Richard Dawkins lies

[Falvlun]

Yes each sea won't mix and each will keep its own density & temp.

How can two seas not mix?

Your own link says that they will mix, but that it just takes a long time. The poster also utilized water in a bowl (gasp!) to prove the point.

It seems like you picked a rather poor example of lying, since a) it is true that the waters do eventually mix and b) a small scale experiment is a legitimate method of understanding this.

 

[ignition]

Your argument seems to be that since Dawkins suggested mixing a salt and fresh water to test this hypothesis, rather than two seas, he is a liar. But no, that's simply how science works: experiment on the small scale to extrapolate to the big scale. If it's true that salt and fresh water will mix in a bowl, then that's good evidence to indicate that salt and fresh water seas will in fact mix.

That's not lying. That's science.

If you're talking about the Dawkins commentary of the Qur'an then I watched the vid and he did lie or at least mislead. You cannot claim to be talking about the Qur'an and then say things that are not mentioned in it. What he said has nothing to do with science, but everything to do with inaccurate reporting.

 

[Sculelos]

Richard Dawkins apparently has reading failure because the Quran does not say they don't mix, it states they don't mix freely because of a natural barrier.

Try taking oil and mixing it with water if you want to see what natural barrier type is in the seas.

 

[Sha'irullah]

Richard Dawkins apparently has reading failure because the Quran does not say they don't mix, it states they don't mix freely because of a natural barrier.

Try taking oil and mixing it with water if you want to see what natural barrier type is in the seas.

This is not true kiddo also having had been a Muslim I can declare fallacy to your statement :yes:

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Oh again literally interpreting the verses that have symbolic meaning in them.

There are two type of seas.

The sweat sea, that symbolizes the word of God. It is said word of God is the Water of Life. That is the Truth. The Sea of Knowledge, which gives life to Spirit.

The bitter Sea represents the World of Sin.

God separates His Truth, His Word which is the Sweet Water and Life giver, from the bitter Water which is Sin and Falsehood. He Separates Them by His command.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

Reading it metaphorically is so much more easily reconcilable to reality. A pity more people do not embrace such an approach with regard to what they consider sacred texts.

 

[Sculelos]

Reading it metaphorically is so much more easily reconcilable to reality. A pity more people do not embrace such an approach with regard to what they consider sacred texts.

It is true that some things are metaphorical and some things are not. I suppose we are forced to take some things as metaphorical and forced to take some things as literal.

Example of a literal passageway in the Bible.

4 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord.

 

[sojourner]

We know that the salty water and the fresh water do mix,but that is not the issue in the quran as it says the 2 seas don't mix

Bring a bowel and try to separate the salty water from the fresh water in the one bowel similar to what we see in the 2 seas.

Saying mix 2 glasses of water won't explain the case of the 2 seas,so it is one of 2,
liar or idiot

I haven't seen such gymnastics since Mary Lou Retton stuck the vault landing in '84...

 

[FearGod]

Oh again literally interpreting the verses that have symbolic meaning in them.

There are two type of seas.

The sweat sea, that symbolizes the word of God. It is said word of God is the Water of Life. That is the Truth. The Sea of Knowledge, which gives life to Spirit.

The bitter Sea represents the World of Sin.

God separates His Truth, His Word which is the Sweet Water and Life giver, from the bitter Water which is Sin and Falsehood. He Separates Them by His command.

That make no sense to say that the sweet sea is god's word and the salt sea is the satan's word.

 

[Agnostic75]

The energy that caused the Big Bang to occur did not necessarily had to have come from a conscious, self-aware being. If an eternal God is a reasonable possibility, so is eternal, naturalistic energy.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

That make no sense to say that the sweet sea is god's word and the salt sea is the satan's word.

Oh yes. Jesus walked on the sea, without getting into it. That means He was able to stay above the Sea of Sins. Everyone else had to go into the Ark of Covenant to be saved. Ark is the symbol of Faith. Those who enter the Faith do not get drawned in the sea of Sins.
Noah made an Ark. That was the Faith of God. Those who entered it were saved. But otheres who did not, were drawned in the Waters, and died spiritually. Different animals in pairs, represnt different sects, and tribes. Those were saved, because they entered the Ark of Covenant of God.

Moses saved His people. He made a dry land between the Waters of Sins. Those who followed Him were saved. Those who did not, were drawned in the Waters of Sins, and died Spiritually.

Question: Do you ever consider the verse of Quran that says "Some of Its verses are Figurative (Mutishabihat)"? Or you believe everything is literal? If you consider, how many Mutishabihat verses are you aware of?

 

[FearGod]

Oh yes. Jesus walked on the sea, without getting into it. That means He was able to stay above the Sea of Sins. Everyone else had to go into the Ark of Covenant to be saved. Ark is the symbol of Faith. Those who enter the Faith do not get drawned in the sea of Sins.
Noah made an Ark. That was the Faith of God. Those who entered it were saved. But otheres who did not, were drawned in the Waters, and died spiritually. Different animals in pairs, represnt different sects, and tribes. Those were saved, because they entered the Ark of Covenant of God.

Moses saved His people. He made a dry land between the Waters of Sins. Those who followed Him were saved. Those who did not, were drawned in the Waters of Sins, and died Spiritually.

Question: Do you ever consider the verse of Quran that says "Some of Its verses are Figurative (Mutishabihat)"? Or you believe everything is literal? If you consider, how many Mutishabihat verses are you aware of?

That is irrelevant and it'll be off topic,you can discuss in a new thread how scholars in the bahii faith interpret the verses and how to decode the verses to its actual meaning.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

That is irrelevant and it'll be off topic,you can discuss in a new thread how scholars in the bahii faith interpret the verses and how to decode the verses to its actual meaning.

You can make a thread if u r interested. By the way, Baha'I scholars do not interpret the verses. They cannot. Baha'u'llah and Abdulbaha did and Baha'is learn from Them.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

That make no sense to say that the sweet sea is god's word and the salt sea is the satan's word.

Makes a lot more sense than trying to operate under the delusion salt and fresh water literally do not mix - oh sorry, while in the sea (wouldnt want to miss the completely unimportant point that you would suggest would make it a lie).

 

[FearGod]

Makes a lot more sense than trying to operate under the delusion salt and fresh water literally do not mix - oh sorry, while in the sea (wouldnt want to miss the completely unimportant point that you would suggest would make it a lie).

That shows your ignorance about this thread,pls read the thread carefully and all replies.
Just a little talent is needed to know if he was lying.

And it is He who let forth the two seas, this one Sweet, grateful to taste, and this salt, bitter to the tongue, and He set between them a barrier, and a ban forbidden. (25:53)

 

[InformedIgnorance]

Go watch the video you yourself posted to learn why this is fundamentally wrong. Pay careful attention to what a Halocline is.

 

[ArtieE]

And it is He who let forth the two seas, this one Sweet, grateful to taste, and this salt, bitter to the tongue, and He set between them a barrier, and a ban forbidden. (25:53)

Where in the picture is the barrier? It shows the two seas and doesn't show any barrier separating them just the difference in color where they meet and mix... it shows there isn't any barrier between them...

 

[FearGod]

Go watch the video you yourself posted to learn why this is fundamentally wrong. Pay careful attention to what a Halocline is.

Here it goes the separation layer of salt density in the depth of the ocean and the meeting point between the Atlantic Ocean and the Mediaterianean sea that don't and never mix.

 

[ArtieE]

Here it goes the separation layer of salt density in the depth of the ocean and the meeting point between the Atlantic Ocean and the Mediaterianean sea that don't and never mix.

1. Was the knowledge that waters of different salinity, density and temperature do not mix unknown to anyone prior to Muhammad? Not really. A thousand years before Muhammad Aristotle wrote the following:

“The drinkable, sweet water, then, is light and is all of it drawn up: the salt water is heavy and remains behind,” Meteorology Book 2 Chapter 2

It is clear that at the time of Aristotle they knew that salt and fresh water don't immediately mix but that it takes time.

2. "Furthermore the separation of these waters are not permanent. The waters of various densities, salinities and temperatures eventually mix. The phenomenon is short lived and is observerabe only when the two bodies of water meet. It is like pouring milk in the cup of coffee. At first one can see that milk creates a current inside the coffee but eventually they mix."

http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/sina41003p4.htm

So congratulations Allah for mentioning in the Qu'ran something Aristotle knew a thousand years earlier, and congratulations Allah for explaining it so badly that Muslims still think that those seas never mix.

 

[FearGod]

1. Was the knowledge that waters of different salinity, density and temperature do not mix unknown to anyone prior to Muhammad? Not really. A thousand years before Muhammad Aristotle wrote the following:

“The drinkable, sweet water, then, is light and is all of it drawn up: the salt water is heavy and remains behind,” Meteorology Book 2 Chapter 2

It is clear that at the time of Aristotle they knew that salt and fresh water don't immediately mix but that it takes time.

2. "Furthermore the separation of these waters are not permanent. The waters of various densities, salinities and temperatures eventually mix. The phenomenon is short lived and is observerabe only when the two bodies of water meet. It is like pouring milk in the cup of coffee. At first one can see that milk creates a current inside the coffee but eventually they mix."

http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/sina41003p4.htm

So congratulations Allah for mentioning in the Qu'ran something Aristotle knew a thousand years earlier, and congratulations Allah for explaining it so badly that Muslims still think that those seas never mix.

The thread isn't for discussing the phenomenon and whether if it was known longtime ago since the stone age or on modern days but it is to show how Dawkins lied about the 2 seas that don't mix and twisted it that the quran says that the salt water and freshwater don't mix and then he asked to try to mix 2 glasses of water to see that it mix,but that isn't the case for the 2 seas except if as you said it takes long time for the 2 seas to be mixed, eventually,maybe millions of years like the story of evolution.

Is it hard for you to understand whats the thread is about,we aren't discussing miracles of the quran here.:sarcastic

We aren't even discussing the phenomenon,you can open a thread to refute it,you'll find many website to help you to copy and paste from.