Come2thelight
Active Member
Where are you getting the word Jibt from?
Why do you think the word لقي means to cast? Where have you gotten this definition from?
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Where are you getting the word Jibt from?
Why do you think the word لقي means to cast? Where have you gotten this definition from?
Come2thelight
Active Member
Hello and thank you for your questions. From my perspective, everyone is innocent until proven otherwise. I can't judge people so therefore, I give everyone the benefit of the doubt.
In terms of Islam, everyone is born pure and innocent no doubt, but that purity gets tarnished as they grow and experience life. But the whole point is that people repent and try to change their ways. This is the purpose of life in Islam. To pass a test of faith through our intentions and actions.
As a revert you mean? This depends on the person of course, there are those that come to Islam from an Atheistic understanding. So it's not exclusive to Christians.
I personally don't hold the Bible as a reliable source of information. Why do you?
Come2thelight
Active Member
Hello and thank you for your comment.
I don't agree with this. If you mean dominate the world through people's hearts then ok. But through force, this is illogical. Can you force an individual to believe in something? No, we can't. So there's no reason to assume that Allah made such a command. Let's say someone were to force an individual to believe in Islam or die, the person can accept but hide their true feelings in their heart. What has the ignorant Muslim benefited? This notion is completely absurd honestly and it has no basis for it in the Quran.
And yes, there are a lot of events that occurred in which one needs to consider the time. People change and so do our values and norms. Wasn't it just up until the 60s where homosexuality was being treated as an illness? And then the 70s everything changed? So the timeframe is an absolutely crucial factor.
I personally don't see them as such. I don't see Islam as the way you have portrayed it, with due respect.
I don't agree with this. If you mean dominate the world through people's hearts then ok. But through force, this is illogical. Can you force an individual to believe in something? No, we can't. So there's no reason to assume that Allah made such a command. Let's say someone were to force an individual to believe in Islam or die, the person can accept but hide their true feelings in their heart. What has the ignorant Muslim benefited? This notion is completely absurd honestly and it has no basis for it in the Quran.
And yes, there are a lot of events that occurred in which one needs to consider the time. People change and so do our values and norms. Wasn't it just up until the 60s where homosexuality was being treated as an illness? And then the 70s everything changed? So the timeframe is an absolutely crucial factor.
I personally don't see them as such. I don't see Islam as the way you have portrayed it, with due respect.
Come2thelight
Active Member
Hello and thank you for your comments. 
It started off as a political split and as time went on people have stirred animosity between the two, either in their homes or by their religious teachers. Egos need to be relinquished for this to be settled.
What is a religion of peace? A religion that doesn't promote violence? A passive religion? Would that be a religion of peace? If so, then it wouldn't be correct to describe Islam as such. Maybe Jainism is the most passive religion I can think of.
But when people say Islam is a religion of peace, this should be more like "Islam (submitting to Allah) brings peace". The reason we can say this with confidence is due to the effect of the submission. (serenity, contentment, and security)
Plus, Muslims are instructed to defend themselves when being attacked, so ya, I don't think this is the right description and this is probably why scholars don't teach it. But Muslims definitely mention the peace that comes to us when submitting to the Creator.
No, they're just loud and the media help them. The true Islam is there, people just have to remove all the misinformation that was thrown on top of the treasure.
Don't apologize. Feel free to ask whatever you'd like
It started off as a political split and as time went on people have stirred animosity between the two, either in their homes or by their religious teachers. Egos need to be relinquished for this to be settled.
What is a religion of peace? A religion that doesn't promote violence? A passive religion? Would that be a religion of peace? If so, then it wouldn't be correct to describe Islam as such. Maybe Jainism is the most passive religion I can think of.
But when people say Islam is a religion of peace, this should be more like "Islam (submitting to Allah) brings peace". The reason we can say this with confidence is due to the effect of the submission. (serenity, contentment, and security)
Plus, Muslims are instructed to defend themselves when being attacked, so ya, I don't think this is the right description and this is probably why scholars don't teach it. But Muslims definitely mention the peace that comes to us when submitting to the Creator.
No, they're just loud and the media help them. The true Islam is there, people just have to remove all the misinformation that was thrown on top of the treasure.
Don't apologize. Feel free to ask whatever you'd like
The other option is for the non-Muslim to become a second class person under Islamic rule, correct?
Okay, so this could be the start of a logical discussion, thanks. Personally, I think that if Muslims softened up just a bit on their claims about the Quran and Muhammad, we'd all get along better. I'm no fan of Christianity either, but they are more flexible about their claims than Muslims seem to be. But the fact that you're willing to agree that historical context is important in understanding the Quran and Muhammad is a big step towards better communications between Muslims and the rest of us. Thanks for that!
Would you agree that the Quran criticizes non-Muslims hundreds of times?
Surah Nisa, it's used in conjunction with Taghut, that belief in one is belief in the other.
If it means to throw, it's still some kind metaphorical throw that causes people to misinterpret Quran due to hard hearts.
But you can see the various uses of this word, they all in context of magic else where, for example "Will you be first to cast or shall we?"
We can also derive this from the fact the two seek refuge Surahs are closely linked and interpret one another.
Waswas of Satan takes places in other words through those who blow on knots (metaphorically locks). The dark night takes place through dark magic on the hearts of humanity.
The two Surahs are obviously closely linked and interpret one another.
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Come2thelight
Active Member
Yes if they were in an Islamic state, if not then it doesn't apply. And a second-class person would be somewhat similar to a non-national individual in the states for example.
Hmm.. that's a tricky one, yes it does, but not all non-Muslims. I don't have examples out of the top of my head, but if you would like to present a few and we go over them, I'd be more than happy to do that
Come2thelight
Active Member
Sorry bro, it seems like I'm not understanding this. What does the word jibt mean? Can you post the ayah please?
If you mean Iblis throwing then yes, it is metaphorical. But what's the point of this again bro? How does this show that the meanings are distorted or changed? Even in this same ayah (22:52) Allah says that He abolishes what Satan throws in. So how was it distorted?
Apostasy is a dangerous law to have in the hands of men, they tend to colour it with their own intent, forgetful of Allah and that Allah does as Allah so wills and chooses.
If some leaders of Islam make an oath on the Quran and then break that oath, what is the ramifications?
Regards Tony
Come2thelight
Active Member
Hello Tony,
I hope you're well and thank you for your comment.
I honestly don't know what the ramifications are if the leaders break an oath. It depends on the oath but either way, it wouldn't be pretty. Breaking oaths is a big fault in Islam.
I hope you're well and thank you for your comment.
I honestly don't know what the ramifications are if the leaders break an oath. It depends on the oath but either way, it wouldn't be pretty. Breaking oaths is a big fault in Islam.
That is not a hard task. I just offer an answer.
Persia, Iran the Babi, then the Baha'i.
Also @Aupmanyav
Peace be with you and all.
Muhammad (Peace be upon him) was a Messenger of Allah.
Regards Tony
Jibt means "the magic/sorcery". The verse is 4:51. In other words the false idol in the hearts of humanity and sorcery of Iblis is linked. Thus showing love of Dunya is in fact, about being intoxicated in delusions from Iblis and lies from him. One can enjoy themselves in his sorcery but only temporarily.
Allah (swt) makes it clear but to those given the knowledge as the next verses show. They are guided to the truth between Allah (Swt) clarification of the signs and Iblis casting regarding the wish/recitation of a Rasool or Nabi. This, while those with hard hearts are misguided with respect to it and it's a huge trial in them.
This goes back to 3:7, they follow ambiguities from Quran rather then the clear signs the people who have knowledge see.
How it's distorted is that like nations before, most people claiming to believe in Mohammad (S) are transgressors with hard hearts. Satan makes them decontextualize verses from their proper flow and place in Quran. They are enticed with love of Dunya and like Bani-Israel thought there would be no trial, and became blind as a result. Same is true of them.
It may be twisted but these laws are put in place in the name of Allah, in the belief the lawmakers are doing the will of Allah.
Come2thelight
Active Member
Are these eradications?
Thank you for the response, I love your heart. I am aware of the ramifications, I just wondered how much you may know about the topic.
Much is forgotten about past events.
Peace be with you, Regards Tony
Very much so, they attempted to wipe them from the face of the earth. They still do, yet behind closed doors.
Current situation
Regards Tony
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The laws are based in Justice and if followed, are the light for the age they were given, they are the epitome of Justice.
Once man alters the intent and injustice results, it is no longer the law given by Allah.
This is warned against.
All the best ChristineM, Regards Tony
Come2thelight
Active Member
Why have you concluded that this word بِٱلْجِبْتِ means magic/sorcery?
Bro Allah says that He abolishes the distortions in these ayahs, why are you neglecting this?
I get you and I understand where you are coming from now, however, bro, just because a group of Muslims have misinterpreted/misunderstood/misrepresented the Quran that doesn't mean that the teachings of the Prophet (saw) didn't reach us. Allah tells us in the Quran to obey Allah and obey the Prophet.
The Prophet's teachings are still around, but it is the way people interpret them which has caused the problem. Muslims and non-Muslims will take one hadith and wave it around thinking it means something, but that is not the case. Doing so is like reading a few lines from a novel and then claiming what the novel is all about. This is quite irrational
Execution for apostasy is not based on any justice that i recognise. You may have different ideas
Come2thelight
Active Member
This is not the teachings of Islam but it is really sad that people are like this. As I was telling another member earlier. People paint it as religion, but in reality, there is more to it.
Have you ever gone through such an experience?