Muslims: Keeping the wife "in line"

[beenie]

who tell you most of the women don't want to obey their husband ?
please don't prejuge until verify .
even they don't want , our goal is what God want ,right ? , I know most of the people are practice the law on way of obligation but it's wrong !!!, we need to obey God because he deserve !! ,not because most the women don't want !!! , for that the context changed and the meaning of the verse and Hadiths changed !!!! , and try to find other meaning which be acceptable to our desires !!! honesly if we follow our desires the religions will gone .
and if some muslims woman did not respect the Hadith and verse of Quran about obeying their husband you should follow "imitate" them ?

I told you the arabic meaning is the same in english .
and thanks Allah , Debater had confirm to you , what i told you before , that the wife should obey her husband and inverse her husband should care of her .

his problem is was , why i don't speak about the duty of the husband ?
i told him it's other subject , and i am not against the duty of the husband to her wife .

Salam

I missed this post.

I say so because I am a woman who knows a lot of women. How many women do you know?

 

[Revoltingest]

To those of you who embrace barbaric interpretations of ancient religions, beware!
If your wife decides to follow the way of the Revoltifarian, then woe unto abusers.
A saying from our sacred pamphlet.....
"If a man smite thee on one cheek, then smash him on the other."

You sharp eyed posters will note that we stole this maxim from another source.
A frubal awaits the first to identify it.

 

[Vinayaka]

There are no plagiarism laws in Revoltistan?

Any effort whatsoever that leads to less violence against the weak on this planet is commendable.

 

[Revoltingest]

There are no plagiarism laws in Revoltistan?

Tis not plagerism when it's attributed, which will be served here by my challenge.

Any effort whatsoever that leads to less violence against the weak on this planet is commendable.

We favor the weak becoming strong.

 

[Godobeyer]

You are getting so repetitive it's absurd.
I feel like a broken record, and I've answered your question several times.

The "scholar" you just quotes is his opinion, and one I don't agree with. I find his assessment of women quite disturbing, referring to them as less intelligent as men. He contradicts himself by then admitting that there are some women better than men...
His insistence that beating women is a requirement for "correcting" a disobedient wife is beyond a dislike of women. Opinions like his are why there are sites like the one you quoted and many many more.

You are not going to convince me that Allah says to beat your wife (lightly), THEN call in arbitrators to help.

"I tried to beat her and make her submit, I didn't work. Let's go BACK to non-violent measures and see if that works.". Ummmm, what?

If submission is defined as you have defined it, then I reject it. (getting beaten for going out, refusing intercourse, etc.)

I also think you have a very low opinion of women, as you have never provided a verse or Hadith that compliments or praises women. Rather, you love to post all of the verses and Hadith that paint women in a poor light.

I'm with Badran. When you decide to have a real, intellectual, unbiased discussion, I'll join you. Until then, please stop repeating the same thing over and over again. We all know your opinion about this, we disagree with it, and unless you have something new to contribute, there's nothing else to be said.

this your opinion , that was not my opinion it's Fatwah from scholars , and from very famous and credible site .
it's from the begining you against the obedience of the wife to her husband , and now you pretend that it's because of me !!!!and because my intellectual , and unbaised disccuss .

join me استغفر الله , I don't want you to join me, it's not about game who wins in the end , i want to join what God want .
? why me who did that fatwah ? or me who creat Quran or Hadiths ? , i told many time it' not my opinion , i am just copy/paste here .
from the first i tried to explain it's , but you always try to stop me and against my explaination .
as you said before i am decent man , i accept if i get wrong to apologice , and i accept the other opinion but by strong reference .


I pray to God to show us the true way .

 

[Godobeyer]

I missed this post.

I say so because I am a woman who knows a lot of women. How many women do you know?

muslim women ? , all my family are obedience to their husbands .

 

[muslimah2]

i am fiancé of Godobeyer
​

انا مع ان تطيع المرأة زوجها ​

 

[Revoltingest]

i am fiancé of Godobeyer
​

انا مع ان تطيع المرأة زوجها ​

Greetings!

 

[Godobeyer]

Greetings!

that was my fiancé , and she had no problem to obey me .

 

[Vinayaka]

i am fiancé of Godobeyer
​

انا مع ان تطيع المرأة زوجها ​

Welcome to these forums. Many people her will be glad to hear from you.

 

[Revoltingest]

that was my fiancé , and she had no problem to obey me .

I look forward to her participation.
(I'll be nice....within my limitations.)

Btw, congrats to both of you!

 

[beenie]

this your opinion , that was not my opinion it's Fatwah from scholars , and from very famous and credible site .
it's from the begining you against the obedience of the wife to her husband , and now you pretend that it's because of me !!!!and because my intellectual , and unbaised disccuss .

join me استغفر الله , I don't want you to join me, it's not about game who wins in the end , i want to join what God want .
? why me who did that fatwah ? or me who creat Quran or Hadiths ? , i told many time it' not my opinion , i am just copy/paste here .
from the first i tried to explain it's , but you always try to stop me and against my explaination .
as you said before i am decent man , i accept if i get wrong to apologice , and i accept the other opinion but by strong reference .


I pray to God to show us the true way .

I think it means something else. The end.

 

[Godobeyer]

I look forward to her participation.
(I'll be nice....within my limitations.)

Btw, congrats to both of you!

she is beginner in forum and english language , I hope she will try to explain her opinion , (about this issue ) soon.

 

[Looncall]

brother Debater Slayer , I guess you are the only one who understand my point here ,
can you please intervene to resume my opinion which supported by "hadith and verse " to them .
and resume their opinion to me even in arabic .
I am not sure that they understand me as you did privatly , and i am not sure that i understand them .

I would like to ask you again: do you feel you have to agree with everything in your scriptures?

I would like to understand whether you have any independent moral existance of your own.

I find your way of discussing things with quotations from scripture very puzzling.

 

[beenie]

I would like to ask you again: do you feel you have to agree with everything in your scriptures?

IMO you have to realize what those scriptures actually mean and whether they hold true to the overall spirit of a religion and relationship between people and God.

I would like to understand whether you have any independent moral existance of your own.

IMO yes. Even if you do believe as Godobeyer does, you have the choice to either go along with it or reject it. That's why God gave us brains.

I find your way of discussing things with quotations from scripture very puzzling.

So do I, trust me.

 

[Godobeyer]

I think it means something else. The end.

what you mean sister ? you mean i mean somothing else ?

 

[Godobeyer]

I would like to ask you again: do you feel you have to agree with everything in your scriptures?

very intersting question ,let me ask you this question first , should i disagree with it or agree with it ?
the Islam is base on Quran , if we disgree with any of it , that mean we disgree god , no ?

I would like to understand whether you have any independent moral existance of your own.

I did not get this claim .

I find your way of discussing things with quotations from scripture very puzzling.

it's not puzzle or challenge , it's God law (Fatwa and explaination ) of Quran verse and Hadiths ,
if it's already misuderstand by some muslims and how about non-muslims too .

 

[Godobeyer]

I found very important Hadith about the women whom disobey their husbands
most the hell are from the women prophet Muhammad (pbuh) said !!!!!

{ حَدَّثَنَا سَعِيدُ بْنُ أَبِى مَرْيَمَ قَالَ أَخْبَرَنَا مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ جَعْفَرٍ قَالَ أَخْبَرَنِى زَيْدٌ - هُوَابْنُ أَسْلَمَ - عَنْ عِيَاضِ بْنِ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ عَنْ أَبِى سَعِيدٍ الْخُدْرِىِّ قَالَ خَرَجَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم فِى أَضْحًى - أَوْ فِطْرٍ - إِلَى الْمُصَلَّى، فَمَرَّ عَلَى النِّسَاءِ فَقَالَ يَا مَعْشَرَ النِّسَاءِ تَصَدَّقْنَ، فَإِنِّى أُرِيتُكُنَّ أَكْثَرَ أَهْلِ النَّارِ . فَقُلْنَ وَبِمَ يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ قَالَ تُكْثِرْنَ اللَّعْنَ، وَتَكْفُرْنَ الْعَشِيرَ، مَا رَأَيْتُ مِنْ نَاقِصَاتِ عَقْلٍ وَدِينٍ أَذْهَبَ لِلُبِّ الرَّجُلِ الْحَازِمِ مِنْ إِحْدَاكُنَّ . قُلْنَ وَمَا نُقْصَانُ دِينِنَا وَعَقْلِنَا يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ قَالَ أَلَيْسَ شَهَادَةُ الْمَرْأَةِ مِثْلَ نِصْفِ شَهَادَةِ الرَّجُلِ . قُلْنَ بَلَى. قَالَ فَذَلِكَ مِنْ نُقْصَانِ عَقْلِهَا، أَلَيْسَ إِذَا حَاضَتْ لَمْ تُصَلِّ وَلَمْ تَصُمْ . قُلْنَ بَلَى. قَالَ فَذَلِكَ مِنْ نُقْصَانِ دِينِهَا . }

تم ترجمة هذا الحديث للغات التالية


Narated By Abu Said Al-Khudri : Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, " O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women) . " They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle ?" He replied, " You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you . " The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, " Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man ? " They replied in the affirmative. He said, " This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses ? " The women replied in the affirmative. He said, " This is the deficiency in her religion . "

Sahih al-Bukhary, The Book of Menses, Hadith Number:305, Narrated by: Sa'd Ibn-Malik​

from
..........

 

[Badran]

Why are you frustrated?

Something along the lines of what Draka explained.

 

[Badran]

I wonder what is ******** ,

Its the straight forward way of saying that you're advice and comments on my posts are pretty much worthless, since you've never read them properly to begin with. Its like giving me advice about what to do with my life when you weren't actually listening while i was explaining my problems.

any way i ask god to forgive him , it's he mean it .

I assume you thought i was cursing you? I wasn't. I was expressing my disgust with what you were responding with to those who disagree with you (acting like you're speaking on behalf of god or merely saying it like it is written and supposedly trying to point that out to the rest of us so that we don't sin by going against god).

Its disgusting because you never read what was written appropriately like i said, and also because i tend to think that when someone repeatedly does that its more of a compensation for poor debating and reasoning skills rather than sincere advice.

honestly if i instead of you i will be sorry that my post was against what Allah said in Quran.استغفر الله

If i were you i'd be more worried about myself. Like i said, i'm not interested in hearing your advice, and you're in no position to be giving any to begin with (because you didn't read my posts).

you don't tell me you are against the slave of the wife , you tell me you are against the submission .

Submission to humans, and particularly in the fashion you're describing is slavery, pure and simple. You can dance around that all day long and that won't change it.

I read your claims it's just an opinion (had no reference ),

So is your opinion, as shocking as that may be to you. If you read my previous posts properly you might understand how.

and almost ambiguous to me (not clear)

The reason for that is very simple. Just read and things will be very clear.

if i choice to follow ,if i should follow your opinion or Quran and Hadiths ?
of course i will follow what God and Muhammad said .

I wasn't trying to influence your opinion when i started addressing your posts to begin with. Nobody asked you to follow my opinion, i was simply trying to help you with figuring out how come some Muslims were disagreeing with you. I offered you explanations as to why and how there are differing views regarding this matter, and all you did in return is misrepresent my position and offer posts that to me can only be described as pathetic.

but if it's just misudernstand we each other , that's other problem , because I am talking with Debater and he told me that he with submission but in condition that He did not slave her . and I am compeletly agree with him.

I won't speak on anybody's behalf, but my impression from these threads is that you both have very differing views regarding the matter. He, it seems simply believes in the idea of some form of authority figure in the house. You on the other hand are espousing much more than that.

submission in Islam never mean slavery , submission it's just kind of respect to husband .

Nothing related to what you said has anything remotely connected with respect. You're talking about the relation between a slave and her owner, or a tyrant and his subject, who has to put up with it and will be compensated for in the afterlife.