Muhammad The Greatest: A comparative study

[Fatihah]

That's got to be one of the easiest jobs around. Pretty much does itself!

Response: It's an easy job indeed to conspire. However, the conspiracies against islam always fail. Ask the crusaders of the middle ages.

 

[England my lionheart]

Response: Islam requires no help at all. It will spread with you or without you.

Yes its a scary thought isn't it

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Response: Islam requires no help at all. It will spread with you or without you.

Kind of like herpes?

 

[Fatihah]

I am so jealous of you,the next time the Postman winks at my Wife i will give her one hundred lashes just to be like you.

Response: And you will be held accountable for it.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Response: It's an easy job indeed to conspire.

Easy to conspire to make Islam look bad? That's an understatement. In fact, I think we haven't had anybody working on that conspiracy for like 20 years. They've done a much better job on their own than we could ever have done.

 

[England my lionheart]

Response: It's an easy job indeed to conspire. However, the conspiracies against islam always fail. Ask the crusaders of the middle ages.

Conspiracies?

 

[Fatihah]

To us in the west this comment seems full of danger. We do not want the state or any religious leaders telling us how we must live in our private lives. We believe that this can only lead to totalitarianism.

Some muslims see our open society as sexually irresponsible. All you have to do is look at the abortion rates and the sexualizing of our culture. To see that this view contains much truth.

I will take the irresponsibility of the minority over the rule of the tyrants any day of the week.

Response: Not all from the west feel the same. I for one certainly do not. One of the main attractions to islam if you were to ask a woman is because in islam, the muslims cherish the idea of modesty and not the sexual exploits that the western media has no shame in partaking in.

Perhaps one day you will come to understand that a society should be built on what's best for the society and not to grant what each individual of a society think what's best. That's the big difference between islam and the rest of the west.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Response: Not all from the west feel the same. I for one certainly do not. One of the main attractions to islam if you were to ask a woman is because in islam, the muslims cherish the idea of modesty and not the sexual exploits that the western media has no shame in partaking in.

Perhaps one day you will come to understand that a society should be built on what's best for the society and not to grant what each individual of a society think what's best. That's the big difference between islam and the rest of the west.

Perhaps one day I will come to strap a bomb to myself and blow up a bunch of people at the supermarket because some manipulative, power-hungry, religious leader whack-job convinced me that that's what would be best for society and that I would be a hero if I did it. I wouldn't hold my breath though.

 

[maro]

Then the Hadith is false?

no ,the hadith is True..
i meant that this is not a literal translation ,not even accurate..and probably it was meant to be..so as to force the word "wrote "...Here is the translation i am familiar with :
Narrated 'Aisha:
that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old, and then she remained with him for nine years (i.e., till his death).

 

[Wannabe Yogi]

I feel like our Muslim brothers & sisters are being attacked with to much vigor. Maybe we should take it down a bit.

 

[Imagist]

I am so jealous of you,the next time the Postman winks at my Wife i will give her one hundred lashes just to be like you.

Depending on your wife, that might not be a punishment. (;

 

[Imagist]

I feel like our Muslim brothers & sisters are being attacked with to much vigor. Maybe we should take it down a bit.

I agree. I haven't minced words, but I have attempted to keep my criticisms within the realm of logic and reason and out of the realm of anger and spite. Some of the comments here have crossed that line.

 

[Kodanshi]

Please provide evidence that Allah said so. In fact, please provide evidence that Allah said ANYTHING.

It is widely known amongst muslims who actually know their religion that allah didn’t speak the Qur’ân to Muhammad. Gabriel did, apparently repeating what allah told him. However, using Islâmic sources alone, it doesn’t stop there. Basically, you can sum it up like this:

When people claim allah said something in the Qur’ân they actually mean allah told Gabriel told Muhammad to have his followers commit this or that passage to memory, or to write it down on pieces of paper, or the shoulderblades of camels or the scapulæ of oxen until a committee appointed by the third rightful Khalifah could collect it together into an official form in order to stem the spread of alternative rescensions.

In other words, third– or fourth–generational hearsay.

If you accept the ahadith, then some exist in which allah apparently speaks directly to Muhammad. Scholars call this ahadith qudsi. If, however, you reject the traditions of Muhammad then at no point does allah speak to Muhammad.

 

[Imagist]

It is widely known amongst muslims who actually know their religion that allah didn’t speak the Qur’ân to Muhammad. Gabriel did, apparently repeating what allah told him. However, using Islâmic sources alone, it doesn’t stop there. Basically, you can sum it up like this:

When people claim allah said something in the Qur’ân they actually mean allah told Gabriel told Muhammad to have his followers commit this or that passage to memory, or to write it down on pieces of paper, or the shoulderblades of camels or the scapulæ of oxen until a committee appointed by the third rightful Khalifah could collect it together into an official form in order to stem the spread of alternative rescensions.

In other words, third– or fourth–generational hearsay.

If you accept the ahadith, then some exist in which allah apparently speaks directly to Muhammad. Scholars call this ahadith qudsi. If, however, you reject the traditions of Muhammad then at no point does allah speak to Muhammad.

I was aware of some of this and would not have normally referenced Allah directly, except that I was responding directly to Fadihah:

So let's apply the same to our situation. My argument is simple but would be very difficult to sum up in this one post so my evidence will be based on every question you pose. So why is it that your evidence is wrong and what proof do I have that it is wrong? Simple. Because Allah(swt) said so. If this evidence is not enough, feel free to ask for more. It is now up to you to hammer away with any questions you feel is necessary to gain evidence for my claim. I insist.

He was the one who said "Because Allah(swt) said so."

My full response was:

Please provide evidence that Allah said so. In fact, please provide evidence that Allah said ANYTHING. In this evidence, it would be pointless for you to reference any text or external links, since you don't believe that these are legitimate sources.

I'll also present a counter-claim. Why was Muhammed a pedophile, a murderer, and a quack physician? Simple. Because the Flying Spaghetti Monster said so. If this evidence is not enough, feel free to ask for more. It is now up to you to hammer away with any questions you feel are necessary to gain evidence for my claim.

 

[Kodanshi]

I understand. I simply thought that would point it out, because muslims like to say that allah said something directly in the Qur’ân — completely untrue, even by muslim standards.

 

[Fatihah]

Perhaps one day I will come to strap a bomb to myself and blow up a bunch of people at the supermarket because some manipulative, power-hungry, religious leader whack-job convinced me that that's what would be best for society and that I would be a hero if I did it. I wouldn't hold my breath though.

Response: Neither would I.

 

[Fatihah]

I feel like our Muslim brothers & sisters are being attacked with to much vigor. Maybe we should take it down a bit.

Response: And yet it's the muslims who are called the extremists.

 

[Fatihah]

We're talking about entirely different levels of mistakes here. 2 + 2 = 4 is a very widely accepted and incontrovertible fact. To run with the mathematician metaphor - there's still some disagreement on the Riemann hypothesis. If it turns out that the Riemann hypothesis proves correct, that doesn't make all the mathematicians who thought it was incorrect not mathematicians.

Response: Exactly my point.

Emphasis mine: nobody is saying that, so your entire point is moot.

Response: I'm saying that. You're commenting on my post not the other way around. So it's your whole entire point is moot.

Your argument on this subject so far has amounted to:

1. I am right.
2. If a scholar doesn't agree with me, (s)he isn't actually a scholar.
3. The evidence you cite is written by scholars who don't agree with me.
4. Therefore, those scholars aren't actually scholars.
5. Therefore, I feel free to disregard your evidence.

Response: I'm reading a statement. Where's the proof?

 

[Fatihah]

Please provide evidence that Allah said so. In fact, please provide evidence that Allah said ANYTHING. In this evidence, it would be pointless for you to reference any text or external links, since you don't believe that these are legitimate sources.

Response: That proof is the qur'an. The qur'an is the word of Allah and in the qur'an we are told that it will be protected. (Ch.15:9) Also, we are told to obey the Messenger (Muhammad). Therefore the sunnah also had to be protected as well. In ch.5:3 we are told that the religion was perfected and in ch.24:55 we are told that Allah make Successors from among the religion. Lastly, in 9:33 we are told that true religion will prevail over all religions. Therefore the collection of Tabari and all the other weak and unauthentic hadiths can not be true because if they were they would have been acknowledged and would have prevailed over the muslim world as so but it has not.

 

[Gharib]

This way of thinking must be removed from the human psyche - or mankind will never be able to move forward.

and which direction is exactly "forward" to you , the one that goes backwards?