President Chickenhawk's Viet Nam Draft Deferments.

[Altfish]

Do you believe that Trump didn't have a legitimate medical condition? Do you believe that it should not have been the policy of the draft to defer for heel spurs? Do you feel that Trump should not have asked for deferral based on heel spurs?

If Trump had been an ordinary person, i.e. little money, scraping together a living then with the same impediments I think he'd have been fighting.

 

[Revoltingest]

If Trump had been an ordinary person, i.e. little money, scraping together a living then with the same impediments I think he'd have been fighting.

How old are you?
Lots'o guys got out of the draft with medical deferments.
And there were many other types available.
And some of just just planned to become Canuckistanians.
Just pay a buck or two to cross the bridge to Sarnia or Windsor.

 

[Sunstone]

Sooo...you think you could simply walk into any draft board office and say (in a very loud voice, of course), "I have bone spurs", and the draft board is going to say, "Okay, go home and have a nice life"? Evidently you weren't around during the Viet Nam fiasco.

Poor reading comprehension on your part? You're not responding to what I said, but are instead putting words in my mouth -- and in bad faith, too.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Speak for yourself about what's moral and immoral.

I thought I was.

I don't see conscription as an absolute evil like you do.

Then feel free to frame your position based on your views.

I see it as a relative evil. Conscription is sometimes the lesser evil. For instance, conscription in the UK, the Soviet Union, and the United States during WWII probably has a lot to do with why most of Europe isn't part of a greater German Reich today.

And WWII wouldn't have happened without the conscription-fueled slaughter of WWI.

My position is that if a cause is worth dying for, then you can convince volunteers that it's worth dying for. And if their sense of patriotism and duty isn't enough, entice them in other ways: money, for instance. Or show them that their families will be taken care of while they're away.

Life is not always Sunday school simple and conscription is not always the greatest evil. At least that's my take on it.

I don't claim that life is simple; I just draw a line at slavery.

People can - and have - come up with justifications for all sorts of horrible things from nuclear weapons to carpet-bombing to battlefield rape to conscription. Different people will draw their line at different points. All of them were done by the Allies in WWII. All of them played a role in the outcome of the war. How would the war have played out without any one of them? It's hard to say.

Having said that, the conscription of men to fight the Viet Nam war was indeed evil in my opinion, but then that fact it was evil is not at all relevant to the point being made in the OP, is it?

If the conscription is evil, then avoiding it is morally permissible. The question then is whether avoiding the draft for onesself creates an obligation to help others avoid it. I'd personally say that helping others in this regard is morally praiseworthy but not morally obligatory.

 

[idav]

Couldn't this be said about our previous administration and have more validity?

No

 

[idav]

Empathy for troops is wonderful, but veteran status is no guarantee.
I saw McCain as a great danger to getting us into more wars.
For him, it seemed to be a noble thing to suffer & die in war.
**** that!

Despite your speculation on what wars may have happened with people that are not president, currently Trump remains a danger in getting the US bombed cause he has no diplomacy skills and little regard for anything.

 

[Revoltingest]

Despite your speculation on what wars may have happened with people that are not president, currently Trump remains a danger in getting the US bombed cause he has no diplomacy skills and little regard for anything.

McCain is relevant because he's a veteran who wanted to be Prez.
And I've already said Trump poses such a danger.
We must all speculate about a candidate's future actions when we vote.
And this is why some people don't get to become President.

 

[Stevicus]

Anyway, just so you're clear on what a chicken hawk is....

There is only one true Chickenhawk, and his name is Henery.

One of Foghorn Leghorn's nemeses.

 

[Altfish]

How old are you?
Lots'o guys got out of the draft with medical deferments.
And there were many other types available.
And some of just just planned to become Canuckistanians.
Just pay a buck or two to cross the bridge to Sarnia or Windsor.

5 times???

 

[Revoltingest]

5 times???

Many did so more than once.
Does the number matter?

 

[Altfish]

Many did so more than once.
Does the number matter?

Yes, it shows concerted cowardice.

 

[Revoltingest]

Yes, it shows concerted cowardice.

I'm a big fan of cowardice, but it could also show good judgement.
Think about it....
Stupid war.
Good chance of injury or death.
Low pay.
Public disrespect...you know, being called "baby killer".
Being a tool of Johnson or Nixon.
Years wasted.
What kind of fool would do that willingly when an out is available?
Some blindly obedient uber patriot commie killer, perhaps.
What did you do?

 

[idav]

McCain is relevant because he's a veteran who wanted to be Prez.
And I've already said Trump poses such a danger.
We must all speculate about a candidate's future actions when we vote.
And this is why some people don't get to become President.

Discussing Trumps Hawkishness is relevant to others hawkishness why? Cause some want to stick to our what about guns, didn’t make it relevant.

 

[BSM1]

Poor reading comprehension on your part? You're not responding to what I said, but are instead putting words in my mouth -- and in bad faith, too.

You seem to imply that Trump did not have bone spurs and I pointed out that draft boards hardly ever took your word for it. As a matter of fact, if you went to your draft board claiming you were gay just to dodge the draft, then 9 times out of ten they would instruct you to kiss that bigass Marine sergeant on the mouth.

 

[Revoltingest]

Discussing Trumps Hawkishness is relevant to others hawkishness why? Cause some want to stick to our what about guns, didn’t make it relevant.

You were responding to my response to post #15.
If you don't like where it leads, don't respond (over & over).

 

[BSM1]

Despite your speculation on what wars may have happened with people that are not president, currently Trump remains a danger in getting the US bombed cause he has no diplomacy skills and little regard for anything.

Really? Picture this: one President bows down, apologizes for us to the world, and depletes the military. Another President tells the world you bomb us and we'll bomb the hell out of you. If you were so inclined which President would you want to bomb?

 

[idav]

You were responding to my response to post #15.
If you don't like where it leads, don't respond (over & over).

I’ve read the thread so I know how it all leads to subject changing.

 

[tytlyf]

He is.
Do you disagree?
Ref....
Joe Biden - Wikipedia

Bill Clinton - Wikipedia

Educational deferments?
Compared to bone spurs that probably never existed?

I guess that's not as bad as Ted "Private Poopy-Pants" Nugent getting a mental illness deferment.

 

[idav]

Really? Picture this: one President bows down, apologizes for us to the world, and depletes the military. Another President tells the world you bomb us and we'll bomb the hell out of you. If you were so inclined which President would you want to bomb?

Is this supposed to be an argument against Trumps lack of deplomacy or lack of regard?

 

[BSM1]

Is this supposed to be an argument against Trumps lack of deplomacy or lack of regard?

It's in response for your baseless fear of some country bombing us simply because Trump is neither a diplomatic nor a politician (thank God).