Tennessee sees new step in wave of anti-Trans bills

[Fallen Prophet]

No, you are the one who said when a man enters he's automatically invading.

And you took what I said out of context and applied the most ridiculous spin to it.

Janitors do not clean the restrooms while people are in it.

You are advocating that biological man should be able to enter and use a women's restroom while women are using it.

A worlds difference.

The question is "what in the bluest of blue hells is a trans bathroom?" I've never seen these, I've never heard of them, I see no point with other viable alternatives.

You've never heard of that idea? People proposed that idea years ago. It was rejected because it was ridiculous.

Almost as ridiculous as allowing a biological man to use the women's restroom.

This step may involve you to stop thinking of this in binary terms.

Biological sex is a binary. There are only two.

Here's a hint:
Parents of adult children they must provide extensive care for love them.

They have family restrooms for that purpose.

Also - a mother can attend to a daughter and a father a son if no family restroom is available.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

You are advocating that biological man should be able to enter and use a women's restroom while women are using it.

No, I advocate letting people presenting as their identified sex using the bathroom they are presenting as and everyone just minding their own business.

You've never heard of that idea? People proposed that idea years ago. It was rejected because it was ridiculous

Just from Family Guy.

Biological sex is a binary. There are only two.

Ever hear of intersex people?
Doesn't sound like you have.

They have family restrooms for that purpose.

That is one of those other viable options. As are unisex restrooms.

Also - a mother can attend to a daughter and a father a son if no family restroom is available.

A mother can also tend to her son and a father can tend to his daughter.

 

[Fallen Prophet]

No, I advocate letting people presenting as their identified sex using the bathroom they are presenting as and everyone just minding their own business.

No - that has too much potential for abuse. How a person identifies should have no bearing on what restrooms they are using.

Just from Family Guy.

That's funny - and I doubt you'd be able to find anything about them nowadays.

Ever hear of intersex people?
Doesn't sound like you have.

Yes - how they are not a third sex and have nothing to do with the transgender issue.

That is one of those other viable options. As are unisex restrooms.

Perfect. No need for biological men using the women's restroom.

A mother can also tend to her son and a father can tend to his daughter.

Yes - in the family or unisex restroom.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oh noes!! Not the fear of bathroom rapists again! Funny, @Fallen Prophet does not list his or her gender.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

No - that has too much potential for abuse.

Except that hasn't been happening.
Those male janitors, however, have been more invasive even when no one is in the restroom, changing room, or whatever.

Yes - in the family or unisex restroom.

If anyone has an issue with a parent doing parenting of an opposite sex child can really just bugger off and mind their own business.

 

[Fallen Prophet]

Except that hasn't been happening.

Yes - it has.

5 Times ‘Transgender’ Men Abused Women And Children In Bathrooms | The Daily Wire

Being a transgender (or rather claiming to be one) does not make them immune to being creeps.

Those male janitors, however, have been more invasive even when no one is in the restroom, changing room, or whatever.

This is so ridiculous. I'm not even going to respond.

If anyone has an issue with a parent doing parenting of an opposite sex child can really just bugger off and mind their own business.

You said adult children. There is a difference.

Are you from the U.K. or something? All this "arse" and "bugger" stuff.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Are you from the U.K. or something? All this "arse" and "bugger" stuff.

To that, and the rest of your post, I'll say your all sixes and sevens. A bloke wearing men's trunks is what you have? That's not even what I'm advocating and a lot of places, even ones with trans-friendly policies, don't allow it.

 

[Fallen Prophet]

To that, and the rest of your post, I'll say your all sixes and sevens. A bloke wearing men's trunks is what you have? That's not even what I'm advocating and a lot of places, even ones with trans-friendly policies, don't allow it.

But they used the law to gain access. These types of laws are ripe for abuse. Like I said.

I don't think you're from the U.K. - it sounds forced and made up.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I don't think you're from the U.K. - it sounds forced and made up.

You've certainly made a great many wrong assumptions about me before this.
Do you want to change your answer?

 

[ecco]

People should know when they enter a restroom if they may see a member of the opposite sex in there.
Biological men who believe they are women are entering into women's restrooms and vice versa.

If a restaurant has two bathrooms - Men's and Women's, where do you believe Republican Caitlyn Jenner should go to pee?

Just your opinion.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

But they used the law to gain access. These types of laws are ripe for abuse. Like I said.

Except there is not a single shred of evidence that introducing these laws has any impact whatsoever on incidences of sexual assault or molestation in bathrooms. None whatsoever.

In addition, how do you enforce the opposite? If you bar trans women from women's bathrooms and vice versa, I - as a cis-gendered man - could still enter a woman's bathroom and, if challenged, claim I was a trans man and therefore by law must use a woman's bathroom. There is also the fact that genuine trans men would be forced to use women's bathrooms, which has obvious problems.

So, what solution prevents trans women (who demonstrate no increased threat to other women in bathrooms) and myself (claiming I am a trans man) from going in to a woman's bathroom with the intent of abusing women? If you are to be ideologically consistent, you would have to admit that there is no solution aside from requiring mandatory genitalia checks for everyone entering a gendered bathroom.

Or, you could just stop exaggerating (if not outright inventing) a problem in order to stigmatise and deny the rights of a minority group.

 

[Fallen Prophet]

You've certainly made a great many wrong assumptions about me before this.

I don't think so.

Do you want to change your answer?

I don't think so.

 

[Fallen Prophet]

Except there is not a single shred of evidence that introducing these laws has any impact whatsoever on incidences of sexual assault or molestation in bathrooms. None whatsoever.

In addition, how do you enforce the opposite? If you bar trans women from women's bathrooms and vice versa, I - as a cis-gendered man - could still enter a woman's bathroom and, if challenged, claim I was a trans man and therefore by law must use a woman's bathroom. There is also the fact that genuine trans men would be forced to use women's bathrooms, which has obvious problems.

So, what solution prevents trans women (who demonstrate no increased threat to other women in bathrooms) and myself (claiming I am a trans man) from going in to a woman's bathroom with the intent of abusing women? If you are to be ideologically consistent, you would have to admit that there is no solution aside from requiring mandatory genitalia checks for everyone entering a gendered bathroom.

Or, you could just stop exaggerating (if not outright inventing) a problem in order to stigmatise and deny the rights of a minority group.

How someone identifies - which is a purely subjective view of oneself - a personal belief - should not set public policy.

Men's restrooms were designed and intended for biological men.

Women's restrooms were designed and intended for biological women.

Even if every transperson was a saint - they have no right to enter the restroom designed and intended for members of the opposite sex.

How they identify is irrelevant.

That is the only method to deal with this issue consistently, logically and fairly.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

How someone identifies - which is a purely subjective view of oneself - a personal belief - should not set public policy.

Science has shown in many ways thay identified isn't entirely subjective and is something we can see to various extents in the brain. Even something like trauma we can see on a brain. The same goes for sex and gender identity.

 

[Fallen Prophet]

Science has shown in many ways thay identified isn't entirely subjective and is something we can see to various extents in the brain. Even something like trauma we can see on a brain. The same goes for sex and gender identity.

Even if that were true - it would be irrelevant.

We don't base our public policy on traumas to our brains.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Even if that were true - it would be irrelevant.

We don't base our public policy on traumas to our brains.

It is true. We can even see it in serial killers.

 

[Subduction Zone]

If a restaurant has two bathrooms - Men's and Women's, where do you believe Republican Caitlyn Jenner should go to pee?

Just your opinion.

Hmm, no answer to a reasonable question. Did you beat him really badly in a debate? He appears to put people on ignore when they do that.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

How someone identifies - which is a purely subjective view of oneself - a personal belief - should not set public policy.

Subjective personal beliefs are the basis for lots of public policies, such as religion and cultural identity, and gender has always been subjective.

Men's restrooms were designed and intended for biological men.

I have no idea what toilets you use, but the ones I tend to see in men's restrooms are just the same as any other.

Women's restrooms were designed and intended for biological women.

See above.

This is just a very silly argument. There's basically no difference in the facilities beside the occasional inclusion of urinals. They serve the same function with the same basic plumbing. The reason the rooms are separate is for matters of personal privacy, not because of "design". Don't be absurd.

Even if every transperson was a saint - they have no right to enter the restroom designed and intended for members of the opposite sex.

Yes they do. You have absolutely no moral or legal basis to say that anybody doesn't have that right.

How they identify is irrelevant.

No it isn't. Gender has always been a matter of personal identity, and people have always been granted access based on identification to gendered spaces. Again, no procedure of genital examinations has ever been the standard required to access men's or women's bathrooms.

That is the only method to deal with this issue consistently, logically and fairly.

So, do you propose genital examinations for anyone entering a gendered bathroom? Because that is literally the only way to enforce that.

Also, how is it fair to force a minority of women to use men's restrooms, and vice versa, against their will?

 

[ecco]

Hmm, no answer to a reasonable question. Did you beat him really badly in a debate? He appears to put people on ignore when they do that.

I'll pose it again. If he doesn't respond, perhaps you could "forward it".

 

[ecco]

Men's restrooms were designed and intended for biological men.

Women's restrooms were designed and intended for biological women.


How they identify is irrelevant.

You seem to have ignored my question to you...


If a restaurant has two bathrooms - Men's and Women's, where do you believe Republican Caitlyn Jenner should go to pee?

Just your opinion.