Richard Dawkins hasn't read the Quran yet.

[FearGod]

The need for an income often overcomes religious dogma.

Stevens converted to Islam in December 1977 and adopted the name Yusuf Islam the following year. In 1979, he auctioned all his guitars for charity and left his music career to devote himself to educational and philanthropic causes in the Muslim community. In 2006, he returned to pop music with his first album of new pop songs in 28 years, entitled An Other Cup. He is now known professionally by the single name Yusuf.

Nice that you started to read about him and to know that he uses music.

 

[FearGod]

I would like to know why the more enthusiastic muslims, such as the taliban, al shabab and boko haram are so against music. Can you enlighten me? I don't see any sense in it.

It doesn't make any sense to me too.

Hard to know the reason for it, but I may think of it among others as a procedure to deceive their followers.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

sorry , i just back to your post to ask a question about this :

what you mean by "the effects of Islam" ?

I mean all of the things that Muslims do to others (or themselves) in the name of Islam, whether good or bad.

 

[Khubla]

Richard Dawkins hasn't read the Quran yet.

Totally unnecessary to read the entire Quran. A brief survey of it tenants is all that is necessary to understand what it's about.
There are more than 100 verses in the Qur'an advocating the use of violence to spread Islam. There are exactly 123 verses in the Qur'an about killing and fighting.
Very few Christians have read the entire Bible and nobody here has the credentials Dr. Richard Dawkins has. When people this distinguished speak I tend to listen.

 

[Godobeyer]

I mean all of the things that Muslims do to others (or themselves) in the name of Islam, whether good or bad.

good , that's it .

Muslims doing by the name of Islam .


so if group of western doing bad things, could i say that's All the western people is doiong bad thing ? or say that the western civilasation is bad ?
I mean make the accusation to all the western (general not individual)

btw the exterm muslims (terrorists) make the accusation to ALL the western (general) , that killed innocent muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan , Pakistan ...etc

is not the same value ?

But Dawkins give his opinion that Islam is evil (to ALL the muslims) , NOT the some muslims whom doing bad things by the name of Islam .

 

[Godobeyer]

if the west sponsor Bin laden in Afghanistan to defeat Soviet UNion and now sponor the terrorist in Syria , why some people put all the blame on Islam (all the muslims )

I suggest to you to check my new thread about the terrorists in Syria reject to meet USA senior !!!!

http://www.religiousforums.com/foru.../157560-islamic-front-has-refused-sit-us.html

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

good , that's it .

Muslims doing by the name of Islam .


so if group of western doing bad things, could i say that's All the western people is doiong bad thing ? or say that the western civilasation is bad ?
I mean make the accusation to all the western (general not individual)

btw the exterm muslims (terrorists) make the accusation to ALL the western (general) , that killed innocent muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan , Pakistan ...etc

is not the same value ?

Maybe. That's certainly part of the West's influence on the Middle East. It would be relevant when we ask whether the total effect of that influence is good or bad.

But Dawkins give his opinion that Islam is evil (to ALL the muslims) , NOT the some muslims whom doing bad things by the name of Islam .

It doesn't mean that all Muslims are evil; it means that the good done inthe name of Islam is outweighed by the bad. It means that, on the whole, the world would be a better place if nobody was Muslim.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

Regarding music....

If you look to the adhan and the tone and context to which it's said you'll notice that it is indeed musical in its own right.

 

[FearGod]

Regarding music....

If you look to the adhan and the tone and context to which it's said you'll notice that it is indeed musical in its own right.

Yes indeed, the prayer call (adhan) is kind of a musical sound.
it doesn't make sense not to listen to an awesome sound whether it was music or even a warbling bird.

[youtube]kJa6sfgKoxo[/youtube]
Sheikh Ahmad Khoja| Makkah Adhan Al-Fajr 21st Nov '13 - YouTube

[youtube]i3PRxFpHnUw[/youtube]
Warbling Vireo singing and eating moth. - YouTube

 

[Godobeyer]

Maybe. That's certainly part of the West's influence on the Middle East. It would be relevant when we ask whether the total effect of that influence is good or bad.

I see no good in the influence of the west in Middle East until now , it's just increase the voilence , and some countries are almost destoried ,as Libya and Syria , and Iraq .

It doesn't mean that all Muslims are evil; it means that the good done inthe name of Islam is outweighed by the bad. It means that, on the whole, the world would be a better place if nobody was Muslim.

don't you see that ,the main reason that some muslims doing bad to them selfs or others is the influence of the west ?


so whom killed by "the seize" of USA to Iraq during Sadam regime , one million Iraqi victimes of USA seize and lie (nuclear weapon) , is more than what killed by all the terrorists .

so the muslim world would be better place if there is no influence of the west in the middle east ?

 

[Godobeyer]

Just for clarify something here to all the people :

the terrorists (whom killing/kidnepping/rape innocent muslims or innocent non-muslims ) by the

name of Islam ,they are murders against innocents and against Islam .


I don't considerate them as non-muslims doing thinks by the name of islam , because they disobey Allah order " to don't kill

innocents".which mean they allowed which is clearly forbiden .

so it's very required to eliminate them .

because they lieing about Islam and used it's name to make murders ,and they represent fake/wrong islam

then they made immorality issue by the name of Islam (Jihad Alnikah / sex Jihad ) .

 

[LuisDantas]

How much reading is reading? I don't think it says a lot one way or another that he claims not to have read the Quran to the point of quoting it.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I see no good in the influence of the west in Middle East until now , it's just increase the voilence , and some countries are almost destoried ,as Libya and Syria , and Iraq .

There are definitely negative effects. Is the net effect negative? I don't know.

don't you see that ,the main reason that some muslims doing bad to them selfs or others is the influence of the west ?

I don't agree with that. Blame the CIA for the drone strikes that they carry out, but violence by Muslims against Muslims isn't that easy to pin on someone else.

so whom killed by "the seize" of USA to Iraq during Sadam regime , one million Iraqi victimes of USA seize and lie (nuclear weapon) , is more than what killed by all the terrorists .

so the muslim world would be better place if there is no influence of the west in the middle east ?

I'm not sure. It depends how you value things. Western armies have certainly killed a lot of people in the Muslim world, but I think that Western culture is having positive influence in other ways. If you're a woman in rural Afghanistan, which is better: a risk that you or a loved one might get bombed, or a life of subjugation at the hands of your husband and knowing that the same will happen to your daughter?

One source I read estimated that 85% of women in Afghanistan had experienced some kind of domestic abuse, mainly at the hands of their fathers or husbands. 85%! So far, Islam hasn't stopped this. The West's influence may not be perfect, but it's probably the only hope that a lot of people have for a better life.

 

[Sees]

There are definitely negative effects. Is the net effect negative? I don't know.


I don't agree with that. Blame the CIA for the drone strikes that they carry out, but violence by Muslims against Muslims isn't that easy to pin on someone else.


I'm not sure. It depends how you value things. Western armies have certainly killed a lot of people in the Muslim world, but I think that Western culture is having positive influence in other ways. If you're a woman in rural Afghanistan, which is better: a risk that you or a loved one might get bombed, or a life of subjugation at the hands of your husband and knowing that the same will happen to your daughter?

One source I read estimated that 85% of women in Afghanistan had experienced some kind of domestic abuse, mainly at the hands of their fathers or husbands. 85%! So far, Islam hasn't stopped this. The West's influence may not be perfect, but it's probably the only hope that a lot of people have for a better life.

It is strange Muslim nations don't police themselves and then feel so shocked when people interfere.

Most Iraqi deaths were/are not from western people but others. Non western foreigners and other Iraqis. Most people we killed and had in detainment were not Iraqi. Waves of people coming in from surrounding countries at least till 2005. No media portrayed this accurately because of implications that would involve other Muslim nations. Where were the waves of funded thugs, drug lords, freedom fighters coming from and who was funding it? Only exists if you were there.

 

[Sees]

I see no good in the influence of the west in Middle East until now , it's just increase the voilence , and some countries are almost destoried ,as Libya and Syria , and Iraq .


don't you see that ,the main reason that some muslims doing bad to them selfs or others is the influence of the west ?


so whom killed by "the seize" of USA to Iraq during Sadam regime , one million Iraqi victimes of USA seize and lie (nuclear weapon) , is more than what killed by all the terrorists .

so the muslim world would be better place if there is no influence of the west in the middle east ?

Majority of Iraqis, not people speaking for them and all the Muslim world, were/are glad somebody actually intervened.

Where are the good Muslim nations when the bad ones suffer people under oppression and evil for years? It's easy to blame people from an arm chair.

 

[steeltoes]

Dawson singles out Islam which is a mistake and views Islam as the worst of religions which I think is a mistake.

 

[Looncall]

Just for clarify something here to all the people :

the terrorists (whom killing/kidnepping/rape innocent muslims or innocent non-muslims ) by the

name of Islam ,they are murders against innocents and against Islam .


I don't considerate them as non-muslims doing thinks by the name of islam , because they disobey Allah order " to don't kill

innocents".which mean they allowed which is clearly forbiden .

so it's very required to eliminate them .

because they lieing about Islam and used it's name to make murders ,and they represent fake/wrong islam

then they made immorality issue by the name of Islam (Jihad Alnikah / sex Jihad ) .

Yes, but about the muslim mobs doing murder, as, for example in the cartoons incident? You can't claim that that was just a few extremists, it was mobs of thousands!

 

[Godobeyer]

There are definitely negative effects. Is the net effect negative? I don't know.

I don't agree with that. Blame the CIA for the drone strikes that they carry out, but violence by Muslims against Muslims isn't that easy to pin on someone else.

just give you a tips from the past :
I am 33 years old , that mean i am witness about Gulf War , So Iraq after it's retreat from Kuwiet , the USA aircraft strick the retreated Iraqi army !!!

then they bombed Bagdad ,then they siege Iraq for 11 years during it - 1 million Iraqi kids died because of siege when they


orgnise oil exchange with food !!!

then USA invade Iraq because the big lie of nuclear weapon .

please check this important video :
général Wesley Clark (2007)


[youtube]2vWe0cVdYRI[/youtube]
général Wesley Clark (2007) - L'origine des guerres en Irak,Libye et les autres - YouTube

I'm not sure. It depends how you value things. Western armies have certainly killed a lot of people in the Muslim world,
but I think that Western culture is having positive influence in other ways.
If you're a woman in rural Afghanistan, which is better: a risk that you or a loved one might get bombed,
or a life of subjugation at the hands of your husband and knowing that the same will happen to your daughter?

I admire that your honest reponses , for me western culture is just make up ,to represent the western armies as heros

inspite of their fatal errors against muslims.

I think western culture influence to Muslim world base on "the immorality", what positive you talking about?

One source I read estimated that 85% of women in Afghanistan had experienced some kind of domestic abuse,
mainly at the hands of their fathers or husbands. 85%! So far, Islam hasn't stopped this.
The West's influence may not be perfect, but it's probably the only hope that a lot of people have for a better life.

I am sorry about the afghni women that abused by the name of Islam .

as you talk about drone hit afghanis, don't tell me that you considerate domestic abuse women worst

then bombing them by drone ?

it's seems that you mixed between regional tradition and Islam,if their tradition is over islam teaching ,

how Islam could stop their abuse , if their had bad recieved teaching of Islam ?

Abuse woman is globale issue,it's not fair to stuck it to Islam,

btw the west is not perfect place for women.

just tell how much western women bought her body or strip to gain money to live!!

**** THIS **** | Demotivation.us




So the western hasn't stopped this abuse , instead of that it's support the using of their women in immorality!!!

It's seems,that enorms women in the west becomes like slave (trade),they beieng used for money to make "fun" to men.

see , nobody is perfect here .

 

[Reverend Rick]

I absolutley cannot stand Dawkins. He is an arrogant butt hole IMO.

 

[McBell]

I absolutley cannot stand Dawkins. He is an arrogant butt hole IMO.

It is interesting how so many people declare they dislike Dawkins because of his "arrogance" yet are just as arrogant when it comes to dictating their own beliefs to others.

I am not saying you fall into said group, merely pointing out that said group exists.