Please define the word at security 1 Thessalonians 5:3

[Benoni]

One of the problems we have had is that we have thought that God intended all along to save all who would ever be saved during this age! That is not the case at all. Acts 15:16 attests to this as do other scriptures. "After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: (Why, why, why?) THAT THE RESIDUE (the rest, the remainder) OF MEN (of mankind) MIGHT SEEK AFTER THE LORD, and all the Gentiles upon whom my name is called . . ." IN THE NEXT AGE AND "IN THE AGES TO COME!" "He that raised us up together, and MADE us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: (Why?) That in theages tocome HE MIGHT SHOW (show it to whom except to those who are yet to bend the kneeand bow the heart?) THE EXCEEDING KINDNESS OF HIS GRACE IN HIS KINDNESS TOWARD US THROUGH JESUS CHRIST" --Ephesians 2:6,7. "For in grace, through faith, are you saved, and this is not out of you; it is God's approach present, not of works, lest anyone should be boasting" --Eph.2:8 CLNT (Concordant Literal New Testament).

Again you say,"Isn't it possible that in all the verses you cite, that God is saying He offers salvation to all men? For example, if I was in a prison camp and a certain man was scheduled for execution, I could give (in my heart) and offer (physically) my life for his. I could offer to him my very life, but he MIGHT refuse. (This actually happened to Richard Wurmbrand) John 3:17 says, ". . . that the world through Him MIGHT be saved," not will be saved."
George Hawtin

 

[Benoni]

The other issue is the point ultimate salvation for all people. I have debated a multiple of believers over the years and most of them refuse to even look a post that would believe such an extreme belief and cannot see how it can be based on sound Biblical evidence. I am declaring NOW the whole concept of eternal hell is based on a few key words and verse which can be easily refuted if the believer would just open their spiritual eyes.
Then you have some who when verses I presented declaring, these truth either they refuse to address the verse, or fight it with everything they have because there is NOTHING more important than defending ones religious turf. But in the end they are proven wrong because God’s truth is always out there if you are really seeking it.
I myself leave no stone overturned when it comes to my quest for truth because I have learned over the years God hides his deep truth and it is my mission as an overcomer to have those truth revealed or unveiled to me.
Here is an interesting start point: The real problem with words like eternal everlasting and for ever and ever is the Babylonian religious system that refuse to look outside of their man made religious box. The seminaries keep puppeting the same old doctrines of damnations generation after generation. Occasionally you will find a Bible scholar willing to agree with the following. A careful study of the Greek word “aionios” (translated as “eternal,” “everlasting,” and “forever and ever” in our English translations) shows that it comes from the Greek noun “aion” which always means “an indeterminate period of time.” It is a most unfortunate thing that the translators of old chose to translate “aionios” from the Latin language rather than the Greek from which the word is derived. God’s punishment will not last forever as is commonly taught, but will only last for the ages and only UNTIL God’s purpose for it is complete.
Eternal, eternity, etc. is not actually found in Scripture though in some aspects applied through inference of propositions. The problem is that the Greek words which were translated to "eternal" actually do not translate properly in English because there is no word in English which translates it properly. In this case, the word is "AIONIOS" and it is a descriptive adjective which just means "of, or in, or belonging to, or coming from, or resmbling, or befitting the AION.

AION is a noun meaning, "A period of time, or perpetuity of time, or definitive age, or unbroken age." It simply means an age with unknown measure which can be in definitive or definitive.

So literally the word "AIONIOS" being translated as "Eternal" would more accurately be defined as "agely"; however since "agely" is not a real word, that leaves the English language without a literal translation for the word "AIONIOS".

So anytime you saw Jesus say "Eternal" this and "Eternal" that, he didn't say "perpetually of time" but rather an indeterminate duration that is neither perpetual nor definitive.

 

[savagewind]

I am able to see how security is related to eternal and that eternal (without end) is like you say. There exists no true security and eternity is not mentioned in connection to God's Kingdom which is where all the good things do come from. James 1:17 Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows.

The fact (I believe it is a fact) that God's Kingdom in relation to humankind as something eternal is not mentioned in Scripture (any scripure, I suppose) means something, I'm sure.

Question for Benoni please: Why do you think God's truth remains hidden from most people?

 

[savagewind]

There is something missing from Jehovah's Witness dogma. They have no information about what will happen to the 144,000 after Jesus hands back the Kingdom to God The Father.

 

[Benoni]

I am able to see how security is related to eternal and that eternal (without end) is like you say. There exists no true security and eternity is not mentioned in connection to God's Kingdom which is where all the good things do come from. James 1:17 Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows.

The fact (I believe it is a fact) that God's Kingdom in relation to humankind as something eternal is not mentioned in Scripture (any scripure, I suppose) means something, I'm sure.

Question for Benoni please: Why do you think God's truth remains hidden from most people?

I think it is a real honor and privilege to called out to hear and see what God truly is doing. I am real short on time this morning but let me show you a few verses.

2Th 2:11
(ALT) And for this reason God will send to them a supernatural working of deception, for them to believe the lie,

First of all the world is left out because:
1 Corinthians 2:13-15 (Amp)
14But the natural, nonspiritual man does not accept or welcome or admit into his heart the gifts and teachings and revelations of the Spirit of God, for they are folly (meaningless nonsense) to him; and he is incapable of knowing them [of progressively recognizing, understanding, and becoming better acquainted with them] because they are spiritually discerned and estimated and appreciated.
Pro. 25: 2
It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, But the glory of kings is to search out a matter
Matthew 13
13:13 Therefore I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.

13:14 And in them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled, which says: 'Hearing you will hear and shall not understand, And seeing you will see and not perceive;

13:15 For the hearts of this people have grown dull. Their ears are hard of hearing, And their eyes they have closed, Lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them.'

13:16 "But blessed are your eyes for they see, and your ears for they hear;

We will discuss this more later today when I get back.

 

[Benoni]

There is something missing from Jehovah's Witness dogma. They have no information about what will happen to the 144,000 after Jesus hands back the Kingdom to God The Father.

1 Corin 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world (age) are come.

God speaks thought His Word in many hidden and ways the below verse speaks of parable; but I will also add spiritual or scriptural numbers, mysteries (Gk) Sacred secrets, used 20 times in NT) patterns, types, different languages, even deceptions to hide His word from the religious, the , wise, the carnal; and reveal it to babes. A babe is not the same as someone who can handle the milk of the word, anyone can handle milk; but a babe is like my small grandchildren when I speak to them; they trust everything I say, they have ears to hear.

144,000 is not a number assigned to a certain grop and that is, it is a spiritual number


Twelve speaks of Divine Government; a few examples; 12 Tribes, 12 Disciples, 12 Gates of Jerusalem,

144 (12x12=144) 12 is the perfect number, representing Devine perfection in the government in the kingdom of God

144,000 would the ultimate in devine goverment

 

[savagewind]

Thank you for those verses.

Those who fit that description, but who also believe they see, accuse all the people who do not believe in God and salvation of it. The Bible is not written for the people who don't believe. But they say the warnings in it are for them.

People are waiting on the antichrist to appear and destruction to happen but they do not realize that believing they see yet they do not is the antichrist. Does no one see that if you believe you have found something (peace and security for one) you will not look for it? I should suggest to anyone paying attention don't look for security. It isn't real.

 

[savagewind]

1 Corin 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world (age) are come.

God speaks thought His Word in many hidden and ways the below verse speaks of parable; but I will also add spiritual or scriptural numbers, mysteries (Gk) Sacred secrets, used 20 times in NT) patterns, types, different languages, even deceptions to hide His word from the religious, the , wise, the carnal; and reveal it to babes. A babe is not the same as someone who can handle the milk of the word, anyone can handle milk; but a babe is like my small grandchildren when I speak to them; they trust everything I say, they have ears to hear.

144,000 is not a number assigned to a certain grop and that is, it is a spiritual number


Twelve speaks of Divine Government; a few examples; 12 Tribes, 12 Disciples, 12 Gates of Jerusalem,

144 (12x12=144) 12 is the perfect number, representing Divine perfection in the government in the kingdom of God

144,000 would the ultimate in divine goverment

Yes. Not would be. IS. It is not good enough for them perhaps? It is good enough for me. There goes the secret. Seems Eve won't stop wanting that apple.

 

[savagewind]

Aha! We have worked out the problem. Haven't we? Peace is good but they won't have it apart from security. (troll thought) I should probably say to anyone paying attention when I have a troll thought it isn't what I wrote. It is what I didn't you know, write. I don't know why. LOL

 

[savagewind]

I suppose I write it because when it happens it feels big and troublesome like a colicky baby and :help:

 

[savagewind]

The mystery to me is people who don't want peace but care about it and people who want peace but don't care about it. Both kinds of people are wrong to want it with security as the only security there is is death. Even Hindus who believe in reincarnation seem to believe that danger is not some crazy wild thing attacking what it will. So....does anyone wish to talk about this thing it seems everyone wants?

 

[savagewind]

OK here's the thing. I am not a troll who goes about the internet posting everywhere. If there cannot be found one soul on a religious education forum that doesn't give a damn, how is it possible for me to believe there is anyone who doesn't give a damn? It is not possible.

 

[savagewind]

A damn about what? Security. No, sorry, I mean peace.

 

[savagewind]

They all want peace thier way and they want it until forever. But that is not possible. Both having it their way and having it forever are not possible. That was my troll thought. They say I am crazy. But wanting peace one's own way and wanting it to last forever are crazy. Crazy is wanting something that is not possible.

When plenty of people want something it usually becomes an epidemic of want. They want something they cannot have. That's crazy. It's an epidemic of crazy. It will only get worse.

 

[savagewind]

Maybe the "expressions inspired by demons" has somehting to do with the notion security is a real thing.

 

[savagewind]

There is not security for Heaven (there was war there)
There is not security for the heavens (science can explain)
There was not security for The Son of God
There is no security for The Earth (science and Noah can explain)
But there is security for peace*. Peace is a gift of God and God YHVH is from everlasting to everlasting.

*but peace your way isn't peace because it will always conflict with someone else's peace.

 

[savagewind]

Revelation 16:14 has been translated "war" and "battle". It means conflict.

 

[savagewind]

The Jehovah's Witnesses are in the business of producing a false peace. Their aim is for getting everyone to believe and want the same things. But even The Bible is very clear about the fact there are at least two ways to believe. For everyone to believe only one way is to eliminating the other way. What is required for elimination? Judgement and action.

 

[savagewind]

What are the two ways of believing? A person can do nothing better than to eat and drink and find satisfaction in their own toil. This too, I see, is from the hand of God Ecclesiastes 2:24

The other way is Christ's way. "My food," said Jesus, "is to do the will of him who sent me and to finish his work. John 4:34

They are making those two ways one way so there is no longer two but one.

What is wrong with judgement and action? A Christian believes Jesus is judge but they are taking it upon themselves to judge. Also, a dedicated Christian has sacrifice her own will for the will of God but they are acting independent of God. I know they are whenever they apply the cry of peace and security to the nations and not to themselves.

 

[savagewind]

Elimination requires force. Force requires work. Work is the opposite of resting.

Exodus 20:8-11

Hebrews 4:1 Therefore, since the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us be careful that none of you be found to have fallen short of it.