Obama is just an utter disaster for this world

[angellous_evangellous]

Islamic militia group says it has 'secured' US compound in Libya | Fox News#

His recklessnes and idiocy is tearing the world apart.

He is in way over his head.

:clapI said something stupid once.:clap

Wait - you must mean destroying the US economy. Or lying to the entire nation about Iraq so you could spend more than all other Presidents before him combined and multiplied by 10+. Or develop a doctrine of war of aggression and unlimited occupation for the first time in the history of any democracy. Develop a sense of mindless nationalism that supports unbridled executive power and invasion of privacy of American citizens.

And bash Obama for what? The ONLY reason why we're not at war with Iran for something stupid is because Obama is in office. We can't afford to lose another war in the Middle East. We had the resources for the first wars, but another with a country as strong as Iran - plus Iran's allies - will weaken the US so badly that not even FOX news could lie about it.

 

[Revoltingest]

:clapI said something stupid once.:clap

Wait - you must mean destroying the US economy. Or lying to the entire nation about Iraq so you could spend more than all other Presidents before him combined and multiplied by 10+. Or develop a doctrine of war of aggression and unlimited occupation for the first time in the history of any democracy. Develop a sense of mindless nationalism that supports unbridled executive power and invasion of privacy of American citizens.

And bash Obama for what? The ONLY reason why we're not at war with Iran for something stupid is because Obama is in office. We can't afford to lose another war in the Middle East. We had the resources for the first wars, but another with a country as strong as Iran - plus Iran's allies - will weaken the US so badly that not even FOX news could lie about it.

What a dim oaf!
You left out....
We cannot afford to win another foreign war either.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Again, what's this WE stuff? Are you personally going to be over there in that 140 degree desert fighting this war?

The man has a point. A soldier of the USA should not be treated like a Hessian.

 

[metis]

Seems that you are misinformed on the Tora Bora operation in 2001and Bin Laden. Basically it was a cluster ****. By the way this was during the Clinton years, if you forgot.

How Bin Laden Escaped in 2001

As far as President Bush's administrations problems with Bin Laden. I agree with Col David Hunt.

America Could Have Killed Usama bin Laden — But Didn't | Fox News

Oh, by the way did you happen to notice this is a Fox News source. Hmmmm, and I thought there are those that say Fox News always is on the side of Republicans.

2001 was the first year of the Bush administration, and it took place from December 12-17. -- [see Battle of Tora Bora - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ] The supposed missed opportunity in 2007 was also during the Bush tenure. Also, Fox is like this: even a blind chicken gets a worm once in a while.

During the Clinton administration, there was a sighting of Ob-L by one of the drones, but that drone wasn't armed.

 

[esmith]

2001 was the first year of the Bush administration, and it took place from December 12-17. -- [see Battle of Tora Bora - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ] The supposed missed opportunity in 2007 was also during the Bush tenure. Also, Fox is like this: even a blind chicken gets a worm once in a while.

During the Clinton administration, there was a sighting of Ob-L by one of the drones, but that drone wasn't armed.

Sorry, you are right Tora Bora was during the GW Bush tenure. However from my link

But the largest mistake made by President George W. Bush and Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld was their failure to examine and intervene in the affairs of the military. Throughout the Battle of Tora Bora, neither the president nor the secretary of defense was directly engaged in the most important operation of the U.S. war in Afghanistan.

So, it appears that President Bush and SecDef did not try and micro manage the war. As a certain President and SecDef attempted to do war. It was the military leadership at the top that caused this cluster *****.

 

[Sha'irullah]

As many screw ups as we have made in the Middle East I am just glad Obama is not going gun crazy considering that he is such a right winder despite being a Democrat.
He is doing "Fly By Bombing" every minute it seems and may have scored a catch in Somalia yesterday.

I could not have asked for a better foreign policy to be honest

 

[metis]

Sorry, you are right Tora Bora was during the GW Bush tenure. However from my link



So, it appears that President Bush and SecDef did not try and micro manage the war. As a certain President and SecDef attempted to do war. It was the military leadership at the top that caused this cluster *****.

No matter how one may try and shift the blame, as the sign on Truman's desk said, "The buck stops here"-- especially since the president is the Commander-In-Chief.

Secondly, it is not the military's duty to formulate policy, especially after a conflict. The fact of the matter is that the Bush administration by its own admittance wasn't prepared for what to do next. One colossal mistake is they dismissed the entire Iraqi military instead of keeping many if not most and then weeding out the one's that would likely be problematic.

You can't have it both ways, namely making excuses on a partisan basis. Both Bush and Obama leave room for criticism, but between the two, I'll take the latter any day of the week. However, I'd rather have the elder Bush over both of them. Yes, you saw it here!

 

[CMike]

It is a dual responsibility since the president is Commander-In-Chief.

BTW, how come you didn't bring up the fact that "W" dropped the ball dealing with Ob-L in regards to Tora Bora? Heck, one might come to believe that you may be very partisan.

Pres Bush didn't drop the ball. He tried to get him and he escaped.

It's very easy to pass judgement on it from being at home.

It was a mountainous region and he slipped out. You had a better method to get him?

What mistake do you think he made?

 

[metis]

Pres Bush didn't drop the ball. He tried to get him and he escaped.

It's very easy to pass judgement on it from being at home.

It was a mountainous region and he slipped out. You had a better method to get him?

What mistake do you think he made?

The intelligence said that he was likely in the Tora Bora area, but instead of directing our forces to go in and do the job, they let the Afghan forces try and do most of the work. Regardless as to whether that particular decision was directed by Bush, what definitely was a problem was not sending more American troops into that area to begin with. This was pretty much covered on different new sources, btw, but for those who mainly get their "news" from Fox...

 

[metis]

BTW, I do believe it's pretty commonly known at this point that the Bush administration was a disaster on several fronts, but especially the near complete mishandling of the Iraq War. Based on the dynamics of that region, there was one terrible decision after another, and the results were are now stuck with. I blame Bush less for this than Cheney and Rumsfeld, both of which clearly sold a fraudulent bill of goods to Bush.

 

[CMike]

The intelligence said that he was likely in the Tora Bora area, but instead of directing our forces to go in and do the job, they let the Afghan forces try and do most of the work. Regardless as to whether that particular decision was directed by Bush, what definitely was a problem was not sending more American troops into that area to begin with. This was pretty much covered on different new sources, btw, but for those who mainly get their "news" from Fox...

Here is a summary

War in Afghanistan: Battle of Tora Bora

Through the day on December 13, bin Laden's radio messages became increasingly desperate. After one these broadcasts, a Delta Force team observed 50 men moving into a nearby cave. One of the men was tentatively identified as bin Laden. Calling in massive air strikes, the Special Forces troops believed that bin Laden died in the cave as his radio went silent. Pushing through the remainder of Tora Bora, it was found that the cave systems were not as complex as originally thought and the area was largely secured by December 17.
Coalition teams returned to Tora Bora six months after the battle to search for bin Laden's body but to no avail. With the release of a new video in October 2004, it was confirmed that he had survived the battle and remained at large.

 

[metis]

Here is a summary

War in Afghanistan: Battle of Tora Bora

Through the day on December 13, bin Laden's radio messages became increasingly desperate. After one these broadcasts, a Delta Force team observed 50 men moving into a nearby cave. One of the men was tentatively identified as bin Laden. Calling in massive air strikes, the Special Forces troops believed that bin Laden died in the cave as his radio went silent. Pushing through the remainder of Tora Bora, it was found that the cave systems were not as complex as originally thought and the area was largely secured by December 17.
Coalition teams returned to Tora Bora six months after the battle to search for bin Laden's body but to no avail. With the release of a new video in October 2004, it was confirmed that he had survived the battle and remained at large.

Which doesn't disagree with anything I had said. Also, let me remind you of the obvious fact that most of our resources went to our military forces in Iraq versus Afghanistan, which also wasn't the brightest of all strategic moves.

 

[metis]

BTW, just skimming about Tora Bora, I ran across this:

...But the largest mistake made by President George W. Bush and Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld was their failure to examine and intervene in the affairs of the military. Throughout the Battle of Tora Bora, neither the president nor the secretary of defense was directly engaged in the most important operation of the U.S. war in Afghanistan.

Indeed, how could an engaged president and secretary of defense – who questioned and prodded the military commander about the significant battles being waged, the location of Osama bin Laden, the possibility of his escape, the whereabouts of concentrations of al Qaeda forces in Afghanistan, the reliability of local partners, the “knowns and unknowns,” and the tactics utilized by American forces – allow a battle for the existence of al Qaeda to be waged by ninety-three Western commandos and a contingent of generally untrustworthy Afghan rebels without any reliable force to seal the escape routes?... -- How Bin Laden Escaped in 2001

 

[CMike]

Which doesn't disagree with anything I had said. Also, let me remind you of the obvious fact that most of our resources went to our military forces in Iraq versus Afghanistan, which also wasn't the brightest of all strategic moves.

Not at that time.

 

[metis]

Not at that time.

Yes and no. Even though this was prior to our actions in Iraq and Afghanistan in terms of actually officially going to war, it certainly appeared that the administration was far more focused on Iraq than Afghanistan even that early. Part of this is understandable because of our pre-occupation with Sadam and the issue with the no-fly zone and the issue of WMD's.

No matter how one may try and paint it, this was only one of a series of terrible decisions by that administration.

 

[Maldini]

I honestly think he is an honest guy. I've seen the criticism and most of the times they reek of racism.

I know it's tough for white people to accept a black guy as a president. They are supposed to be rappers and NBA players or in jail or in Wal-mart, not presidents.

He's handled his foreign policy int the most pro-american way I've ever seen. If people really think he's shown weakness by not interfering in Ukraine and other places, then I don't know what to say.

And considering the two nutbags he ran against, McCain and Romney I think he was the best choice at the time. America was on the verge of craziness, he has controlled and managed it.

 

[metis]

BTW, just another brief summary of an article about this:

...One clear mistake is the failure to dedicate additional troops to an operation in the Tora Bora mountains in December 2001. As the terrorism analyst Peter Bergen wrote in "The Longest War, Tora Bora represented “the last, best chance to capture bin Laden” — until now.

A second error was the eagerness with which the U.S. went to war in Iraq thereafter, causing the diversion of resources from Afghanistan/Pakistan. The Iraq war, as Vice President Dick Cheney said, was driven in part by our thinking that “we need to battle them (the terrorists) overseas so we don’t have to battle them here at home.” Criticizing this paradigm is not just Monday morning quarterbacking... -- The Iraq War Helped Bin Laden - NYTimes.com

 

[CMike]

BTW, just another brief summary of an article about this:

...One clear mistake is the failure to dedicate additional troops to an operation in the Tora Bora mountains in December 2001. As the terrorism analyst Peter Bergen wrote in "The Longest War, Tora Bora represented “the last, best chance to capture bin Laden” — until now.

A second error was the eagerness with which the U.S. went to war in Iraq thereafter, causing the diversion of resources from Afghanistan/Pakistan. The Iraq war, as Vice President Dick Cheney said, was driven in part by our thinking that “we need to battle them (the terrorists) overseas so we don’t have to battle them here at home.” Criticizing this paradigm is not just Monday morning quarterbacking... -- The Iraq War Helped Bin Laden - NYTimes.com

Very easy for the arm chair generals to say.

They weren't on the ground trying to get him.

We were a 100% to go into Iraq and depose Saddam Hussein.

Cheney was right on the money as usual.

 

[CMike]

I honestly think he is an honest guy. I've seen the criticism and most of the times they reek of racism.

I know it's tough for white people to accept a black guy as a president. They are supposed to be rappers and NBA players or in jail or in Wal-mart, not presidents.

He's handled his foreign policy int the most pro-american way I've ever seen. If people really think he's shown weakness by not interfering in Ukraine and other places, then I don't know what to say.

And considering the two nutbags he ran against, McCain and Romney I think he was the best choice at the time. America was on the verge of craziness, he has controlled and managed it.

The best choice? Why? Because he has great experience as a community organizer?

Obama has been an utter disaster for this country and the rest of the world.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

The best choice? Why? Because he has great experience as a community organizer?

Obama has been an utter disaster for this country and the rest of the world.

What specific sanctions or actions did he preform or pass that has caused "disaster"? I don't want a generalized answer saying "the economy is bad!" because the economy was bad before he became president and we are becoming more and more aware of the reasons that the recovery is so slow. And none of it is the president's fault anywhere near as much as congress and the past 40 years of shoddy legislation.