Rishi Sunak

[Little Dragon]

I believe the NHS in its current state is unsustainable and would support a French or German style healthcare model. But it seems in Britain there are 2 models available, either totally nationalised or totally privatised, neither of which have worked as well as those Continental systems.

Guide to Health Insurance and Healthcare System in France | InterNations

InterNations provides you what you need to know about health insurance and the healthcare system in France. Learn about costs, hospitals and much more.

www.internations.org

Maybe, however, I think the NHS and free access to healthcare for all. Is popular for good reason. A healthy nation is a productive nation.

 

[Rival]

Maybe, however, I think the NHS and free access to healthcare for all. Is popular for good reason. A healthy nation is a productive nation.

I work with the NHS and it's an absolute ****show. Something needs doing. France does have universal healthcare, as has Germany, it's just done differently. Brits have a weird emotional attachment to the NHS yet spend most of their time whining about how bad it its all while refusing to do something about it. It's a bureaucratic nightmare; we need to reduce the bureaucracy. We seem to believe the long waits, mediocre service etc. are normal, but they're not. Other countries with universal healthcare aren't having these problems. My mum and step-dad moved to France in 2019 and have found the French healthcare system 10x faster, can actually get a dr, get medication etc. Even as foreigners they are treated well. It's a damn sight more different and efficient.

Brits are far too comfortable with mediocre service across the board and too polite to actually complain about it in a meaningful way.

 

[Little Dragon]

I work with the NHS and it's an absolute ****show.

Insufficient funding and perhaps other systemic issues are at fault. I do not know. However I do value and approve of a universal healthcare system, above a mixed system of insurance and centralized state funding. The NHS has saved many lives and relieved much pain and fear, these things are not forgotten.

 

[Little Dragon]

Brits are far too comfortable with mediocre service across the board and too polite to actually complain about it in a meaningful way.

"Musn't grumble!"

 

[Rival]

Insufficient funding and perhaps other systemic issues are at fault. I do not know. However I do value and approve of a universal healthcare system, above a mixed system of insurance and centralized state funding. The NHS has saved many lives and relieved much pain and fear, these things are not forgotten.

I see no insufficient funding here:

That's also adjusted for inflation.

The NHS is terrible despite being handed billions of pounds. I think people are just afraid of a system that means they have to pay into it, which seems absurd.

And for all this talk of saving lives,

40% of NHS Maternity Wards Fall Below Safety Standards

The Ockenden review into maternity failings at Shrewsbury and Telford Hospital NHS Trust has thrown the entire NHS maternity service into the spotlight.

www.medical-solicitors.com

A separate report has found that two in five maternity wards are potentially unsafe. Out of 193 NHS maternity wards in England, 80 have been rated by health watchdog Care Quality Commission (CQC) as inadequate or requires improvement. Only two were rated as outstanding for safety.

NHS struggling to provide safe cancer care, say senior doctors

Staff shortages are driving up waiting times in all four UK nations, the Royal College of Radiologists says.

www.bbc.co.uk

Half of all cancer units are now reporting frequent delays for both radiotherapy and chemotherapy.

Three in five NHS trusts in England fail on basic care - PMC

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Three in five NHS trusts in England are failing basic standards of care and safety set by the government, it emerged this week.

It's a joke.

 

[Little Dragon]

I see no insufficient funding here:

View attachment 83778

That's also adjusted for inflation.

The NHS is terrible despite being handed billions of pounds. I think people are just afraid of a system that means they have to pay into it, which seems absurd.

And for all this talk of saving lives,

40% of NHS Maternity Wards Fall Below Safety Standards

The Ockenden review into maternity failings at Shrewsbury and Telford Hospital NHS Trust has thrown the entire NHS maternity service into the spotlight.

www.medical-solicitors.com

A separate report has found that two in five maternity wards are potentially unsafe. Out of 193 NHS maternity wards in England, 80 have been rated by health watchdog Care Quality Commission (CQC) as inadequate or requires improvement. Only two were rated as outstanding for safety.

NHS struggling to provide safe cancer care, say senior doctors

Staff shortages are driving up waiting times in all four UK nations, the Royal College of Radiologists says.

www.bbc.co.uk

Half of all cancer units are now reporting frequent delays for both radiotherapy and chemotherapy.

Three in five NHS trusts in England fail on basic care - PMC

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Three in five NHS trusts in England are failing basic standards of care and safety set by the government, it emerged this week.

It's a joke.

That chart isnt helpful. Since it only states what is expended, not what is required.

 

[Little Dragon]

The NHS is terrible despite being handed billions of pounds. I think people are just afraid of a system that means they have to pay into it, which seems absurd.

I cannot agree. the NHS does not determine how much funding it gets. That is down to the incumbent party in government.
Standards are low because, you get what you pay for.

 

[Rival]

That chart isnt helpful. Since it only states what is expended, not what is required.

I'm not sure you can really state what is required in healthcare. We can estimate, but as covid has shown us I don't think it matters how much money we spend on it, we'll always be short. I think the more sensible option is to get rid of the money black hole bureaucrats and work our way from there.

 

[Little Dragon]

I think the more sensible option is to get rid of the money black hole bureaucrats and work our way from there.

I am on board with that one captain!

 

[Secret Chief]

I assume that disgust with the cost of living has been a huge part of the Brexit movement

I'd say not at all. The cost of living is post covid, post Ukraine, post brexit. Brexit has caused all sorts of problems for businesses. Prices have been pushed up specifically because we left the world's largest trading bloc. The brexit "movement" was not driven by economic arguments, it was "getting our country back" psychological guff and outright lies (eg they need us more than we need them, there'll be no downside to brexit - only upsides, etc etc etc etc) that was bought by brexiters.

 

[Secret Chief]

A liar I would go as far to say

Hang on, I was quite liking you.

On the basis of shaking his hand I could tell he's a decent bloke. (Same with JC).

 

[LuisDantas]

I'd say not at all. The cost of living is post covid, post Ukraine, post brexit. Brexit has caused all sorts of problems for businesses. Prices have been pushed up specifically because we left the world's largest trading bloc. The brexit "movement" was not driven by economic arguments, it was "getting our country back" psychological guff and outright lies (eg they need us more than we need them, there'll be no downside to brexit - only upsides, etc etc etc etc) that was bought by brexiters.

But surely there was significant expectation that some form of economic prosperity would follow? No?

 

[Little Dragon]

Hang on, I was quite liking you.

On the basis of shaking his hand I could tell he's a decent bloke. (Same with JC).

JC was OK. I liked his policies in general. Starmer has gone back on so many things, he stabbed ol JC in the back too. I just don't like him. He lacks leadership qualities.

 

[Rival]

The brexit "movement" was not driven by economic arguments, it was "getting our country back" psychological guff and outright lies (eg they need us more than we need them, there'll be no downside to brexit - only upsides, etc etc etc etc) that was bought by brexiters.

This is not a very nuanced take.

Brexit where I was in the North East was primarily driven by economic arguments made on the basis that removing EU red tape would help us reach those goals. It was made on the basis of making trade deals with different countries, stronger ties to the US etc. etc. At base Brexiteers wanted a more prosperous Britain, and it's no surprise many of the voters come from the most economically deprived areas, areas which also have high suicide rates, high rates of addiction and so on.

After moving to the south-east I now see why people here voted to remain, because it's nothing like the hell of the North-East, with the highest suicide rates in England.

 

[LuisDantas]

Fair enough... but that really paints a worrisome picture of how well informed they are.

 

[Secret Chief]

But surely there was significant expectation that some form of economic prosperity would follow? No?

Expectation by who? Economic idiots?

While Jacob Rees Mogg was busy telling people the future would be golden, his financial advisory company was busy telling its clients to move their head offices to Dublin before the brexit ****show happened.

 

[Little Dragon]

But surely there was significant expectation that some form of economic prosperity would follow? No?

Oh yes, the likes of Boris Johnson and Nigel Farage promised the sun lit uplands of low taxes and high wages, no longer tethered by Brussels busybodies who would stop us exporting and importing beyond the EU, no more EU subsidies and red tape, Happy British fish for all!

It was all bull****.
Utter bull****.

 

[Secret Chief]

Fair enough... but that really paints a worrisome picture of how well informed they are.

"Project Fear."

 

[Secret Chief]

This is not a very nuanced take.

Brexit where I was in the North East was primarily driven by economic arguments made on the basis that removing EU red tape would help us reach those goals. It was made on the basis of making trade deals with different countries, stronger ties to the US etc. etc. At base Brexiteers wanted a more prosperous Britain, and it's no surprise many of the voters come from the most economically deprived areas, areas which also have high suicide rates, high rates of addiction and so on.

After moving to the south-east I now see why people here voted to remain, because it's nothing like the hell of the North-East, with the highest suicide rates in England.

I live in a post-industrial northern town. People bought lies, the reality of post brexit has shown that clearly.

 

[Rival]

I live in a post-industrial northern town. People bought lies, the reality of post brexit has shown that clearly.

I remember going to London and being amazed that they have a very efficient, very cheap bus service...

Where I was there was a bus every 2 hours more expensive for a 2 miles journey than a bus from Islington to Victoria.

Found that shops like Waitrose existed as brick and mortar shops and that Pret a Manger wasn't French.

Found that people live in a weird, weird world I had previously not known about.

It's is angering.