• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Mueller indicts 13 Russian nationals over 2016 election interference

Phantasman

Phantasman

Well-Known Member
columbus said:
Rigged.
A vote in Wyoming is worth close to 4 votes in California.

National Popular Vote
Tom
Click to expand...
Trump campaigned according to system in place. Had the popular vote been enacted, he would have campaigned differently and may have still won. He didn't spend close to the money Hillary did. He could have spent more than her, targeting media ads in all fifty states, if it was a popular vote initiative. But it wasn't. You are seeing things in hind site. You are wishing for what should be rather than what things are,

If the horse that won wasn't disqualified, it would have won, as they say in the Derby.

If and when the popular vote goes into effect, campaigning would take a different path, I'm sure. But until then, both candidates knew the costs going in, and Trump outcampaigned Hillary, pure and simple.

Crying over spilt milk does nothing.
 
Revoltingest

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Phantasman said:
Trump campaigned according to system in place. Had the popular vote been enacted, he would have campaigned differently and may have still won. He didn't spend close to the money Hillary did. He could have spent more than her, targeting media ads in all fifty states, if it was a popular vote initiative. But it wasn't. You are seeing things in hind site. You are wishing for what should be rather than what things are,

If the horse that won wasn't disqualified, it would have won, as they say in the Derby.

If and when the popular vote goes into effect, campaigning would take a different path, I'm sure. But until then, both candidates knew the costs going in, and Trump outcampaigned Hillary, pure and simple.

Crying over spilt milk does nothing.
Click to expand...
Aye, he campaigned more effectively where it counted.
Hillary knew the "rigged system" better than he did,
so it was entirely fair.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Phantasman said:
I guess. So what. I'm sure China does as well.

Trump warned of both of them back in '16. Point?
Click to expand...
The difference being that Trump's connections to and benefiting from Russian involvement is clear. The question now why and how far does it go.
If we went by Trump and Pence, a guy who lied about having Russian connections would still be in the USA top national security post.
Tom
 
Phantasman

Phantasman

Well-Known Member
columbus said:
The difference being that Trump's connections to and benefiting from Russian involvement is clear. The question now why and how far does it go.
If we went by Trump and Pence, a guy who lied about having Russian connections would still be in the USA top national security post.
Tom
Click to expand...
Partisan politics. Why did Debbie Wasserman Schultz resign from the DNC? Rigging the system against Sanders and for Hillary. Why did Donna Brazile resign? Corruption in the DNC from Hillary Clinton.

Your ideas of corruptions has been proven more on the Democratic side than the Republican side. Until collusion is proven, it is speculation. If you have proof, present it. I just gave you two names of proof of Clinton corruption.

Again, I am an Independent, for neither side. But I want facts, not speculation.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Phantasman said:
If you have proof, present it. I just gave you two names of proof of Clinton corruption.
Click to expand...
Here's a couple of names. Flynn and Manafort.
The difference being that yours was an internal matter of a private organization, the DNC. Mine are about the current president and what he and his staff might be getting up to in the White House.
Tom
 
metis

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Collusion has already has been established with the indictments of the Russians and several of Trump's staff that have already agreed to plea deals, but there's the question of whom else may be involved and might that involve Trump himself? Don't know yet, but we do see the Donald and some of his staff pooping bricks at this point, and it's likely to get worse for them by all indications.
 
Revoltingest

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
metis said:
Collusion has already has been established with the indictments of the Russians and several of Trump's staff that have already agreed to plea deals, but there's the question of whom else may be involved and might that involve Trump himself? Don't know yet, but we do see the Donald and some of his staff pooping bricks at this point, and it's likely to get worse for them by all indications.
Click to expand...
Details on which plea deals support your claim?
 
Phantasman

Phantasman

Well-Known Member
columbus said:
Here's a couple of names. Flynn and Manafort.
The difference being that yours was an internal matter of a private organization, the DNC. Mine are about the current president and what he and his staff might be getting up to in the White House.
Tom
Click to expand...
You need to get the facts. Manafort is not tied to Trump. And he is yet convicted, unless you believe a person is guilty till proven innocent.
 
Underhill

Underhill

Well-Known Member
I love all the diversions. It's a circle the wagons moment for Trump supporters.

I doubt this will end up hurting Trump much (those who care already dislike him) but the reality is that for anyone willing to look past the rhetoric it paints a pretty ugly picture.

At best, assuming no collusion, this means the Russians saw helping Trump as a destabilizing influence on our political system (an opinion I agree with) and acted on their own. But that seems unlikely with what we already know about Trumps staff and son and their meetings with the Russians. Or they actually sat down with the Trump campaign and offered to help them during the campaign.

Most likely it is both. The Russians offered to support Trump in closed door meetings with his staff because they saw Trump as a destabilizing influence.
 
Phantasman

Phantasman

Well-Known Member
columbus said:
Here's a couple of names. Flynn and Manafort.
The difference being that yours was an internal matter of a private organization, the DNC. Mine are about the current president and what he and his staff might be getting up to in the White House.
Tom
Click to expand...
Yep. The question of Manafort being tied to Trump is not proven, The cases I gave you were proven with facts.

"The Oct. 27 indictment showed that prosecutors had amassed substantial documentation to buttress their charges that Manafort and Gates — who were colleagues in political consulting for about a decade — had engaged in a complex series of allegedly illegal transactions rooted in Ukraine. The indictment alleged that both men, who for years were unregistered agents of the Ukrainian government, hid millions of dollars of Ukraine-based payments from U.S. authorities.

According to the indictment, Gates and Manafort "laundered the money through scores of United States and foreign corporations, partnerships and bank accounts'' and took steps to evade related U.S. taxes.

If Manafort maintains his not-guilty plea and fights the charges at a trial, the testimony from Gates could provide Mueller's team with first-person descriptions of much of the allegedly illegal conduct. Gates' testimony, said person familiar with the pending guilty plea, would place a "cherry on top'' of the government's already formidable case against Manafort."- LA Times

I'll wait to see the results, as I said. Maybe you believe a person is guilty until proven innocent. Sounds like it. I'll make my assumption after the "facts" come out. Not until then. BTW- Manafort is accused of a Ukainian issue, not a Russian collusion issue. Flynn is still out as well. I await an outcome before I choose judgement.
 
Phantasman

Phantasman

Well-Known Member
metis said:
Collusion has already has been established with the indictments of the Russians and several of Trump's staff that have already agreed to plea deals, but there's the question of whom else may be involved and might that involve Trump himself? Don't know yet, but we do see the Donald and some of his staff pooping bricks at this point, and it's likely to get worse for them by all indications.
Click to expand...
That's just too funny. You may want to contact Mueller with this information, provided you can prove it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top