But if you're already "clean" all the dirtying and washing in the world won't do much good.
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Saved from what?
- Thread starter Kcnorwood
- Start date
Poisonshady313
Well-Known Member
Don't bother telling a Christian that. He'll keep on telling you that you're still dirty.
sandandfoam
Veteran Member
Redemption for me is about the freeing of the good that is inside all of us
logician
Well-Known Member
So only Christians are good?
sandandfoam
Veteran Member
No. I believe humanity is good. I also believe in Universal salvation
You never know.
logician
Well-Known Member
Atheists know.
Draka
Wonder Woman
There have been atheists who have converted to a religion before. You never know what the future may bring. You may have some profound life experience that leaves you "finding religion". Maybe not Christianity, but then, they aren't the only religion.
Unless you claim to have some crystal ball and the ability to see the future, but then, that kind of conflicts with your whole "skeptic" stance now doesn't it?
logician
Well-Known Member
There have been atheists who have converted to a religion before. You never know what the future may bring. You may have some profound life experience that leaves you "finding religion". Maybe not Christianity, but then, they aren't the only religion.
Unless you claim to have some crystal ball and the ability to see the future, but then, that kind of conflicts with your whole "skeptic" stance now doesn't it?
I was a Christian for a number of years when I was young, and actually thought I was "saved" a couple of times. I now simply don't believe in the concept or god, and there is no way I could go back to a religious lifestyle, i.e. you can't make yourself believe something you don't believe.
sandandfoam
Veteran Member
That's true. And who in their right mind would want to try?
logician
Well-Known Member
Good question, there are many people sitting in chuch pews, I fear, that are asking themselves this sort of question - why am I here?
sandy whitelinger
Veteran Member
Thought about that for a long time, huh?
sandy whitelinger
Veteran Member
Cool, remove from your belief system what you are being saved from and then ask what you are being saved from. Next question please.
Wow. You made that sound so nice. Like someone else said, the wording would be totally different. IOW, most of the time, it won't sound as logical and straight-forward as that, but I think what you said is supposed to be the driving idea. And sometimes I'm sure it obviously will be. But, most of the time in my personal encounters with the "saving type" thier message revolves around being saved from the wrath of God and the fires of Hell. It usually goes like this:
You: "I don't believe in Hell, or a single angry and jealous God who is also benevolent.
Them: "Then you are a lost sheep who has not heard 'the word.' Hell is very real! Your spirit, your very soul is at stake! We all sin and we all must repent or we shall suffer in the lake of fire for all eternity and forfiet the glories of Heaven!..." and yatta yatta yatta.
True. But I find no reason to despise this tactic. I can get annoyed every now and then, but if I look at this approach as merely a clumsy way of conveying the message of selfless service to others, then why should I slam the door in their faces?
Perhaps I'm delusional myself, but trying to see this (imo) inherent message INSIDE the hellfire and brimstone message is what allows me to connect with evangelicals on a more appreciative and loving level.
Fish-Hunter
Rejoice in the Lord!
That's a great question. God saves us from Himself to Himself. We are saved from the wrath of God for our sin and continuous rebellion against His rightful rule over us.
Kcnorwood
Well-Known Member
Fish-Hunter
Rejoice in the Lord!
Yeah that makes me want to stop what I'm doing right now & convert.
It's impossible to convert on your own free will.
Please read John chapter 3 in the Bible. You must be born again before you can see the kingdom of God. You probably have no desire to come to Christ, because you are unable to see Christ as being desirable to come to. Is this true? Is the message of the cross foolishness to you?
Kcnorwood
Well-Known Member
It's impossible to convert on your own free will.
So it's like I've said all along he created sin just so he could save us from it... So he has to force you to convert Nice......