Religious Nationalism in the US

[Viker]

what for?

It's an official document from our earlier years that expresses that we our neither a Christian nation nor founded on Christian religion. It's context is something Christian nationalists, conveniently, choose to ignore or write off.

 

[metis]

He drove the snakes out of Ireland. This was a metaphor; snake=Pagan religions. Maybe in the spirit of St Patrick, we can drive the Snakes out of Washington, and restore freedom for all.

But the MAGA Republicans refuse to leave.

 

[F1fan]

Representative Judy Chu is being attacked by the far right for being sympathetic to the Communists in China. She is an American, and there is no basis for this kind of zenophobic, anti-American rhetoric. This is what we have to look out for, the lack of patriotism and support for duley elected officials only because they are of obvious non-European descent. Look at how some members of congress are called "the Squad", and is meant in a derogatory way. Where's the "Christian love" with this kind of racist trope?

 

[Father Heathen]

what for?

"the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." - John Adams

 

[Sand Dancer]

The USA was built on the principles of individual rights, liberties and Religious freedom. If nationalism is how free people wish to practice their freedom of religion, it is within their Constitutional rights. It is not these Christians who are burning Churches and Temples. This comes from the Anti-religious Atheist and Leftist who do this. This topic is really about pushback forming against the criminals in power.

The USA was also built on the principle of limited government control. The USA was a unique experiment in human history away from the age old way of the monarchies of Europe and the world, which controlled everything in their countries. There was no middle class and one was stuck in a social position.

The Left prefers big government, all the way to Socialism and an overbearing regulatory state. If any US government is in violation; tries to move back to the monarchy, the Constitution says the people are obliged to step up and reform that country of the people, by the people and for the people. The Christian Nationalist do not tax you or push your country into a huge deficit connected to Socialist style entitlements; 70% of the debt. This is a clear violation of the Constitution and limited Government; $30 trillion in debt that enslaves once free people.

The Republican investigative committees recently questioned Biden's Attorney General and the Director of the FBI. They asked them the question, why the government has only investigated and prosecuted members of pro-life groups, but has not enforce the law for the pro-abortion people, who have burnt churches and family clinics? This government also went after parents and tried to define them as domestic terrorists, if they accept the Woke religions force taught in schools.

The Government is not supposed to target religious groups and ignore all Lefty crimes; 2020 Summer of Lefty riots. This corrupt disfunction in Government needed push back, which is what the Religious people are doing. The answer, by the Attorney General, for his dual standard in enforcement was, "well the religious people do their crimes during the day, while the Left sneaks around at night. It was easier to go after day people, instead of the night stalkers. The FBI must be very incompetent these days. It is no longer about solving crime, but making numbers for one side; trying to establish a religion.

The Constitution does not allow the government to make law that regulate or establish religion; bullying only the religious with the FBI and then endorsing Woke and Gender Religions via teacher unions. The woke religion is based on plagiarizing the religious concept of Original Sin; if you are white; Adam and Eve, you must pay for the past, since your sin is because of that past; original sin and not your own actions. This is in violation of the establishment clause.

This corrupt dual standard is the root of the problem and why many people are using the freedom of religion, since it has the power to get Government to stop trying to establish bizarre alternate reality religions, that can deemed pathology by science. Once the government is placed back on its leash, then this Nationalism will not be needed.

Freedom of speech was violated when the Swamp backed government started to censor its citizens. This would have been buried and denied if Twitter had not been set right. This move back toward monarchy control is in full violation of the Constitution. This did require a push back by Christianity.

We are coming up on Saint Patrick's day. He drove the snakes out of Ireland. This was a metaphor; snake=Pagan religions. Maybe in the spirit of St Patrick, we can drive the Snakes out of Washington, and restore freedom for all.

The right prefers big government socially and the left prefers big government fiscally. Libertarians prefer small government in both arenas.

 

[Father Heathen]

No. It's clear some desperately want government overreach as a priority when it comes to someone else's children.

You mean like banning LGBT books from libraries?

 

[Viker]

The right prefers big government socially and the left prefers big government fiscally. Libertarians prefer small government in both arenas.

Factor in military spending and things like the war on drugs...the right loves both options. But the left isn't without fault.

 

[Kenny]

Because you like to go 'round and 'round in circles?
I can't even get you to answer my questions.


This is the issue at hand. No goal posts have been moved here. You outright said that teachers are grooming and indoctrinating kids with this stuff.

Is that seriously what you think is going on?

You do realize that young adults grow up to be actual adults, right? Actual adults have sex and drive cars. Are you under the impression that schools should only be teaching kids and young adults things that they'll need in their direct and immediate future, or do you maybe suppose that we're supposed to be educating kids to prepare them for life?

That wasn't my question, was it? See how hard it is to get you to answer a simple question?

Which of all your questions were actually valid questions?

 

[Kenny]

It's an official document from our earlier years that expresses that we our neither a Christian nation nor founded on Christian religion. It's context is something Christian nationalists, conveniently, choose to ignore or write off.

You probably should read it closer and view the opposing viewpoint:

Patheos, (Can you believe it?), even says... "STOP QUOTING THE TREATY OF TRIPOLI"

Secularists, Please Stop Quoting The Treaty Of Tripoli

I’m writing today to beseech my fellow secularists with a simple request: please, for the love of god (in the colloquial sense), stop quoting the Treaty of Tripoli.

www.patheos.com

 

[Kenny]

"the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." - John Adams

Quotes are interesting especially when other quotes, from the same person, contracts itself:

“Is it not that in the chain of human events, the birthday of the nation is indissolubly linked with the birthday of the Savior? – that it forms a leading event in the progress of the Gospel dispensation? Is it not that the Declaration of Independence first organized the social compact on the foundation of the Redeemer’s mission upon earth? – that it laid the cornerstone of human government upon the first precepts of Christianity?” –John Quincy Adams

In addition:

“And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever.” – Thomas Jefferson


“Before any man can be considered as a member of civil society, he must be considered as a subject of the Governor of the Universe.” –James Madison

“To the kindly influence of Christianity we owe that degree of civil freedom, and political and social happiness, which mankind now enjoys…Whenever the pillars of Christianity shall be overthrown, our present republican forms of government – and all blessings which flow from them – must fall with them.” –Jedidiah Morse

How many more would you like?

 

[Viker]

You probably should read it closer and view the opposing viewpoint:

Patheos, (Can you believe it?), even says... "STOP QUOTING THE TREATY OF TRIPOLI"

Secularists, Please Stop Quoting The Treaty Of Tripoli

I’m writing today to beseech my fellow secularists with a simple request: please, for the love of god (in the colloquial sense), stop quoting the Treaty of Tripoli.

www.patheos.com

It still expresses that this is not founded on the Christian religion or that is it a Christian nation. And then it makes a universal and inclusive statement typical of our founders at the time. It's also an officially ratified document.

So, saying that it is a Christian nation is as relevant as saying it is a white nation, just because most founders happened to be both. It's neither officially.

 

[Kenny]

It still expresses that this is not founded on the Christian religion or that is it a Christian nation. And then it makes a universal and inclusive statement typical of our founders at the time. It's also an officially ratified document.

So, saying that it is a Christian nation is as relevant as saying it is a white nation, just because most founders happened to be both. It's neither officially.

I'm sorry... I just find that to be a real stretch IMV Look at all the States Constitutions and tell me if it isn't based on Christianity.

 

[Viker]

I'm sorry... I just find that to be a real stretch IMV Look at all the States Constitutions and tell me if it isn't based on Christianity.

Most of our Constitution is based on the Iroquois.

Iroquois confederacy

 

[Shadow Wolf]

You probably should read it closer and view the opposing viewpoint:

Patheos, (Can you believe it?), even says... "STOP QUOTING THE TREATY OF TRIPOLI"

Secularists, Please Stop Quoting The Treaty Of Tripoli

I’m writing today to beseech my fellow secularists with a simple request: please, for the love of god (in the colloquial sense), stop quoting the Treaty of Tripoli.

www.patheos.com

Why? All it does it show the very deep animosity between Christians and Muslims that has existed for centuries while highlighting the United States had a great need to emphasize "not a Christian" nation to get those Barbary Muslims to chill the hell out and quit assuming the US is another Christian nation out to make war against Muslims.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I'm sorry... I just find that to be a real stretch IMV Look at all the States Constitutions and tell me if it isn't based on Christianity.

Read John Locke and you'll clearly see (assuming you read honestly) that Jefferson didn't quote or reference the Bible once but rather that he plagiarized Locke.

 

[Father Heathen]

Quotes are interesting especially when other quotes, from the same person, contracts itself:

“Is it not that in the chain of human events, the birthday of the nation is indissolubly linked with the birthday of the Savior? – that it forms a leading event in the progress of the Gospel dispensation? Is it not that the Declaration of Independence first organized the social compact on the foundation of the Redeemer’s mission upon earth? – that it laid the cornerstone of human government upon the first precepts of Christianity?” –John Quincy Adams

In addition:

“And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever.” – Thomas Jefferson


“Before any man can be considered as a member of civil society, he must be considered as a subject of the Governor of the Universe.” –James Madison

“To the kindly influence of Christianity we owe that degree of civil freedom, and political and social happiness, which mankind now enjoys…Whenever the pillars of Christianity shall be overthrown, our present republican forms of government – and all blessings which flow from them – must fall with them.” –Jedidiah Morse

How many more would you like?

So what? They weren't official proclamations.

 

[Father Heathen]

I'm sorry... I just find that to be a real stretch IMV Look at all the States Constitutions and tell me if it isn't based on Christianity.

The U.S. constitution is rather quite antithetical to judeo-christian scripture.

 

[vulcanlogician]

Read John Locke and you'll clearly see (assuming you read honestly) that Jefferson didn't quote or reference the Bible once but rather that he plagiarized Locke.

So many people have no idea that 90% of our American conceptions of freedom come through Locke. Franklin, Jefferson, and others just repeated him. I call John Locke the "founding grandfather" of the United States. All our ideas about inalienable rights come from him.

The stickier issue is how much of Locke's theory depended upon scripture as a foundation. Locke certainly presented things that way. But there were consequences for publishing atheistic ideas in Locke's time. Some scholars posit that Locke was some kind of Spinozist who was careful to appear devoutly Christian when he could.

So Locke wrote a solid argument that the church and state ought to be separate, but then added a "footnote" that atheists should be exempted from public participation. More than one analyst has pointed out how uncharacteristic this is for Locke's thinking and have proposed that an ulterior motive was at work in this "anti-atheist" addendum. A few have gone so far as to say he was a full blown atheist and therefore needed to take measures to conceal his atheism.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

I'm sorry... I just find that to be a real stretch IMV Look at all the States Constitutions and tell me if it isn't based on Christianity.

Aside from the references to "God" and "Supreme Being," what are you referring to?

God or the divine is referenced in every state constitution

God or the divine is mentioned at least once in each of the 50 state constitutions and nearly 200 times overall.

www.pewresearch.org

It seems to me that despite references to "God," states also generally separate Church from state (sometimes with more vigor than the Federal government):

State Constitutional Provisions on Religion

Religious liberty advocates have observed that state constitutions may provide more separation of church and state than is protected in the First Amendment.

www.mtsu.edu

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I call John Locke the "founding grandfather" of the United States.

That is an appropriate title for him.

So Locke wrote a solid argument that the church and state ought to be separate, but then added a "footnote" that atheists should be exempted from public participation. More than one analyst has pointed out how uncharacteristic this is for Locke's thinking and have proposed that an ulterior motive was at work in this "anti-atheist" addendum. A few have gone so far as to say he was a full blown atheist and therefore needed to take measures to conceal his atheism.

It is a good question. And I do feel it's easy to move away from any Christian influence as those influenced by it frequently indicate this. Things like Jesus, god's grace, Biblical passages, these things get mentioned, and what we don't see is "be ye not of this world" as a reason for a secular state. But instead he reasoned the two must be separate for issues of liberty.
It could also be, like Paine, he thought atheism was problematic and wasn't an atheist. But it must also be acknowledged he was before Percy Shelley amd his writings of atheism so it is hard to tell.