Let me get this straight: are you saying that God is incapable of creating that something people could see and that would convince them of God's existence?
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Only atheists
- Thread starter interminable
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interminable
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Noone can see him by eyes
Some gnostics can see him by hearts
Actually I didn't get your mean
So... nothing we can see is evidence of God? Do I understand you correctly?
interminable
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As I told in this topic god has created a cover between us and himself just to test people.
interminable
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Nope
Everything that u can see is a masterpiece of his power as u see a car and think about its designer
It is just that I fail to see why people would be so bothered by such a simple, harmless thing as the existence of unbelievers.
Even taking for granted that Ibrahim's God is real, it must then follow that God does not particularly need us to believe in his existence.
That is good enough for God, presumably. But somehow many Christians, Muslims and even Bahai insist that we need to believe... but why?
interminable
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Even our gnostics can do somethings after their death let alone prophets
U know after passing some levels of mysticism for a gnostic being death or alive has no different. Because he is connected to god and has become a friend of god so he is alive for ever
But ordinary people are involved with their bad morals and deeds
interminable
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He doesn't true
But it doesn't mean we don't need
Actually u forgot the purpose of creation that is to know god to become a manifest of his attributes as gnostics say according to your capacity.
As I said before there is a battle between passions and reason
And god is a reward to those who obey their reasons
IndigoStorm
Member
If I was in trouble I think if I called the Ghost Busters they would probably be more help than
god/allah/yaweh whatever.
Father Heathen
Veteran Member
Sometimes one's level of desperation will surpass their level of reason, but that doesn't score a point for theism.
So then disbelief is understandable?
So then disbelief is unreasonable?
Which is it? You seem to be contradicting yourself.
I am not sure how that is relevant. You seem to attribute moral importance to the belief in a god, not on the actual existence of that god. All those arguments seem to rely on that premise. And they rely on that premise because they single out atheists, and do not include, say, believers in Apollo or other gods very different from Allah.
So, let's check it out. Was it a sensible thing for me to supplicate Jesus? Was it sensible for all those people who believed in a god different from Allah, to supplicate them?
Ciao
- viole
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You do not trust our own judgment on that matter, and you do not trust God's either?!?
Are you sure that such an attitude is justified?
This word you translate as "gnostics" may or may not be better translated as "mystics" or even "devotees" (which is a direct translation of "Muslims", I think).
In any case, it is not that I forget that. I just don't agree with that statement. I don't think there is a purpose in creation.
For that matter, I don't think there is a creation of existence itself, either.
Many people believe so. I can't say I understand why. It is such an arbitrary, questionable belief with no clear benefit.
interminable
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I mean he has shown us his way. We choose. But angels and animals have no this choice . That's why they have no hell and heaven but we have.
interminable
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One of the most interesting subjects in philosophy is فقر وجودی
Which means we not only in our original existence need god but in every moments of our life we like by his leave.
Every movements right now is powered by him. So when a gnostic see this will understand that he is nothing. He is in need of god for every moment of his life.
The point is sometimes god put a person to difficulties and problems to make him understand that no one can save him and solve the problem except for him
الأنعام
وَلَقَدْ أَرْسَلْنَا إِلَىٰ أُمَمٍ مِّن قَبْلِكَ فَأَخَذْنَاهُم بِالْبَأْسَاءِ وَالضَّرَّاءِ لَعَلَّهُمْ يَتَضَرَّعُونَ
And We have already sent [messengers] to nations before you, [O Muhammad]; then We seized them with poverty and hardship that perhaps they might humble themselves [to Us]. (42)
There are lots of story about our gnostics that by trusting god in these situations the door of reality has been opened to them.
interminable
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I don't know what u are looking for but first I started this topic I didn't want to involve logic.
But for your question for those who believe in God or god's and the situation is so tough that no one can help u isn't sensible to make a supplication????? Is it good to sit down and watch your death????
There is a proverb in Arabic
The person that is in swamp does whatever even he grabs a stem to save himself
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There is something similar in English: there are no atheists in foxholes.
Both the arabic and the english proverbs are inherently equivalent.
Ciao
- viole
“People say there are no atheists in foxholes. A lot of people think this is a good argument against atheism. Personally, I think it's a much better argument against foxholes.”
― Kurt Vonnegut
I like the way he thinks.
interminable
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Although it isn't in my Oxford dictionary
No, you said he hid himself from humanity to "test" us.