Same Sex Marrige By a Church.

[Archer]

OK one more post.
If you take into account all of the scripture in the Bible that directly teaches against homosexuality (even imposed the death penalty for it), you can then disregard all your conjecture about gay marriage ever being condoned anywhere in the Bible.

That my friends is the interpretation you can not deny. All of it in black and white.

 

[Storm]

OK one more post.
If you take into account all of the scripture in the Bible that directly teaches against homosexuality (even imposed the death penalty for it), you can then disregard all your conjecture about gay marriage ever being condoned anywhere in the Bible.

That my friends is the interpretation you can not deny. All of it in black and white.

Strawman, also ad hom.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

OK one more post.
If you take into account all of the scripture in the Bible that directly teaches against homosexuality (even imposed the death penalty for it), you can then disregard all your conjecture about gay marriage ever being condoned anywhere in the Bible.

The amount of scripture against homosexuality can't hold a candle to the sheer volume of scripture that condemns working on the Sabbath... yet in the Gospels, Jesus declares that even observance of the Sabbath is secondary to the greater virtues of love, justice, mercy and faithfulness. If you can't understand that, I really don't know what I can say to convince you.

Apparently, you value the opinion of Paul above the commandments of God, written with His own hand.

 

[Archer]

Strawman, also ad hom.

Nothing but ignorance, I expected more.

If you can produce no Biblical proof against what the premise of this thread was then why only post ignorance.

HINT: It is not in the Bible.

 

[Archer]

The amount of scripture against homosexuality can't hold a candle to the sheer volume of scripture that condemns working on the Sabbath... yet in the Gospels, Jesus declares that even observance of the Sabbath is secondary to the greater virtues of love, justice, mercy and faithfulness. If you can't understand that, I really don't know what I can say to convince you.

Apparently, you value the opinion of Paul above the commandments of God, written with His own hand.

That is OT do you have a point?

 

[Archer]

OK I am going away for a while now. If anyone can find what is not there please do so.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

That is OT do you have a point?

Jesus declares the law of the Sabbath, one of the commandments written by God himself on Mount Sinai, to be secondary to love. By your argument, declare that Paul's opinion of homosexuality is more important than love. The implication of this is that you place Paul's opinion above that of God's explicit command. I just wonder why you would do that.

 

[Archer]

Paul was given the right by Christ. You are practicing avoidance again. Do you have a point? Scripture or nothing, as a matter of fact I will answer nothing but a legitimate scripture reference as it pertains to the point of this thread from this point forward Your childish babbling was humorous at first but now I begin to tire of it.

Later.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Paul was given the right by Christ.

The right to be greater than God?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

OK I am going away for a while now. If anyone can find what is not there please do so.

If you mean the passage in the Bible that says same-sex marriages are forbidden, then count me out. I've given up looking.

 

[Troublemane]

...the dark one controlling the momone forcing you to follow, using your foolish pride against the truth.

...momone?

 

[Archer]

If you mean the passage in the Bible that says same-sex marriages are forbidden, then count me out. I've given up looking.

or condoned or even where homosexuality is condoned. In context please not a one liner.

 

[Archer]

...momone?

I fixed that.

 

[no-body]

Romans 13:1-7
1Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and he will commend you. 4For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also because of conscience. 6This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God's servants, who give their full time to governing. 7Give everyone what you owe him: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

So it really doesn't matter whether it's a sin or not, you're supposed to keep your beliefs out of the government and support it.

Interestingly enough scholars think "homosexual offenders" is a mistranslation and Paul probably meant effeminate men. If you think the passages on women and homosexuals still count then you must think slavery is permissible too.

 

[Archer]

Romans 13:1-7
1Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and he will commend you. 4For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also because of conscience. 6This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God's servants, who give their full time to governing. 7Give everyone what you owe him: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

So it really doesn't matter whether it's a sin or not, you're supposed to keep your beliefs out of the government and support it.

Interestingly enough scholars think "homosexual offenders" is a mistranslation and Paul probably meant effeminate men. If you think the passages on women and homosexuals still count then you must think slavery is permissible too.

I do not disagree with this premise, I am only speaking of the churches that claim to be Christian. There is no precedent in the Bible for Gay marriage therefore it is wring for a Christian church to marry same sex couples.

BTW:I live where Gay marriage is not recognized by the state. so to be technical, though not incorrect, it does not pertain to me. Also this is a country with an elected body governing it and it is my duty to scrutinize the government, and try to help guide it in what I feel the best direction. Just as everyone else does.

 

[MoonWater]

archer again I repeat myself, in another thread you said that since the bible is largely silent on the issue of abortion you choose to refer to your own feelings on that matter. Now when it comes to same-sex marriage you yourself said that the bible neither condemns nor condones same sex marriage(please note that this isn't about homosexual sex but same-sex marriage). In short you have said that the bible is largley silent on the issue of same-sex marriage. So does that not mean that as you refer to your own feelings with regards to abortion so other christians and other churches should be allowed to refer to their own feelings on the matter of same-sex marriage?

 

[uu_sage]

My denomination, the United Church of Christ (UCC) is one of many denominations that is open and affirming and extends the rite of marriage to all of God's children including GLBTs. Scripture that supports our position includes
1 John 4:7-9
Beloved, let us love one another, because love is from God; everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. 8Whoever does not love does not know God, for God is love. 9God’s love was revealed among us in this way: God sent his only Son into the world so that we might live through him.



1 John 4:16-21
So we have known and believe the love that God has for us.God is love, and those who abide in love abide in God, and God abides in them. 17Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness on the day of judgement, because as he is, so are we in this world. 18There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear; for fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not reached perfection in love. 19We love* because he first loved us. 20Those who say, ‘I love God’, and hate their brothers or sisters,* are liars; for those who do not love a brother or sister* whom they have seen, cannot love God whom they have not seen. 21The commandment we have from him is this: those who love God must love their brothers and sisters* also.



1 Corinthians 13
If I speak in the tongues of mortals and of angels, but do not have love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3If I give away all my possessions, and if I hand over my body so that I may boast,* but do not have love, I gain nothing. 4 Love is patient; love is kind; love is not envious or boastful or arrogant 5or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; 6it does not rejoice in wrongdoing, but rejoices in the truth. 7It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
8 Love never ends. But as for prophecies, they will come to an end; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will come to an end. 9For we know only in part, and we prophesy only in part; 10but when the complete comes, the partial will come to an end. 11When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child; when I became an adult, I put an end to childish ways. 12For now we see in a mirror, dimly,* but then we will see face to face. Now I know only in part; then I will know fully, even as I have been fully known. 13And now faith, hope, and love abide, these three; and the greatest of these is love.



Ephesians 2: 19-20
So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are citizens with the saints and also members of the household of God, 20built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the cornerstone.

1 Timothy 4:10
For to this end we toil and struggle,* because we have our hope set on the living God, who is the Saviour of all people, especially of those who believe.

Galataians 3:28
There is no longer Jew or Greek, there is no longer slave or free, there is no longer male and female; for all of you are one in Christ Jesus.

John 13:35
35By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another

 

[Archer]

archer again I repeat myself, in another thread you said that since the bible is largely silent on the issue of abortion you choose to refer to your own feelings on that matter. Now when it comes to same-sex marriage you yourself said that the bible neither condemns nor condones same sex marriage(please note that this isn't about homosexual sex but same-sex marriage). In short you have said that the bible is largley silent on the issue of same-sex marriage. So does that not mean that as you refer to your own feelings with regards to abortion so other christians and other churches should be allowed to refer to their own feelings on the matter of same-sex marriage?

The bible is explicitly against homosexuality!!! So I defer to the bible.

 

[MoonWater]

The bible is explicitly against homosexuality!!! So I defer to the bible.

except this isn't about homosexuality but same sex marriage. Yes the two often go hand in hand but condemning homosexuality is not the same as condemning same sex marriage.

 

[Archer]

My denomination, the United Church of Christ (UCC) is one of many denominations that is open and affirming and extends the rite of marriage to all of God's children including GLBTs. Scripture that supports our position includes1 John 4:7-9
Beloved, let us love one another, because love is from God; everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. 8Whoever does not love does not know God, for God is love. 9God’s love was revealed among us in this way: God sent his only Son into the world so that we might live through him.



1 John 4:16-21
So we have known and believe the love that God has for us.God is love, and those who abide in love abide in God, and God abides in them. 17Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness on the day of judgement, because as he is, so are we in this world. 18There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear; for fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not reached perfection in love. 19We love* because he first loved us. 20Those who say, ‘I love God’, and hate their brothers or sisters,* are liars; for those who do not love a brother or sister* whom they have seen, cannot love God whom they have not seen. 21The commandment we have from him is this: those who love God must love their brothers and sisters* also.



1 Corinthians 13
If I speak in the tongues of mortals and of angels, but do not have love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3If I give away all my possessions, and if I hand over my body so that I may boast,* but do not have love, I gain nothing. 4 Love is patient; love is kind; love is not envious or boastful or arrogant 5or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; 6it does not rejoice in wrongdoing, but rejoices in the truth. 7It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
8 Love never ends. But as for prophecies, they will come to an end; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will come to an end. 9For we know only in part, and we prophesy only in part; 10but when the complete comes, the partial will come to an end. 11When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child; when I became an adult, I put an end to childish ways. 12For now we see in a mirror, dimly,* but then we will see face to face. Now I know only in part; then I will know fully, even as I have been fully known. 13And now faith, hope, and love abide, these three; and the greatest of these is love.



Ephesians 2: 19-20
So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are citizens with the saints and also members of the household of God, 20built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the cornerstone.

1 Timothy 4:10
For to this end we toil and struggle,* because we have our hope set on the living God, who is the Saviour of all people, especially of those who believe.

Galataians 3:28
There is no longer Jew or Greek, there is no longer slave or free, there is no longer male and female; for all of you are one in Christ Jesus.

John 13:35
35By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another

only one of those is even close until it is put in context: Galataians 3:26-29 26You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, 27for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.