Salvation

[sandy whitelinger]

I think she is saying that all that is meaningless garbage. There is NO afterlife nor "salvation" nor anything to be saved from. Death ends all. Now if you have evidence to the contrary produce it.

Absent that you have meaningless phrases.

Wow, how does one come to be so bitter and derogatory?

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Here is some biblical "education" regarding this question:

Is anything more than FAITH needed in order to gain salvation?

(The entire provision for salvation is an expression of God's undeserved kindness. There is no way that a descendant of Adam can gain salvation on his own, no matter how noble his works are. Salvation is a gift from God given to those who put faith in the sin-atoning value of the sacrifice of his son, Jesus.)

However, the Bible state, in Heb.5:9 - He (Jesus) became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him." Does this conflict with the statement that Christians are "saved through faith"? Not at all! Obdience simply demonstrates that their FAITH is genuine!

This is getting even more clearly explained in Jas.2:14,26 - "What does it profit ,my brethren, if a man says he has faith, but has no works? Can his faith save him?For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead." ( This means : A person does not earn salvation by his works. But anyone who has genuine faith WILL have works to go with it - works of obedience to the commands of God and Christ, works that demonstrate his faith and LOVE. Without such works, his faith is dead.....according to the WORD OF God.

So - I believe that both faith AND works (acting in harmony with our beliefs) is necessary in order to get salvation. It's impossible with only ONE of this, they are glued together, so to say. In addittion i want to point to this...:

Is is so that ones a person is saved, he is always saved?

No, not according to the BIBLE! Matt. 24:13 says "He who endures to the end will be saved." (Meaning; A persons final salvation is not determined at the moment he begins to put faith in Jesus.)

And Jesus said in Phil. 2:12 - : "As you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." (Here Paul urged the christians not to be overly confident, but to realize that their final salvation was NOT yet assured.)

And last, but not least: Heb.10:26,27 - If we sin deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful prospect of judgement and a fury of fire which will consume the adversaries." ( This tell us that the Bible does not go along with the idea that no matter what sins a person may commit after he's "saved" - he will not lose his salvation.) Salvation encourages FAITHFULNESS! To the very end.

PS: For other questions please concact me.

I have compiled what I believe to be the fulness of scripture regarding the works/faith dilemma here.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

There is no evidence that statements from the Bible are the 'truth'!

That is what faith is all about when it concerns salvation.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

A gift God can stick where the sun don't shine, if it is only for those who are 'saved'!

Biblically, being "stuck where the [Son] doesn't shine," is what it is all about.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Hmmm...:sarcastic
I'd rather to subscribe to "God loves you, whether you like it or not."

I have a few atheist friends who are better in tune with the universe than most Christians I know. I like to believe that God will take care of the, just as God does the "faithful."

The sun shines on the just as well as the unjust but God reserves salvation for those who accept it. His justice demands this.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

I got saved so I could drink wine and eat those little crackers during the Lord's Supper. As a Southern Baptist, imagine my surprise, however, to find out they really just give you Grape Juice, not wine. I was indignant. What the hell? It was like a fake ceremony wherein we only pretended to eat the body of Christ and drink his blood. Jesus didn't use grape juice.

You goofed. Go down the street to the Catholic service.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Being loved by the god character in the Bible would be like being loved by a tiger before it tears you limb from limb, I will pass, thanks.

You once again only focus on the vengeful aspect of God. Does not the same tigress lovingly care for her cubs?

You seem to only care for a one-dimensional God concept. Perhaps the Invisible Pink Unicorn suits your needs more fully.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

If a deity exists I am happy for it to be my equal...

In which case, kneel before the majesty of your Daddy!

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Possibly! I don't know why some people want to be subservient to some entity though.

Well, it kinda goes along with the concept of "diety."

 

[Misty]

You once again only focus on the vengeful aspect of God. Does not the same tigress lovingly care for her cubs?

You seem to only care for a one-dimensional God concept. Perhaps the Invisible Pink Unicorn suits your needs more fully.

If a deity is vengeful in the way the god character is supposed to be, it cannot be loving too, imo!

 

[sandy whitelinger]

If a deity is vengeful in the way the god character is supposed to be, it cannot be loving too, imo!

Give the IPU a try.

 

[Misty]

Give the IPU a try.

IPU, what is that?

 

[sandy whitelinger]

IPU, what is that?

The Invisible Pink Unicorn.

 

[Misty]

The Invisible Pink Unicorn.

That is about as credible as salvation!

 

[URAVIP2ME]

If a deity is vengeful in the way the god character is supposed to be, it cannot be loving too, imo!

Isn't there a difference between vengeful and an execution?

Even the world recognizes some crimes are worthy of the death penalty.

If someone was attacking your family wouldn't you come to their aid?
Self defense is not necessarily murder.

God's people are getting at the point in human history that unless there is divine intervention into mankind's affairs no flesh will be saved.
Saved as in saved alive.

If you had a beautiful house that became infested with rats would you get rid of your beautiful house or exterminate the rats?

The earth is infected with rat-like people as described at 2nd Tim 3vs1-5,13.
They have a selfish distorted form of love opposite the definition of Christ-like love defined at 1st Cor 13vs4-6.
These are the last days of badness on earth before the words from Jesus mouth will do away with any rat-like ones. Only humble mild-tempered meek ones will remain. -Isaiah 11v4; Rev 19vs11,14,15; Psalm 37v11,29,38

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I think I have found a stable reality for me.

What is stable about the world scene today?

With such a bad economy the political world can have a desire for the wealth the religions of the world have amassed. That could also be an excuse to turn on the world's religious sector beside the fact the world's religions have run afoul playing false to God and his Word in creating a dangerous religious climate in today's world of badness, or seeing civilization's best accomplishment being the holy name of war. With backing can't the United Nations be strengthened to turn on religion? How stable will the world be then?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

If a deity exists I am happy for it to be my equal, but I have no wish to be subordinate to it!

Why don't people complain about the order or rank in the school system?
Doesn't the pupil have a head, doesn't the teacher have a head, doesn't the principal have a head, doesn't the super have a head?
If all were equal how would the school system run smoothly?

If all were bosses and no employees how would business function?
If all hospital workers had no subordinates what would that be like?
How many captains does a ship have? why?
Why aren't all captains?

Even Jesus believe he had a head and subordinate to God.
1st Cor 11v3

 

[URAVIP2ME]

You are confusing sin and it's consequences with salvation and it's causes.
Sin causes death not condemnation. Belief or non-belief in Jesus as the only begotten son of God is the pivot on which eternal destination swings.

Yes sin causes death. Eternal destination swings or hinges on Jesus as God's only-begotten Son. Col 1vs15,16; Rev 3v14 b
Many have lived and died that never heard of Jesus.
In the resurrection they will have that opportunity for salvation through Christ.

Those alive on earth at the time of Jesus 'glory' [Matt 25vs31,32] are living on earth at that time. How they treat Jesus 'brothers' [verse 40] is a basis for Jesus judgment. The sheep-like ones placed at Jesus right hand of favor, so to speak, have the opportunity to remain alive and keep right on living right here on planet earth being 'saved' right into the start of Jesus peaceful thousand-year reign over earth when Jesus ushers in Peace on Earth toward men of goodwill.

 

[Misty]

Isn't there a difference between vengeful and an execution?

Even the world recognizes some crimes are worthy of the death penalty.

If someone was attacking your family wouldn't you come to their aid?
Self defense is not necessarily murder.

God's people are getting at the point in human history that unless there is divine intervention into mankind's affairs no flesh will be saved.
Saved as in saved alive.

If you had a beautiful house that became infested with rats would you get rid of your beautiful house or exterminate the rats?

The earth is infected with rat-like people as described at 2nd Tim 3vs1-5,13.
They have a selfish distorted form of love opposite the definition of Christ-like love defined at 1st Cor 13vs4-6.
These are the last days of badness on earth before the words from Jesus mouth will do away with any rat-like ones. Only humble mild-tempered meek ones will remain. -Isaiah 11v4; Rev 19vs11,14,15; Psalm 37v11,29,38

In the UK the death penalty was done away with in the 60s, thank goodness. I am glad I live in the UK rather the the less civilised US, where that matter is concerned!

 

[sandy whitelinger]

That is about as credible as salvation!

Yes but there seems to be no apparent personality to the IPU and offers a nice conundrum to ponder, a simple diety.