Quran is free of errors

[YmirGF]

I just happen to find it fascinating the lengths he is willing to go to in order to protect/ratify his beliefs.
It is most revealing.

I also find much amusement with eselam coming in here with his two cents every once in a while. He just adds whole new levels to the fascination and amusement factors.

Agreed, it is always instructive how a fanatic can make 1+1=22 and not burst our laughing.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

Agreed, it is always instructive how a fanatic can make 1+1=22 and not burst our laughing.

I can't laugh. It just goes beyound facepalm or funny.

 

[Zhakir]

"...And a route he followed, until when he reached the setting of the sun, he found it to set in a miry fount; and hard by he found a people...Then followed he a route until when he reached the rising of the sun he found it to rise on a people to whom we had given no shelter from it." (Sura 18:83-89).

"He hath spread the earth as a bed, and hath traced out paths for you therein, and hath sent down rain from Heaven, and by it we bring forth the kinds of various herbs..." (Sura 20:55).

"Who hath made the earth a bed for you, and the heaven a covering, and hath caused water to come down from heaven, and by it hath brought forth fruits for your sustenance!" (Sura 2:20).​

"And God hath spread the earth for you like a carpet,
That ye may walk therein along spacious paths." (Sura 71:18-19).

But i forgot, every single translation of the Quran in the world is, except for yours.​

v.86
Until, when he reached the setting of the sun, he found it set in a spring of murky water: Near it he found a People: We said: "OZul-qarnain! (thou hast authority,) either to punish them, or to treat them with kindness."
v.90
Until, when he came to the rising of the sun, he found it rising on a people for whom We had provided no covering protection againstthe sun.

sun doesn't actually set or rise.in the verses refer to time.
---------------
The other verses
the arabic word مهد used here doesn't mean bed shape at all,The verses mean, we made earth easy and comfortable to live in.
ßáãÇÊ :: áÓÇä ÇáÚÑÈ : ãåÏ
74:14
وَمَهَّدتُّ لَهُ تَمْهِيدًا
To whom I made (life) smooth and comfortable!

The same مهد
is used her it doesn't mean bed shaped.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

sun doesn't actually set or rise.in the verses refer to time.

No **** Sherlock.

 

[Zhakir]

It's not up to you,this is the way it is

v.86
Until, when he reached the setting of the sun, he found it set in a spring of murky water: Near it he found a People: We said: "OZul-qarnain! (thou hast authority,) either to punish them, or to treat them with kindness."
v.90
Until, when he came to the rising of the sun, he found it rising on a people for whom We had provided no covering protection againstthe sun.

sun doesn't actually set or rise.in the verses refer to time.
---------------
The other verses
the arabic word مهد used here doesn't mean bed shape at all,The verses mean, we made earth easy and comfortable to live in.
ßáãÇÊ :: áÓÇä ÇáÚÑÈ : ãåÏ
74:14
وَمَهَّدتُّ لَهُ تَمْهِيدًا
To whom I made (life) smooth and comfortable!

The same مهد
is used her it doesn't mean bed shaped.

 

[Gharib]

Then why does Zhakir present the Quran as a textbook to us, always telling us of its great miracles?

well thats because it is a great miracle.

You seriously think the world has he Quran to thank for all the discoveries? That is just silly now. I think we all know that is not true.

you are right, the quran doesn't tell us how to discover things, it just tells us about things. it is up to us to find them and analyse them.
we aren't thanking the quran for the discoveries, we are simply acknowledging that what it has and what we have disovered are the same thing. they do not go against each other. the quran is a starting point to many things if not all

 

[Gharib]

He wants to tell me my religion; i'll tell him his prophet.

you are not going to tell us anything we already don't know.

you are going to say that he married a 9 year old girl.

so, what?

told you we know that.

 

[Gharib]

You are.
But you your stubborn fanaticism will not let you see it.

and vise versa to you.

why is it that none of you can't stand it when someone is giving clear evidence about the quran,
you guys clearly can't dissprove it, then you end up saying all sorts of trash.

please keep the tone to a minimum ok, don't use such childish words, if you can't stand it then you are free to leave, this applies to everyone.

 

[Gharib]

Hehe. This is coming from someone who is on record as saying all old people you have met are stupid?

i never said "stupid", i may have said arrogant or ignorant or maybe one or 2 other words, such as they do not accept the truth from a younger man, see how i was right.

Eselam, there is a bit of a difference between outfoxing a very young man and outfoxing a grown adult.

it seems i don't know of a diference in that, since there is one older man dissproving or arguing with a younger man.

thats the same in both cases, how is that any different?

and does Don look like any ordinary kid to you?

 

[Don Penguinoini]

you are not going to tell us anything we already don't know.

you are going to say that he married a 9 year old girl.

so, what?

told you we know that.

You say it like your proud. So Muhammed was a paedophile?

 

[Don Penguinoini]

well thats because it is a great miracle.



you are right, the quran doesn't tell us how to discover things, it just tells us about things. it is up to us to find them and analyse them.
we aren't thanking the quran for the discoveries, we are simply acknowledging that what it has and what we have disovered are the same thing. they do not go against each other. the quran is a starting point to many things if not all

I will not argue, there are some things in the Quran which are out of the ordinary for a religious text, but that is it, no miracles. As far as I can see, it does not lie with the religion, but with the people. Aryabhatt was a Hindu, and he did a LOT of great things, but we cannot credit the religion for it, maybe the people, but it is the individual that does it.

 

[Gharib]

I will not argue, there are some things in the Quran which are out of the ordinary for a religious text, but that is it, no miracles. As far as I can see, it does not lie with the religion, but with the people. Aryabhatt was a Hindu, and he did a LOT of great things, but we cannot credit the religion for it, maybe the people, but it is the individual that does it.

but he has been influenced by his religion.

if his religion spoke about something in brief , then he goes to make the discovery or actually prove that very point, then he has been influenced by his religion. the religion takes all the credit, he would not have made the discovery if it wasn't mentioned in the scripture wich was the starting point of the discoverie.

how would someone prove that people eat to generate strenght from food, unless someone starved and became very weak, then when eating something he gains his energy. see the starvation was the starting point.

 

[Gharib]

You say it like your proud. So Muhammed was a paedophile?

no muhammed was not a pedophile, he never had any sexual relations with her untill she was older.

but what i am not proud of is, non muslims being proud of this:

Grandfather sentenced in sex abuse case
Published: December 5th, 2007

NORWICH – A man convicted of molesting his granddaughter apologized to the court and his family Monday, but did not apologize to the victim or admit his guilt.

you can read it here

The Evening Sun | Grandfather sentenced in sex abuse case

and Don, we all know that this isn't the only case of the sort.
try to remember about the actions of non muslims that are being done in todays society before you take a look at the society that about 1400 years old, about which you and i have very limited knowledge.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

but he has been influenced by his religion.

if his religion spoke about something in brief , then he goes to make the discovery or actually prove that very point, then he has been influenced by his religion. the religion takes all the credit, he would not have made the discovery if it wasn't mentioned in the scripture wich was the starting point of the discoverie.

how would someone prove that people eat to generate strenght from food, unless someone starved and became very weak, then when eating something he gains his energy. see the starvation was the starting point.

This may be so for Muslim scientists, but i think almost any other scientist is never driven by religion, maybe philosophy, but no religion. Even then, i highly doubt Arabic mathematicians and scientists kept their work and religion seperate.

 

[Gharib]

This may be so for Muslim scientists, but i think almost any other scientist is never driven by religion, maybe philosophy, but no religion.

exactly see, something is always the starting point, and for muslims it is the relgion.

Even then, i highly doubt Arabic mathematicians and scientists kept their work and religion seperate.

islam is life for us, it isn't just another part of life, so everything that we do is because of religion. the way we present our self is because of our religion, the way we talk is because of our religion, everything that we do is because of our religion, but we must also remember that not everyone can be perfect, many people do things that aren't part of religion.

a christian man said this to me a few months ago

"if we all live our religions to the full, the world would be a better place, it doesn't matter that they are not the same religion"

his point was that all religions are peacefull and are encouraging it's followers to be good people, but some do not listen, so thats why you see one religion going against another.

 

[The Voice of Reason]

Ok
Quran Miracles | THE SUN ALSO MOVES ALONG

No, no, no. That won't do, at all.

You are trying to compare a vague, poorly worded verse from your sacred text with a concise, well researched article that is based on peer reviewed scientific data.

This is the very crux of your entire position.

You are claiming that the Koran is a scientific book, that has provided mankind with all of this information - and instead of using the Koran, you have to resort to a secular text to bolster your argument.

Why is the data that you are using not listed in the Koran?

 

[Gharib]

You are claiming that the Koran is a scientific book,

the quran isn't a science book. it is a guide.

 

[The Voice of Reason]

Hehe. This is coming from someone who is on record as saying all old people you have met are stupid? Eselam, there is a bit of a difference between outfoxing a very young man and outfoxing a grown adult.

Well, to be fair about it, Ymir, we have to give eselam credit.

After all, he is admitting that he and Zhakir haven't been able to defend their position against the rational arguments being presented.

 

[The Voice of Reason]

if you can't stand it then you are free to leave, this applies to everyone.

Yourself included - right?

This thread really needs to be shut down. It has devolved into nothing more than two zealots proseltyzing about their sacred text, and the rest of us trying to spit into the wind.

 

[Gharib]

Well, to be fair about it, Ymir, we have to give eselam credit.

After all, he is admitting that he and Zhakir haven't been able to defend their position against the rational arguments being presented.

is that the best you can do to deffend your age difference to all the other younger members here?

if so then why bring it up in the first place, we all know that there is a varying age difference here in RF, so why bring that cheap argument when there is nothing more to say.