Pat Robertson says Haiti under a Curse

[JMorris]

Good ole Pat is very important! He is a shining example of what all of us do not want to be like! Unless we are insane that is...

You're such an inspiration for the ways that I will never ever choose to be
Oh so many ways for me to show you how your savior has abandoned you

- Judith by A Perfect Circle

 

[Mr Cheese]

In a way it is us and them. And Jesus said:
Matthew 24:7-10 (New International Version)

7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.
9"Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other,


Is there any other way to say it, us and them.



I an asking about the traditional African rituals and beliefs. You brought it up.

yes its the end of days

:sarcastic never mind I find literalism to be problematic and frankly idiotic...

but there

 

[Riverwolf]

It does make one winder though? Indonesia (tsunami), Iran (earthquake), Twin Towers (terrorism), Haiti (Earth Quake), Pakistan (earthquake), Mexico (Drug terrorism), California (earthquakes).

Matthew 24:6-11 (New International Version)

6You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.
9"Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people.



Mark 13:5-11 (New International Version)


5Jesus said to them: "Watch out that no one deceives you. 6Many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am he,' and will deceive many. 7When you hear of wars and rumors of wars, do not be alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 8Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be earthquakes in various places, and famines. These are the beginning of birth pains.
9"You must be on your guard. You will be handed over to the local councils and flogged in the synagogues. On account of me you will stand before governors and kings as witnesses to them. 10And the gospel must first be preached to all nations. 11Whenever you are arrested and brought to trial, do not worry beforehand about what to say. Just say whatever is given you at the time, for it is not you speaking, but the Holy Spirit.


Luke 21:8-15 (New International Version)


8He replied: "Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am he,' and, 'The time is near.' Do not follow them. 9When you hear of wars and revolutions, do not be frightened. These things must happen first, but the end will not come right away."
10Then he said to them: "Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. 11There will be great earthquakes, famines and pestilences in various places, and fearful events and great signs from heaven.
12"But before all this, they will lay hands on you and persecute you. They will deliver you to synagogues and prisons, and you will be brought before kings and governors, and all on account of my name. 13This will result in your being witnesses to them. 14But make up your mind not to worry beforehand how you will defend yourselves. 15For I will give you words and wisdom that none of your adversaries will be able to resist or contradict.

I am not agreeing with Pat, just point out other things.

The number of disasters, natural or not, hasn't gone up. However, our ability to notice them has significantly increased.

 

[JMorris]

yes its the end of days

:sarcastic never mind I find literalism to be problematic and frankly idiotic...

but there

its been "the end of days" for quite a number of days now, going on about 2000 years, its always just around the next corner

 

[challupa]

its been "the end of days" for quite a number of days now, going on about 2000 years, its always just around the next corner

Peeks around the corner..... you wouldn't believe what I see.....

 

[Riverwolf]

I was in the NC flood from hurricane Floyd, My home was safe, drug and prostitution infested areas were hardest hit, there was also damage across the board (some very nice areas) but as I said the worst hit were the most sinful areas. An entire town was wiped out, Princeville.

Were these "sinful" areas ghettos?

 

[Archer]

The number of disasters, natural or not, hasn't gone up. However, our ability to notice them has significantly increased.

These areas have been populated for thousands of years as well. The level of deaths keeps increasing in these areas. The level of death in other areas remains level.

 

[Mr Cheese]

Were these "sinful" areas ghettos?

Yeah Jesus hated the poor, the down trodden, those forced into prostitution in order to earn wages....

Jesus only loved the pious man, that read the bible...

:sarcastic or was that Paul?

 

[Riverwolf]

You know the region I live in has one of the highest AIDS rates in the state: • Nash and Edgecombe counties experience high rates of HIV/AIDS in African American communities: In
Nash, 78% of people living with HIV/AIDS as of 2002 were African American, although only 34% of
the county’s population was African American; in Edgecombe County, 89% of HIV/AIDS cases were
African American, where African Americans represent 58% of the county population.

Drugs as well as prostitution are a big cause.

Divine punishment is not needed for those, as HIV is an STD; of course it's going to be more widespread in areas where there is a high degree of prostitution. It can also be transferred through blood; therefore, it follows that using shared needles is going to spread the virus.

 

[Archer]

If all three of the verses are read you will see I am not point to end of days. Nowhere does it say end of days, more like the precursor to the end.

 

[Mr Cheese]

These areas have been populated for thousands of years as well. The level of deaths keeps increasing in these areas. The level of death in other areas remains level.

statistics please....

please provide proof that areas of the world governed by satan
are more likely to have higher mortality rates...

Lets see...

lets start with China, that is NOT a christian nation and doesn't have a mass of bible readers.....
..........

• In 2000, the People's Republic of China government census enumerated 4 million Chinese Catholics and 10 million ‎Protestants[32]. The Chinese government once stated that only 1% (13 million) [33] of the population is Christian while the Chinese Embassy has stated that 10 Million (0.75%)[34] are Christian.

• The official figure in 2002, which consists of members from official Protestant churches, is about 15 million, while some estimates on members of Chinese house churches vary from 50 million to 100 million.

• In 2006 it was stated that there were 4 million members of the Chinese Patriotic Catholic Association and an estimated 12 million members of the underground Roman Catholic Church in China as of 2006.[35] Kiven Choy stated, in a Chinese weekly newspaper in Hong Kong, that the correct number of Protestants in China should be at around 20 million[citation needed], while Time Magazine reported 65 million in 2006.[36]

• In October 2007 two surveys were conducted to estimate the number of Christians in China. One poll was held by Protestant missionary Werner Burklin, the other one by Liu Zhongyu from East China Normal University in Shanghai. The surveys were conducted independently and during different periods, but they reached the same results.[13][14] According to these studies, there are roughly 54 million Christians in China, of which 39 million are Protestants and 14 million are Catholics as the most common and reliable figure among others.[13][14][15]

• In 2008 the official number is 20 million in the Official Protestant churches and 10 million in the Official Catholic Church. According to China Aid Association, Ye Xiaowen, the director of the government body which supervises all religions in China, said privately that the figure was indeed as much as 130 millions in early 2008.[20] The claim was denied by Mrs. Guo Wei, director of the Foreign Affairs Department in Beijing[citation needed]. Some bloggers had attributed the report to the official Xinhua News Agency, which denied having reported anything such.[12]. According to John Micklethwait "a conservative guess" (as at the end of 2008) "is that there are at least 65 million Protestants in China and 12 million Catholics"[31]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_China

Population of China 1.3 Billion http://www.google.com/publicdata?ds=wb-wdi&met=sp_pop_totl&idim=country:CHN&q=chinese+population

1.3 billion divided by 78 million= a country that is fully run by satan!!!

 

[sojourner]

I was in the NC flood from hurricane Floyd, My home was safe, drug and prostitution infested areas were hardest hit, there was also damage across the board (some very nice areas) but as I said the worst hit were the most sinful areas. An entire town was wiped out, Princeville.

We need to take into consideration that, by and large, the "crime areas" are areas of poverty. And we all know that areas of poverty have the least supportive infrastructure. Therefore, disasters "hit" or affect those areas "harder." Haiti was hit hard, not because its people practice voodoo, but because Haiti is poverty-stricken (precisely because of the Christian imperialists who have systematically destroyed both its populace and its environment for their own purposes) and lacks the infrastructure to effectively combat such disasters.

 

[Gentoo]

Well, I'm convinced! I've seen the light and off to the local church to pray rather than send relief aid!

 

[Archer]

Divine punishment is not needed for those, as HIV is an STD; of course it's going to be more widespread in areas where there is a high degree of prostitution. It can also be transferred through blood; therefore, it follows that using shared needles is going to spread the virus.

And if these people were following scripture? Wh oknows but as I said look at the where and when.

 

[sojourner]

And if these people were following scripture? Wh oknows but as I said look at the where and when.

That's not fair at all. I know folks who have contracted STDs simply because they got accidentally stuck with a contaminated surgical sharp while working in surgery. These people were good, Christian folk.

I know one lady who's a fine Christian woman, and contracted herpes from her husband, who couldn't keep his snake in the proper pit.

"Following scripture" has little to do with it, at least from the victims' standpoint.

 

[Riverwolf]

These areas have been populated for thousands of years as well. The level of deaths keeps increasing in these areas. The level of death in other areas remains level.

"Thousands" of years? How can we possibly measure that?

Especially since Europeans have only been here for about 500 years.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

You know it is a shame we can't single out individual members and call them what they really are.
I think there should be the rare exception, like an amendment to the RF constitution for really special people.

Absolutely amazing, the level of stupidity of some people.

 

[sojourner]

These areas have been populated for thousands of years as well. The level of deaths keeps increasing in these areas. The level of death in other areas remains level.

The death rate is high because the poverty level is high. It has very, very little to do with religion, other than the fact that the white Christians are largely responsible for perpetuating the poverty in many of these areas.

 

[Amill]

As do I. As I said look at where the most death occurs.

Yea generally in areas where disasters are MORE LIKELY to occur, based on LOCATION. And areas that aren't as well developed as others. Your point? Does god direct true believers to settle down away from geologically active locations? Does a belief in a christian god lead to scientific advancements(like microorganisms, not demons, cause disease) and more knowledge that leads to a better developed, and safer country? How do you explain a country like Japan, with one of the highest life expentancies and lowest infant mortality rates, but only a ~1% christian population? Not only that, but it's in the ring of fire and has many earthquakes and has a large number of active volcanoes. Yet even in 1995 when they had an earthquake similar to the size of the one in Haiti, only about 6,000 people died. Was it their christian faith that allowed them to suffer 100,000 less deaths than in Haiti? Even when their population was more than 10x than that of Haiti? Seriously....

Earthquake in Japan in 1923 kills 140,000 people. population 1% christian
Earthquake in Japan in 1995 kills 6,000 people. population 1% christian
Nuff Said.

To the op
It really makes me sad to see people blaming tragedies on people's beliefs about the cosmos. I don't believe it is a person's fault what they believe, I feel our beliefs are the result of all of our experiences and the knowledge we feel we have. I don't think we have any conscious control and I find it hard to see the logic in punishment for having the "wrong" beliefs. Makes me kind of sick in my stomach when people like Robertson and Fallwell makes comments like that. Fallwell didn't make it to the rapture and I can't honestly say that I'll feel bad when Robertson dies, as bad as that sounds.

 

[LittleNipper]

far better that morals never change

that homosexuals stay in closets, beaten to death and ostracised if found out...

and women, officially unable to enjoy sex, should be lobotomized at the first sign of orgasm...

:sarcastic these were good common values that existed before and during the depression

:sarcastic hmm maybe God approves of lobotomies?

Actually, it would seem homosexuals rape their fellow inmates in prison. Nice butt you got there-----don't drop your soap in the shower --fella....

As for lobotomies, that was a humanistic secular responce that had noting to do with the CHURCH.

I talked to my grandparents and other older people and the common thread was that the Depression was felt by many too have been the result of sin. It is as simple as that.

Yes, American society has always sinned, but generally it also has been remorseful and understanding of ramifications. In the 1920's America began to get a little too "modern" for its own good.

What we are facing today is once again an error of thinking, that we can do anything we wish and there are is no piper to pay. There is no GOD --- we can fix everything. Such ideas result in digging one's own grave...