School shootings are students' own problem, learning CPR the solution, says Santorum.

[ImmortalFlame]

Nope just do more than become political activists. Anti-bully, outreach groups, etc. Heck one of students acknowledged Cruz had issues but choose to ostracize rather than attempt anything positive.

Except they're pushing for more funding for mental health support and outreach programs. "Being a political activist" is actually helping people address those exact problems. How else are people supposed to push for wide-reaching change than by campaigning and getting political about it?

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Old enough to be from a generation that helped the community instead of demands others do it for them.

And how is pushing for greater funding for community outreach programs and mental health support not helping the community?

I also find it pretty odious that you're basically talking down to, and professing superiority to, a group of teenagers who survived a school shooting and have dedicated their time and effort to doing what they believe is right despite aggressive reprisals, public derision, demonization and fierce political opposition.

But obviously your superiority complex is more important than the issue of dead kids, so you keep at it.

 

[Shad]

Your first sentence appears to contradict your first.

No it doesn't as it is pointing out different types of actions taken after a shooting is not blaming anyone.

"Outreach groups"? Any evidence to suggest that bullying is a major factor in producing school shooters?

I never claimed that. You are asking for evidence of a point I never made. However if you look at acts of violence social interaction between children is a factor in suicide, physical conflict and mental issues. The Parkland shooting had a number of students acknowledge Cruz was ostracized and why. Yet how many of them tried to help him in anyway? Point being there seems to be little sense of community outside their preferred social circles.

 

[Shad]

Except they're pushing for more funding for mental health support and outreach programs. "Being a political activist" is actually helping people address those exact problems. How else are people supposed to push for wide-reaching change than by campaigning and getting political about it?

I am talking about individual actions beyond political activism.

And how is pushing for greater funding for community outreach programs and mental health support not helping the community?

It helps the community but they as individuals are not doing much. Anyone can be an activist. This is the difference between asking for say funding for the poor and working with the poor in shelters, etc. directly.

I also find it pretty odious that you're basically talking down to, and professing superiority to, a group of teenagers who survived a school shooting and have dedicated their time and effort to doing what they believe is right despite aggressive reprisals, public derision, demonization and fierce political opposition.

No I am criticizing political activism as the only things people could be doing. They could be 30 for all I care.

It seems like you want to make an exception to how they conduct themselves, and are responded to, because they are children. They stepped into the world of politics either willingly or as puppets of the media (there are children being used by both sides; see Fox News). They can call the NRA and other people murders, claim they are responsible, blah blah. Yet no one can respond in kind because they are children? Politics or children. Pick one.

Frankly what I have said was really mild so your point seems like a overreaction. There are people that wont even listen to a word they say ie ageism. Yet if one criticizes their actions and words that is out of line. Hilarious

But obviously your superiority complex is more important than the issue of dead kids, so you keep at it.

Hilarious spin to avoid having to provide any argument.

 

[Father Heathen]

Old enough to be from a generation that helped the community instead of demands others do it for them.

So how does one go about changing legislation without involving legislators? How are children supposed to keep guns out of the hands of those unfit to have them? Think, kiddo.

 

[Shad]

So how does one go about changing legislation without involving legislators?

I am talking about doing more than activism.

How are children supposed to keep guns out of the hands of those unfit to have them? Think, kiddo.

Strawman as I never said they must confront the shooter nor disarm them. I am talking about acts in helping individuals at an individual level not merely doing a march and going back to one's life. IE Asking for funding for the poor vs working with the poor to help them. Ostracization for example is one issue students can address as individuals.

Take a look at Emma González statement that Cruz being a shooter was no surprise. She fully acknowledge Cruz was ostracized and more so deserved it. Seems like she didn't do anything from challenging bullying, report it, etc. She did nothing until Cruz had an effect on her life. There is a word for that.

 

[fantome profane]

I am talking about individual actions beyond political activism.

And what do you actually know about these individuals upon whom you are passing judgdment? Do you know how many of these activists know CPR? Or first aid? Do you know what other kind of activities the participate in? Do you know if they volunteer anywhere? What do you actually know?

It helps the community but they as individuals are not doing much.

How do you know that? How do you know they are not involved in anti-bullying campaigns? Or peer counciling? How do you know?

I would bet that at least some of the leaders of this movement have been very active in their communities, they seem the type. But I don’t know. I admit I don’t know. And neither do you, but you are happy to pass judgement on these people.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

No it doesn't as it is pointing out different types of actions taken after a shooting is not blaming anyone.



I never claimed that. You are asking for evidence of a point I never made. However if you look at acts of violence social interaction between children is a factor in suicide, physical conflict and mental issues. The Parkland shooting had a number of students acknowledge Cruz was ostracized and why. Yet how many of them tried to help him in anyway? Point being there seems to be little sense of community outside their preferred social circles.

I'm not playing "Imply then deny" with you.

 

[Father Heathen]

I am talking about doing more than activism.

Oh, so in other words you're just presuming that none of these kids are doing anything more.

 

[Shad]

Oh, so in other words you're just presuming that none of these kids are doing anything more.

The media stars do not seem to do much besides activism. Hence why the point was formed as a question in the video. If they are good for them. However the media stars do not seem to do much else.

 

[Shad]

I'm not playing "Imply then deny" with you.

You made up an idea in your head. I told you that is not what I said. Seems like you can not handle people telling you that your assumption was wrong.or people telling you what they mean.

 

[Shad]

And what do you actually know about these individuals upon whom you are passing judgdment?

Only what is presented by them on twitter and the media. So if you have more information feel free to present it.

Do you know how many of these activists know CPR? Or first aid? Do you know what other kind of activities the participate in? Do you know if they volunteer anywhere? What do you actually know?

They could have easily put forward such knowledge if it mattered to them. I can only judge what they provide not what they withhold. See the above.

How do you know that?

Based on information they provide to the media. I see the rallies, speech, marches. I have yet to see much outside of those activities. Hence I make a conclusion based on the information I have.

How do you know they are not involved in anti-bullying campaigns?

I know one isn't as she justified her bullying in public. To a lesser extend she acknowledge a number of students took part as she used the word 'we'.

Or peer counciling? How do you know?

Against I can only use information available to me. The focus on political activism and the absence of individual actions of the type I am talking about is obvious in the media.

I would bet that at least some of the leaders of this movement have been very active in their communities, they seem the type.

Our impressions differ.

But I don’t know. I admit I don’t know. And neither do you, but you are happy to pass judgement on these people.

As they are happy to pass judgement on anyone that disagrees with them. My judgement could be wrong due to low information. However I am not the one with a mic calling people murders.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

You made up an idea in your head. I told you that is not what I said. Seems like you can not handle people telling you that your assumption was wrong.or people telling you what they mean.

No, I know what you said. You know what you said. Your meaning was clear, and when called on your nonsense, you'd rather play argumentam ad dictionariam than discuss the actual point. Been there, done that, it's a dumb game, and I'm not playing.

 

[fantome profane]

Only what is presented by them

And have you seen their resumes? Have you seen their school records?

That is the point. You do not have enough information to draw the conclusions you have drawn.

And btw, they are under no obligation to justify themselves to you before exercising their first amendment rights.

 

[Shad]

No, I know what you said. You know what you said.

Wrong

Your meaning was clear, and when called on your nonsense, you'd rather play argumentam ad dictionariam than discuss the actual point.

Wrong again.

Been there, done that, it's a dumb game, and I'm not playing.

A game in your head.

 

[Shad]

And have you seen their resumes? Have you seen their school records?

Doesn't matter as I am going by their actions which are being promoted.

That is the point. You do not have enough information to draw the conclusions you have drawn.

One can still make a conclusion with low information. They are after all with their movement. Ironic that they can make conclusion yet I can not.

And btw, they are under no obligation to justify themselves to you before exercising their first amendment rights.

Never claimed that. I am just pointing out political activism in absences community action is easy to the point anyone can do it.

 

[fantome profane]

One can still make a conclusion with low information

Most Trump supporters do just that.

 

[Shad]

Most Trump supporters do just that.

Never voted for Trump. Try your smear on someone else.

 

[fantome profane]

Never voted for Trump. Try your smear on someone else.

I am not smearing you, you are smearing you. You are the one who said you draw your conclusions on the basis of low information.

And that certainly seems to be the case.

 

[Shad]

I am not smearing you, you are smearing you.

Nope. I am arguing about anti-gun protestors that only focus on activism in absences of direct action with individuals. The lower information point is what they release to the public which is not my problem.
Hence Cruz's question. What else are they doing? No one has answered this question.

You are the one who said you draw your conclusions on the basis of low information.

So? People can make a conclusion with low information if they wish. This does not make my points wrong but merely decreases the probability of accuracy. You are adding no new information. Do you have their resumes? Their profiles? If you have new information post it.

And that certainly seems to be the case.

Nope you are conflating me holding a certain viewpoint that happens to be shared by a lot of Trump supporters as evidence of supporting Trump himself.

Ironic low information conclusion you have here. Weren't you just arguing against such judgements? You made a low information conclusion. I provided new information which can be used to show the conclusion is wrong. This is how it works