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Signs of The End: A Baha'i View

Lady B

noob
Yes, totally and completely.
Come and visit the http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/scriptural-debates/139802-adam-alpha-omega.html thread and see part of why I see it this way.

Before I visit this thread, may I just get some clarification, so that I am clear on what your claiming here?

The Father, God, creator of Heaven and earth, The most Holy of Holy, The being that is absolutely perfection by which we measure all transgressed? Define for me please transgressed if you will. And define fell as well please.

So then he becomes the holy Ghost? This is a demotion? And then as The Holy Ghost he partners up with Christ and regains his Throne?

Please take care here, and do not grieve the Holy Spirit, for this is one sin God will not forgive. I am not sure If I am assuming too much by your statements, I wish it is so that I am....
 

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
Look at Isaiah 44:6.
LORD = King of Israel (Michael)
LORD of hosts = Redeemer of the King (Jehovah)
King and Redeemer in Union = God (Eloheim)

We have differences in semantics.
There are three Messianic figures and a God's Christ figure as well.

Baha'u'llah wasn't any of these figures, but he appears to have testified of them.

I agree the Trinity as commonly understood is flawed.

He was also the Lion of the Tribe of Judah.

And, as far as being the lamb goes, he did represent the fulfillment of the passover lamb of the spring feast/harvest. Don't forget that there is also the animals of the fall feasts to look for the fulfillment of too.


Yes there is. The Father comes in the end and in the beginning as the Alpha and the Omega. He too undergoes a cycle of death and rebirth. He falls and dies at the end and becomes the Holy Ghost and He is redeemed and stands as the Father to complete what He started in laying the foundation for a new cycle of Creation.


Sure there is, read the narrative about Adam.


I agree it is not totally obvious, but that is what you come to understand when you are able to read within the sealed portion of the Bible.

I don't claim to have unsealed it. There was someone contemporary to Baha'u'llah who unsealed it back in the 1830's.

Nope, I investigated the claims by the commentators that such was the case but what they present as such does not open the deepest levels of the sealed portion.


At that time Adam had indeed brought in the morning of the first resurrection and it was well underway.

And indeed it had. Baha'u'llah was merely voice to speak of what was actually truly happening elsewhere.

Sounds good to me. Take care!

Dear kylixguru,

Baha'u''lah has said, All things that was in Gospel has been fulfilled:

“He, in truth, hath come unto the world in His most great glory, and all that hath been mentioned in the Gospel hath been fulfilled.”
“THE time fore-ordained unto the peoples and kindreds of the earth is now come. The promises of God, as recorded in the holy Scriptures, have all been fulfilled.”

There is nothing more from Gospel to be fulfilled. Upto you believe it or not.

"Say: Whether ye rejoice or whether ye burst for fury, the heavens are cleft asunder, and God hath come down, invested with radiant sovereignty. All created things are heard exclaiming: “The Kingdom is God’s, the Almighty, the All-Knowing, the All-Wise.” - Baha'u'llah

Bahá'í Reference Library - Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 33-35




Moreover, it was not the first resurrection, it was the second resurrection:

"Upon Our arrival in ‘Iráq, We found the Cause of God sunk in deep apathy and the breeze of divine revelation stilled. Most of the believers were faint and dispirited, nay utterly lost and dead. Hence there was a second blast on the Trumpet, whereupon the Tongue of Grandeur uttered these blessed words:
‘We have sounded the Trumpet for the second time.’ Thus the whole world was quickened through the vitalizing breaths of divine revelation and inspiration. (Bahá’u’lláh, Ishráqát in Tablets 131)

According to this statement, there occurred what is otherwise referred to as the “Second Resurrection.”

http://www.bahai-studies.ca/journal/files/jbs/3.4%20Buck.pdf


1830 is the wrong date. The correct Day is the Day of declaration of Baha'u'llah, which is calculated from Bible:

"...[In Daniel, chapter 12] in verse 11, it is said: “And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolation be set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.”†
The beginning of this lunar reckoning is from the day of the proclamation of the prophethood of Muḥammad in the country of Ḥijáz; and that was three years after His mission, because in the beginning the prophethood of Muḥammad was kept secret, and no one knew it save Khadíjah and Ibn Nawfal.‡ After three years it was announced. And Bahá’u’lláh, in the year 1290 from the proclamation of the mission of Muḥammad, caused His manifestation to be known."
- Abdulbaha, Some Answered Questions
 
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savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Baha'u''lah has said, All things that was in Gospel has been fulfilled:

“He, in truth, hath come unto the world in His most great glory, and all that hath been mentioned in the Gospel hath been fulfilled.”


[they]wandered away from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some. 2 Timothy 2:18

"I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day." John 11:24

"Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and come out--those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned" John 5:29

How, please, has the resurrection already been fulfilled?
 

kylixguru

Well-Known Member
Before I visit this thread, may I just get some clarification, so that I am clear on what your claiming here?
Well, we are in someone else's thread. I hope they won't mind.

The Father, God, creator of Heaven and earth, The most Holy of Holy, The being that is absolutely perfection by which we measure all transgressed?
The glorified Being who created our current heavens and earth was redeemed and had no transgression upon Him at the time the Creation was organized. My understanding is that Adam is who performed this after He was redeemed.

But, the path to get to that exalted state required that He first undergo some experiences that enabled Him to be capable of standing in that most Holy position of Creator. Before Adam was in a position to assign to all of the "creatures" their "new names" (which is performing the Creation), He needed some personal first-hand experience to see for Himself the reality of what the ramifications were when He assigned a particular "name" to a "creature". What did it mean to assign someone to be a "fish", a "bird", etc. and what did it mean to strike someone's name from the "book of life" altogether? He needed to fully comprehend 100% by personal experience everything in order to be a just judge and to assign the "names" appropriately.

Thus, Adam had to undergo a fall so that He could see for himself the entire spectrum from top to bottom. This trip also enabled Him to directly interact with "creatures" at every level. In order for there to be the possibility of saving everyone from even the deepest level of Hell, God had to penetrate to those levels and gain first-hand experience and be accessible to all, no matter where they had descended to.

This is what happened when Adam passed through the phase or mission of being the Holy Ghost. So, in another manner of speaking, "Yes", God did actually transgress Himself and take a trip to descend below all things, but it was something that provided necessary experience so that he could have full knowledge when He performed the organization of the new Creation.

Define for me please transgressed if you will.
Adam was created in the exact image and likeness of God and Adam was given dominion over the entire Creation. Thus, for all intents and purposes, Adam was designated to become the God for everything within that Creation, including all of its warts and its baggage.

Adam inherited a Creation near the end of its cycle from the God who created it and then placed Him in it and passed the torch of dominion over it to Him. It became Adam's mission to subdue it and bring new life and order back into it by birthing it anew. Essentially, Adam would totally reorganize a new heavens and a new earth and stand as its great patriarchal head, both spiritually as well as physically.

Shortly after Adam was created, He found Himself in quite a bind. He had received specific commandments from His Creator but things quickly developed such that He had to chose between the lesser of two transgressions. He could have told Eve that he wouldn't eat the fruit she was offering him and become separated from Her, which would have violated the command for Him to be joined to Her and to remain with Her. Or, he could partake of the fruit in order to face the same fate as Eve faced. However, to do so He would have to transgress the commandment not to partake of the forbidden fruit. He chose to stay with Eve. And, that was the correct choice for sure because it wasn't long before they were redeemed from the consequences of their transgressions. Had Adam not partaken with Eve, He could have done nothing to assist in Her redemption.

And define fell as well please.
Their fall was actually them being "destroyed in the flesh" in the same way the northern and southern kingdoms of Israel and Judah were "stoned to death" as Jehovah's adulterous brides Aholah and Aholibah. (See Ezekiel 23)

Adam and Eve were driven out of their promised land, which was the Garden of Eden, and scattered out into the lone and dreary wilderness. This exile of the northern kingdom, as well as the exile of the southern kingdom, was the death or fall of their society. Adam and Eve being exiled from the Garden of Eden was in this exact same manner.

This is how a flesh and bone being is destroyed in the flesh. They become scattered abroad like the bits and pieces of a dead and decomposing body. No longer were they an autonomous societal body able to function as a sovereign cohesive society, but they were subject to the buffetings of their adversary and taken for a spoil. They remained in that condition until their time of redemption came and Adam could be placed back upon His throne and He and Eve could go back to giving all of the creatures their new names. Whatever work they performed prior to their fall had to be redone since the process of them falling defiled all that they had accomplished to that point.

So then he becomes the holy Ghost?
The Holy Ghost is Adam in His fallen state. A ghost means a disembodied spirit, which is what Adam became upon being destroyed in the flesh and exiled out of the Garden of Eden.

This is a demotion?
Well, you could look at it that way, but it was also a necessary experience that He had to undergo in order to see the full spectrum and to be able to minister to the full spectrum.

And then as The Holy Ghost he partners up with Christ and regains his Throne?
Son of Man comes in the office and authority of Elijah and performs the "restitution of all things", which has the direct effect of redeeming Adam from His fallen state. Son of Man specifically has the job of redeeming Adam. He bestows upon Adam His former glory and renews Him and frees Him from death.

Please take care here, and do not grieve the Holy Spirit, for this is one sin God will not forgive. I am not sure If I am assuming too much by your statements, I wish it is so that I am....
Grieving the Holy Spirit is not unforgivable. Knowing Him fully and then willfully denying Him is.

Add:
The only ones who committed this totally unforgivable sin were the fallen "sons of god" (aka watchers of Genesis 6) who were part of the body of Seth (Son of Man) who had the authority and responsibility to redeem Adam (Michael) from His fallen state and to put Him back upon His Throne. Not all of the "watchers" were favorable towards the individual that the Holy Ghost chose to facilitate Adam's redemption through. Even though the Holy Ghost descended upon and overshadowed this person as a new tabernacle, the watchers didn't recognize Him for who He was. Rather than recognize Him as the Holy Ghost tabernacled again in the flesh, they took Him to be the most evil one. Look at the conflicts that took place between them and Michael in the book of Jude and 2 Peter 2. They failed to recognize Him because they had suffered themselves to be overcome with lust and a desire to have worldly fame. They had different ideas about what to do when being in such a high and exalted position of responsibility. They wanted Michael to support them in their abuse of the marriage laws to take daughters of men as captive and/or seduced wives and to help them get more worldly fame. Their high and exalted authority went to their heads. When Michael declined to cooperate in their schemes it became quite a contest where they took Him to be their enemy instead of who they were supposed to redeem and anoint as King. So, because they were superior in authority to Michael, that is why it says Michael didn't judge them. Their authority was was higher, but they misused it. What eventually happened is Michael continued to stand His ground quietly and patiently and the watchers simply had enough of it. They gave Michael an ultimatum to cooperate with their designs or to be cast out and cursed if He didn't repent as they presumed He should have to do. He didn't cave in and so they used the authority they had to curse and cast souls into outer-darkness in such a way that it actually backfired upon themselves. There's a built-in clause such that anything done by virtue of the priesthood power of God that is done to curse someone who is innocent of deserving such, that curse comes back upon those who issued it in unrighteousness. Therefore, there likely isn't ever an actual time that God directly sends anyone to outer-darkness, but those who use that provision in unrighteousness put themselves there. These are the men who had the knowledge and the keys and who knew Michael (Holy Ghost) personally and were able to witness the light of his glory, but even though they were standing as if before the sun at noon-day, they declared of Him "this is darkness". They totally denied the Holy Ghost and attempted to cast Him into outer-darkness.
 
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InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
[they]wandered away from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some. 2 Timothy 2:18

"I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day." John 11:24

"Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and come out--those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned" John 5:29

How, please, has the resurrection already been fulfilled?

Dear Savagewind,

You have asked: "How, please, has the resurrection already been fulfilled?"

This is an excellent question.:clap
You have also provided some verses in support that if someone says, the resurrection is come, they destroy the faith of some.

Let's look at the verses carefully to see the Message in them:


" [they]wandered away from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some." 2 Timothy 2:18

See how clearly this verse rejects the idea of physical Resurrection.

That verse goes with this verse:

"But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead?" 1 Corin. 12:12

and Jesus had said:

“Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies;” John 11:25

It is clear, that, as Jesus had come, and as He was the Resurrection, it was correct to say, the Ressurection had come with First coming of Christ. verse John 11:25 confirms it.

However, 2 Timothy 2:18 rebukes those who said, Resurrection had come. Why?
The reason is that, they had believed that the Resurrection is a physical resurrection, and since, they believed that Jesus was raised Physically, they said "The Resurrection has come"

Likewise Baha'i Faith rejects that there will ever be a physical Resurrection. Everytime, a Divine Manifestation of God appears, that Day is the Day of Resurrection. By Him a new Spirit is given to the World which creates a New Human Civilization. All things become New. Consider the time before Baha'i Revelation (Before 1844) and the rapid change of the World, after the Baha'i Revelation, in terms of science, the way of thinking, the ways of life and even the type of cloths and everything else.




Moreover, you had quoted the following verse:

"Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and come out--those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned" John 5:29"

and asking me how the above verse is fulfilled if the Day of Resurrection has come?

This is another excellent question.:clap

The meaning is this: whenever, a Manifestation of God is raised, with Him, both the true companions and believers "Return and are raised" as well as those who are His enemies who oppose Him.

This can be seen from the verses of Bible if we carefully consider the following verses:

"In fact, he [Elijah] already has come, but he wasn't recognized, and was badly mistreated by many... Then the disciples realized he was speaking of John the Baptist."-Matthew 17:10-13

The meaning is not that, the spirit of Elijah went inside the body of John. It means, the same “type” with the same spiritual quality is returned as the person of John.

Likewise, the enemies also had returned. Considering this verse carefully:

"Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery." Matthew 19:9

Note that, the Law of Moses was given to people who lived about 1500 years before Jesus. How is it that Jesus is saying to those living in His time: “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard”

It is clear that, in the sight of Jesus, these were the same people who lived 1500 years ago, who had hard hearts.

Likewise with the revelation of Baha’i Faith, both those who have done good rose, and those who have done evil rose.

For example John had returned before Baha’u’llah:

“O followers of the Son! We have once again sent John unto you, and He, verily, hath cried out in the wilderness of the Bayán: O peoples of the world! Cleanse your eyes! The Day whereon ye can behold the Promised One and attain unto Him hath drawn nigh!” – Baha’u’llah

Bahá'í Reference Library - The Summons of the Lord of Hosts, Pages 54-67


The Bab, like John appeared before the coming of the Lord, and in His Book, called “Bayán”, He had said, that the Promised Day is near. He was the return of the John.

Likewise those who were enemies and wanted to kill Baha'u'llah rose.

Even as it was written:

"Look, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him; and all the peoples of the earth will mourn because of him. So shall it be! Amen." Rev. 1:7
 

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
The Quran also, like the Bible says, that God created Heavens and the earth in six Days:

"It is Allah Who has created the heavens and the earth, and all between them, in six Days, and is firmly established on the Throne (of Authority): ye have none, besides Him, to protect or intercede (for you): will ye not then receive admonition?" 32:4


It is interesting to note the next verse:

"He rules (all) affairs from the heavens to the earth: in the end will (all affairs) go up to Him, on a Day, the space whereof will be (as) a thousand years of your reckoning." 32:5

"Yet they ask thee to hasten on the Punishment! But Allah will not fail in His Promise. Verily a Day in the sight of thy Lord is like a thousand years of your reckoning." Quran 22:47


The above verse, says each Day of God is 1000 years.

Thus creation in six Days, equates 6000 years.

That period started with Adam according to Bible.

Counting from that time, the end of 6000 years was about a couple of centuries before.

This is known as the first Creation according to Quran:

“Are We wearied out with the first creation? Yet are they in doubt with regard to a new creation!” Quran 50:15

The above verse says, God did not get tired of the first creation, do not have doubt about the New Creation.

Bible Prophecises:


"And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new." Revelation 21:5


And Baha'i Writings says:


"the Blessed Báb, Prophet and Herald of the Faith of Bahá'u'lláh, Founder of the Dispensation marking the culmination of the six thousand year old Adamic Cycle"
Adamic Cycle - Bahai9



and Baha'u'llah Revealed:


"Verily, We have caused every soul to expire by virtue of Our irresistible and all-subduing sovereignty. We have, then, called into being a new creation, as a token of Our grace unto men. I am, verily, the All-Bountiful, the Ancient of Days. "



"It is evident that every age in which a Manifestation of God hath lived is divinely ordained, and may, in a sense, be characterized as God’s appointed Day. This Day, however, is unique, and is to be distinguished from those that have preceded it. The designation “Seal of the Prophets” fully revealeth its high station. The Prophetic Cycle hath, verily, ended. The Eternal Truth is now come. He hath lifted up the Ensign of Power, and is now shedding upon the world the unclouded splendor of His Revelation."
Bahá'í Reference Library - Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, Page 60
 
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savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
It is my unsupported opinion that "day" does not define a length of time but it means all that it takes to get something of the day accomplished. I shall wake up and I shall not sleep until what I have purposed to do "today" is done.
 

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
It is my unsupported opinion that "day" does not define a length of time but it means all that it takes to get something of the day accomplished. I shall wake up and I shall not sleep until what I have purposed to do "today" is done.

Well, I believe that 6 Days, is the 6000 years of creation of human civilization through progressive revelations of God.

Here are verses from Genesis 1: (I only interprete the first few, but can do all the way)


1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.


The expression "and darkness was upon the face of the deep" represent, darkness of error. Lack of Guidance.

See: (3)

The expression "the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters." signifies coming of Wisdom and the guidance from God. Void means, void of spirit of God, which is guidance.


See: (6)


1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.



"Light" is the symbol of guidance. His word divides between False and Truth. Darkness and Light.




1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.



"Day" within the context, is a period when there is guidance. That is the beginning of every revelation.

See: (4)

1:6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.


"Firnament" within the context means, Religion of God. Waters on one hand cause slip. on the other hand gives life. Religion guides human to know what water causes slip, and what water gives life.

see (1) (2) and (5)


1:7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.


The waters which were under firnament, signify "the earthly waters" which cause slip and error. The waters above, signifies "Heavenly Water" which is the cause of Heavenly life. People of Noah were saved by the Waters. (see Bible)

In this interpretation other verses of Bible is used, as well as Baha'i Scriptures.

For example:

(1) Water of life, saves mankind:

"...eight souls were saved by water." 1 peter 3:20

(2) Water causing slip and error:

"Wherefore their way shall be unto them as slippery ways in the darkness"Jerm. 23:12

(3) Light is the symbol of guidance:

"When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, "I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life." John 8:12


(4) A Day, is a period when there is guidance. Night means,when the Manifestation of God leaves the world:

"As long as it is day, we must do the work of him who sent me. Night is coming, when no one can work. While I am in the world, I am the light of the world." John 9:4-5

(5) Firnament, means a heavenly guidance:

"the Dispensation of the Providence hath been raised in the Firmament of the Bayan" Baha'u'llah


(6) Spirit of God, brings Wisdom and guidance:

"And I have filled him with the spirit of God, in wisdom, and in understanding, and in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship," Exodus 31:3
 
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Lady B

noob
Dear FearGod,

The stories that another one was crucified instead of Jesus, are all man-made.
God, has forbidden in Quran, that no one should add anything to His Book, and says, that is from God.

Although, that subject is not directly related to the thread, but I will give you the essential meaning and purpose of the things Christ had said on the Cross from Baha'i Scriptures:

"Remind them of these words and say unto them: ‘Verily did the Pharisees rise up against Messiah, despite the bright beauty of His face and all His comeliness, and they cried out that He was not Messiah [Masíh] but a monster [Masíkh], because He had claimed to be Almighty God, the sovereign Lord of all, and told them, ‘I am God’s Son, and verily in the inmost being of His only Son, His mighty Ward, clearly revealed with all His attributes, all His perfections, standeth the Father.’

This, they said, was open blasphemy and slander against the Lord according to the clear and irrefutable texts of the Old Testament. Therefore they passed the sentence upon Him, decreeing that His blood be shed, and they hanged Him on the cross, where He cried out,

‘O My beloved Lord, how long wilt Thou abandon Me to them? Lift Me up unto Thee, shelter Me close to Thee, make Me a dwelling by Thy throne of glory. Verily art Thou the Answerer of prayers, and Thou art the Clement, the Merciful. O My Lord! Verily this world with all its vastness can no longer contain Me, and I love this cross, out of love for Thy beauty, and yearning for Thy realm on high, and because of this fire, fanned by the gusts of Thy holiness, aflame within My heart. Help me, O Lord, to ascend unto Thee, sustain Me that I may reach unto Thy sacred Threshold, O My loving Lord! Verily Thou art the Merciful, the Possessor of great bounty! Verily Thou art the Generous! Verily Thou art the Compassionate! Verily Thou art the All-Knowing! There is none other God save Thee, the Mighty, the Powerful!’"

Selections From the Writings of Abdulbaha

Where on earth did you gather this Quote? Where did Abdubaha get this ? This is not what was recorded in the Bible, and what was recorded in the Bible was in reference to prophesy ." why has thou forsaken me" was also a psalm prophesying Christ's crucifiction. Are you adding to scripture here? :confused:
 

FearGod

Freedom Of Mind
Originally Posted by InvestigateTruth
Dear FearGod,

The stories that another one was crucified instead of Jesus, are all man-made.
God, has forbidden in Quran, that no one should add anything to His Book, and says, that is from God.

Although, that subject is not directly related to the thread, but I will give you the essential meaning and purpose of the things Christ had said on the Cross from Baha'i Scriptures:

"Remind them of these words and say unto them: ‘Verily did the Pharisees rise up against Messiah, despite the bright beauty of His face and all His comeliness, and they cried out that He was not Messiah [Masíh] but a monster [Masíkh], because He had claimed to be Almighty God, the sovereign Lord of all, and told them, ‘I am God’s Son, and verily in the inmost being of His only Son, His mighty Ward, clearly revealed with all His attributes, all His perfections, standeth the Father.’

This, they said, was open blasphemy and slander against the Lord according to the clear and irrefutable texts of the Old Testament. Therefore they passed the sentence upon Him, decreeing that His blood be shed, and they hanged Him on the cross, where He cried out,

‘O My beloved Lord, how long wilt Thou abandon Me to them? Lift Me up unto Thee, shelter Me close to Thee, make Me a dwelling by Thy throne of glory. Verily art Thou the Answerer of prayers, and Thou art the Clement, the Merciful. O My Lord! Verily this world with all its vastness can no longer contain Me, and I love this cross, out of love for Thy beauty, and yearning for Thy realm on high, and because of this fire, fanned by the gusts of Thy holiness, aflame within My heart. Help me, O Lord, to ascend unto Thee, sustain Me that I may reach unto Thy sacred Threshold, O My loving Lord! Verily Thou art the Merciful, the Possessor of great bounty! Verily Thou art the Generous! Verily Thou art the Compassionate! Verily Thou art the All-Knowing! There is none other God save Thee, the Mighty, the Powerful!’"

Selections From the Writings of Abdulbaha

Who is Abulbaha ?

Who is the messenger, Bahaullah or Abdulbaha ?
Your scripture is written by Bahaullah or Abdulbaha.
 

Lady B

noob
Who is Abulbaha ?

Who is the messenger, Bahaullah or Abdulbaha ?
Your scripture is written by Bahaullah or Abdulbaha.

Abdu'l-Bahá, Bahá'u'lláh's eldest son and appointed successor, led the Faith after His Father's passing.

The way I see it, Bahai's had 3 messengers. Bab, Bahalulaah and then his son Abdulbaha.Is this correct Investigate?
 

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
Who is Abulbaha ?

Who is the messenger, Bahaullah or Abdulbaha ?
Your scripture is written by Bahaullah or Abdulbaha.


Dear FearGod,

The Baha'i Faith started with the Bab who claimed to be the Mahdi. The Bab revealed many verses (in the range of hundreds of thousands). In His Books, He constantly said, the Promised One will appear very soon. Then after the Martyrdom of the Bab, some years later, Baha'u'llah appeared.
Baha'u'llah wrote many Books, all of them has His own special seal, to be known as original.
Baha'u'llah in His Writings appointed Abdulbaha as His 'infallible' successor, who will be the interpreter of His verses, and asked Baha'is to follow Abdulbaha, after Baha'u'llah's Ascension.
Abdulbaha, Also wrote many Books and interpretations, and He also signed or sealed His Books.
Abdulbaha is not a Prophet, since, the Prophetic Cycle has ended with Muhammad.
Baha'u'llah gave Him, the Title of Mystery of God.
 

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
Abdu'l-Bahá, Bahá'u'lláh's eldest son and appointed successor, led the Faith after His Father's passing.
The way I see it, Bahai's had 3 messengers. Bab, Bahalulaah and then his son Abdulbaha.Is this correct Investigate?

Dear Lady,

Mostly correct, but Abdulbaha is not a Prophet. The Prophetic Cycle has ended with Muhammad.
Abdulbaha is the infallible center of Covenant of the Baha'i Faith. Baha'u'llah in His Will appointed Abdulbaha, and asked Baha'is to refer to Abdulbaha after Baha'u'llah's Ascension.

Where on earth did you gather this Quote? Where did Abdubaha get this ? This is not what was recorded in the Bible, and what was recorded in the Bible was in reference to prophesy ." why has thou forsaken me" was also a psalm prophesying Christ's crucifiction. Are you adding to scripture here? :confused:

Dear LadyB,

Since Baha'u'llah is the Return of Christ, and He appointed Abdulbaha as His infallible successor who has the knowledge to inteprete the verses of God, the explaination that Abdulbaha has given, is the correct interpretation of the Bible, and is not considered addition. This is like if a Jew is saying that the Disciples of Christ who wrote the New Testament has added to Old Testament.
So, first, let's see if there is any of the signs of the End is not passed yet ;)
 
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Lady B

noob
Dear Lady,

Mostly correct, but Abdulbaha is not a Prophet. The Prophetic Cycle has ended with Muhammad.
Abdulbaha is the infallible center of Covenant of the Baha'i Faith. Baha'u'llah in His Will appointed Abdulbaha, and asked Baha'is to refer to Abdulbaha after Baha'u'llah's Ascension.



Dear LadyB,

Since Baha'u'llah is the Return of Christ, and He appointed Abdulbaha as His infallible successor who has the knowledge to inteprete the verses of God, the explaination that Abdulbaha has given, is the correct interpretation of the Bible, and is not considered addition. This is like if a Jew is saying that the Disciples of Christ who wrote the New Testament has added to Old Testament.
So, first, let's see if there is any of the signs of the End is not passed yet ;)

so I have been researching Bahaullah and His son, and I found some remarkable statements from him/them. could you confirm these for me please? Just tell me If they are legitamate writings, no need to interpret them for me, they are clear enough.


2. Bahaullah mentions in Aqdas, page 43, "There is no God but I the Honoured , the Wise".
3. He again writes in Aqdas, page 144 "Accept whatever is commanded by Baha (himself) the Lord of Eternity".
4. In Aqdas, page 8, "We have sent down all the Messengers and we have revealed all the Books".
5. In Istadaaraat, page 34, Bahaullah writes, "The Master of Eternity lies in prison".
6. In his Tablets, Page 217, Bahaullah writes, "All save me are created from my command".
7. In his Al-Mubeen, page 34, Bahaullah writes "All praise is for you O Bahaullah, the Creator of existence".
8. In the same book, page 190, he says, "Obey the commands of your Elevated, Splendorous God, Bahaullah.
9. Again in Al-Mubeen, page 297, he again refers to himself as, "You Most beneficent Lord, Bahaullah",
10. In his Tajalliyaat (Tajalli number 4), page 5, Bahaullah decrees, "Most surely I am Allah. There is no God save me. I am the Lord of everything. The O my creatures, you worship me alone".
11. Abdul Baha writes in Badaaiul Aasaar, page 139, Bahaullah is unique, Incomparable. It is necessary for everyone to turn towards Bahaullah in his prayers. 12. In Maftoon, page 15, Bahaullah writes to his son Abdul Baha, "This s a letter from Allah, the Honoured and the Wise (Bahaullah) to Allah the Gracious, the Aware (Abdul Baha)."
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Excuse me! Please. I think he thinks he is. I do not think he is. Seems to me that, oh I don't know, God and d*amn it goes together. What do you think?
 

FearGod

Freedom Of Mind
Dear FearGod,

The Baha'i Faith started with the Bab who claimed to be the Mahdi. The Bab revealed many verses (in the range of hundreds of thousands). In His Books, He constantly said, the Promised One will appear very soon. Then after the Martyrdom of the Bab, some years later, Baha'u'llah appeared.
Baha'u'llah wrote many Books, all of them has His own special seal, to be known as original.
Baha'u'llah in His Writings appointed Abdulbaha as His 'infallible' successor, who will be the interpreter of His verses, and asked Baha'is to follow Abdulbaha, after Baha'u'llah's Ascension.
Abdulbaha, Also wrote many Books and interpretations, and He also signed or sealed His Books.
Abdulbaha is not a Prophet, since, the Prophetic Cycle has ended with Muhammad.
Baha'u'llah gave Him, the Title of Mystery of God.

How come that the bab was the Mahdi and muslims didn't accept him and how Bahaullah was the return of christ and both muslims and christians didn't accept him.

According to my belief the return of christ means the end of this world as he'll take all believers and the earth will be left for a while for disbelievers.

So in case that Jesus pbuh will be back in our recent times then the Bahais will refuse him while muslims and christians will accept him.

Please note that there are minor signs which should be revealed before the times of Mahdi and Jesus pbuh and just before few years one of the minor signs have been fulfilled and that was the sanctions against Iraq and next will be Syria which is just happening now.

Please watch the video which shows the timeline according to Mohamed pbuh prophecy for the end of times.

[youtube]x_obnjFWY2U[/youtube]
Islamic Signs of the Hour and The End Times - YouTube
 
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