicted of Witchcraft in Britain so even Secular Law gets it wrong sometimes.
Caladan
Agnostic Pantheist
That is if we limit 'spirituality' to what normally people would refer to as superstition.
Are you trying to limit and re-define my spirituality for me Mr. Dan?
Caladan
Agnostic Pantheist
I'm trying to redeem the umbrella term 'spirituality'.
And that's because you are an expert in spiritually, or maybe because you are a highly spiritual person who has the ability to construct a very clear idea of what spirituality mean?
Well, i didn't know that Atheists are highly spiritual people who can distinguish between spirituality--if they do believe in something called a spirit or soul--and between superstition. Last time i checked, Atheists or let's say most of them has regarded anything spiritual as a mere superstition, as that wasn't enough, now you are trying to define my beliefs for me?
Caladan
Agnostic Pantheist
Im more than able to be critical of different beliefs. for example, its fairly easy for me to come to the conclusion that executing someone as a 'black magician' is considered superstitious by normative social standards.
And i'm highly confident that your analysis is baseless because you are being biased here. You don't even believe that God exist, how you would be able to comprehend that God prohibited practicing this act?!
Social standards where? in Israel? the secular world? How about the *normative social standards* in the Middle East as a whole? Ahh, maybe they are not human beings like you, they are a second class human beings, and therefore, their social standards are meaningless.
I think you are not qualified to judge whether the Saudi government should find this man or any other person guilty or not.
Saudi Arabia has the right to prosecute people who disobey the laws of the famous Flying Spaghetti Monster if they want. If you don't like it, DON'T GO TO SAUDI ARABIA. So simple!
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Caladan
Agnostic Pantheist
Perhaps my lack of belief in a god, is more constructive than downgraded materialistic beliefs about god. you are assuming that your version of god is more valid or truthful than those of other religions.
Its not that you dont think im qualified to make the judgment. its that you are offended by my POV.
And each and every member here has a right to be highly critical of the Saudi domestic laws. considering that while I may not set foot in Saudi Arabia, there are foreign workers in the country that are subject to the harsh Saudi law.
Migrant Workers and the Death Penalty in Bahrain & Saudi Arabia | Bahrain Center for Human Rights
Thank you for proving my point. This superiority attitude is exactly what i meant about you being biased. You think your lack of belief makes you have a better judgement than those who believe in God. Your POV is highly respected and cherished if you don't look at believers in this degrading and disrespectful way.
It's not about members' opinion in general, but about your own opinion in this thread which i have just described how i think of it.
This is so true. I have a friend that is currently working in Saudi Arabia. This is the first time his company has sent him there. He has been in other Arab countries over the years, but not Saudi. I worry about him just being there unfortunately. I have heard so many horror stories of injustice, torture and false accusations etc.
Caladan
Agnostic Pantheist
Look, you've said that my analysis is baseless because I do not believe in God. my point is that, my atheism is no different than your religious beliefs. im fairly confident that the vast majority of believers in God on this forum, find the idea of executing a man for practicing what has been defined as black magic to be 'unspiritual' and a superstitious nightmare.
Just like you can voice a support for the Saudi law in this case and express your religious sentiments behind it, I can criticise this case, even if it might come from my atheistic world view.
maro
muslimah
Thank you for taking the time to provide the above interesting links for me...but unfortunately they are irrelevant , because i have no religious reason to believe in parapsycological phenomena , remote viewing , dowsing, or people with x-ray vision....and of course i never claimed that people should seek magical healing instead of medicine
I was specific in my request ,i think
I think those two links are relevant to our topic ,but unfortunataly anthropological studies...forgive my ignorance ,but in what way are anthropologists supposed to observe the evidence ? i mean ,do they perform scietific studies to verify what people believe or how they behave? isn't the belief and the behaviour itself the topic of study but not verifying it ?
You talked about a (huge body of research ) that disproved magic (or witchcraft) ,and i was expecting scientific papers ,not anthropological studies...am i missing something ?
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maro
muslimah
Why so ?
I understand that it's hard for you to believe in god or revealation...but why it's so hard to believe that there are people who do believe in god and revealation...are you really expecting all people to view life as you and have exactly the same philosophy ?
i think the human diversity is the most believable thing in the world...i think the right word is not * it's hard to believe *...the right word is *it's hard to tolerate *
Actually ,tolerance is tested only when people think differently...and forgive me ,you terribly failed the test....don't you tolerate muslims unless they are okay with extramarital sex , sodomy , dating non muslims ,and denying a religious tenet that's clearly mentioned in the Quran ?!!!
Again, i am not offended that you view my beliefs as superstitious...not at all...what else is expected from an atheist ?....you are entitled to your opinion... and i will fight for people like you to be tolerated in my society... inspite what i might think of them....i won't force my worldview on you and i will mind my own business
so why is it really that hard for you to accept that muslims are different from you and will remain so ?...if many christians have abondened their scripts and *progressed* , take my word , it's not gonna happen with muslims...Live with it ,MS
i think you misunderstood me....my point was not that i don't care for your opinions ,personally......my point was that no muslim cares of a kaffir's opinions regarding his religion
if you want to continue discussing...fine...but i don't think you will find a listener among muslims because we don't like to be told what to believe in and how to behave and what laws to apply in our own countries....we don't like the western angels who talk with superiority and arrogance
i have tried to make you realize this more than once..and i thought you were intelligent enough to grasp what i was talking about..._and i still think so ,btw _.....but unfortunately ,you were so close minded on the idea that you could possibly go somewhere by throwing some anthropological studies or talking to us about how two gay penguins crossing their necks and happy are cute and fascinating !
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maro
muslimah
it's not that simple ,Tashan.....otherwise ,how are they going to give us instructions about the human rights ? :sarcastic how are they going to practice their hobby ? do you think you can burn the card they are playing that simple ?
AxisMundi
E Pluribus Unum!!!
Evidence again!
Habeas Corpus has been the very foundation of Western Law since the 1200's.
You don't have to mention the members every time you try to make a point. This is an old fashion and a very classic way to give the impression that the whole world got your back and support you in every word you say. Sheesh!
Anyhow, whatever! you already have said enough.
it's not that simple ,Tashan.....otherwise ,how are they going to give us instructions about the human rights ? :sarcastic how are they going to practice their hobby ? do you think you can burn the card they are playing that simple ?
And ... ?
Caladan
Agnostic Pantheist
Of course, other people's criticism is meaningless when directed at an absolute truth.