The Big Bang Theory is dead.

[Polymath257]

Ok birds still remain birds, they ain't changing to unbirds. Oh I forget. Alligators are probably birds too. Humans are, maybe they're not. Ok enough fun and games with gorillas and birds not writing down their history. Birds are probably farther away genetically. You're right, I've had it with these things. So thanks and hopefully no more from me to you. Because I like and respect you...although I may still mention that gorillas don't write their history down and birds still remain birds no matter any changes within them.

Humans didn't write their history down until around 5000 years ago. For the vast majority of time our species has existed, we had no writing.

It wasn't until we started living in larger groups (small cities) that writing became necessary to keep records. Other great apes don't live in large enough groups that do agriculture so writing isn't needed by them.

 

[Polymath257]

In the last days in our time.

Exact timing of the prophecies from the Bible explained.

The Bible predicts many things that must happen in the last days. All these are predicted to happen from about 2000 to 3500 years ago. Not only were they predicted to happen in some indeterminate future but in a in our time.

Well, you need to prove it was refering to our time and not the 'same hour' as in the texts themselves. In other words, not now, but 2000 years ago. And the pphesies did NOT come true.

Now to understand this exact timing, you must understand how they all line up and build up. The easiest way is by an analogy. There is a path. A person decides to walk along that path. This is analogous to the first prophecy coming true. For example, knowledge is increased in the last days. Knowledge has taken off and in increasing rapidly. That may have come true about 100 years ago. But it is still increasing rapidly, so it is still true. Is it exact timing? Yes, to the exact 100 years but even until this very day.

No, it is NOT exact timing. Knowledge has been increasing rapidly over the last 400 years at least. There was also a huge increase of knowledge during the translation era of the 11th and 12th centuries.

So, no, it isn't even close to being exact and specific.

This is the equivalent to the first person continuing his walk along the path. As another prophecy comes true, that is the equivalent to a second person joining the first person walking along the path. As each prophecy comes true, another person joins in this walk along the path until there are many walking along together.

Um no, not analogous at all. Also NOT specific and detailed.

First to establish the timing consider the following.

God created man by a direct act and not through evolution from lower life forms. This is clear from the following passages.

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. - Gen 1:26-27

7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.21 And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;22 And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. – Gen 2:7,21-23

The age of the earth is easily determined from the Bible, which is the true word of God. In Genesis 1, it is clear that God created all things, including the earth, the universe, the sun, the moon, the stars, all life and of course Adam and Eve on the 6th day. To determine the age of the earth, extensive genealogies are given along with the age at which each father begat the named sun. Historical kings are mentioned in the book of Daniel and elsewhere in the Old Testament. The command to rebuild the temple and the 70-week prophecy in Daniel gives 70x7=490 yrs. The Biblical precept of a day is a year is found in Numbers where the Israelites were punished to wander 40 years in the desert, a year for each day since they spied out the land of the Canaanites and did not believe what God could do.

Usher and Isaac Newton followed the same logic, and both determined the earth to have been created about 6000 years ago. There are others who have done the same thing. All the logic, all the real science and all the facts also confirm that the earth and everything in it is about 6000 years old.

And for that reason, the Bible is WRONG. There is plenty of evidence the world is far older than a mere 10,000 years.

Light is created early on the first day and separated from darkness. Thus, there is directional light from the very beginning. This is even before the sun is created on the 4th day. Directional light plus a rotating earth gives night and day. Thus, the days below are very close to 24 hrs. That is shown by the 6x “the evening and the morning” are used. The ordinal count of days also proves that these are 24-hour days.

5 … And the evening and the morning were the first day. 8 … the second day. 13 the third day. 19 the fourth day. 23 the fifth day. 31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day. Gen 1:5,8,13,19,23,31

God created all things in 6 days. He did it, knows how it was done and knows when it was done. So, God’s eyewitness testimony is 100% true. All supposed “science”, which disagrees, is therefore false. God spoke with His mouth 2x and wrote with His finger 2x the following. By the way Christ may have written the 10 commandants with His finger in the sand. He certainly used that to teach as it says “all taught of God” in John 6:45.

1 And God spake all these words, saying, 11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. - Exo 20:1,11

17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed. 18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God. - Exo 31:17-18

And the tables were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God, graven upon the tables. - Exo 32:16

And the Lord said unto Moses, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first: and I will write upon these tables the words that were in the first tables, which thou brakest. - Exo 34:1

The Lord Jesus Christ, who created all things in 6 days about 6000 years ago, was there, did it and knows when it happened. The following 4 passages shows that Jesus Christ believed in 6-day recent creation. Many times throughout the Bible, creation, the fall, Cain and Abel, and the flood are spoken as real events.

4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, 5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? - Matt 19:4-5

6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. 7 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; 8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. 9 What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. - Mark 10:6-9

As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began: - Luke 1:70

50 That the blood of all the prophets, which was shed from the foundation of the world, may be required of this generation; 51 From the blood of Abel unto the blood of Zacharias which perished between the altar and the temple: verily I say unto you, It shall be required of this generation. - Luke11:50-51

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: - Rom 1:20

Almost all the sedimentary layers with their fossils are the result of the worldwide flood during the time of Noah, which occurred about 4500 years ago. A real scientific study of those layers proves it. There are many other scientific proofs of recent creation.

Nope, they are not. But what relevance does any of this have to the topic under discussion? What *specific* and *detailed* prophecies were being made and verified?

One last point is needed. The Bible gives a timeline for the time between creation and the creation of a new heaven and a new earth. It is 7000 years. The 1000 years reign of Christ is yet to come. It comes after the pre-trib rapture and the almost 7-year tribulation. The 6-day creation, which is 6 consecutive 24-hour days is also actually a prophecy and gives the timeline. Peter wrote:

But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. – 2 Peter 3:8

5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: - 2 Peter 3:5-6

Now the word of God says:

Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets. – Amos 3:7

So, God reveals things to His prophets who wrote it done. All the Bible is written as prophecy (see 2 Peter 1:22).

So, God cannot rapture His church and bring tribulation unless He revealed it to His prophets who wrote it done. In fact, all the Bible is lit up with fulfilled prophecy of things that must be just before the rapture. The amazing thing is not even that all these things were prophesied to happen but to happen at exactly our time. You see any can say man will have increased knowledge in some indeterminate future time. But the exact timing is given by scripture written about 2000 to 3500 years ago. The exact timing is given by the 6000-year age of the earth and the timeline given by the Bible. This is just another great proof that the Bible is the very true word of God Almighty. God Himself gave that as a proof.

22 Let them bring them forth, and shew us what shall happen ... and know the latter end of them; or declare us things for to come.23 Shew the things that are to come hereafter, that we may know that ye are gods: yea, do good, or do evil, that we may be dismayed, and behold it together. – Isa 41:22-23

So now, in our very time, all these things should be coming to pass. As Christ said:

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh 33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.– Matt 24:32-33

In other words, you aren't going to address the issue of specific and detailed predictions? Saying something would happen sometime in the last 2000 years is NOT exact timing by any means.

So, your claims have been shown to be wrong.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It is a undeniable fact.

No quite a few people deny it. Most of us can show it to be nonsense.

 

[Subduction Zone]

When you can refute my irrefutable proofs, please try.

Everybody has done that.

You have even admitted that you were wrong.

 

[YoursTrue]

Humans didn't write their history down until around 5000 years ago. For the vast majority of time our species has existed, we had no writing.

It wasn't until we started living in larger groups (small cities) that writing became necessary to keep records. Other great apes don't live in large enough groups that do agriculture so writing isn't needed by them.

Yeah well I'm still saying that gorillas and chimps were here longer yet they haven't built libraries, etc and more. Sompin' changed, hmm, so it seems.

 

[YoursTrue]

Nope. ESV. From the preface:

"Words and phrases themselves grow out of the Tyndale-King James legacy...in that stream, faithfulness to the text and vigorous pursuit of precision were combined with simplicity, beauty and dignity of expression. Our goal has been to carry forward this legacy for this generation and generations to come.

To this end, each word and phrase in the ESV has been carefully weighed against the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek, to ensure the fullest accuracy and clarity and to avoid under-translating or overlooking any nuance of the original text."

I would prefer a translation done without political motivation using texts as close to the originals as possible, especially when they were not available to those who did the KJV translation.

I checked a Greek interlinear and the wording is interesting. Open to translators' decisions. No doubt about it. Meantime the earth had lots and lots and lots of water at the beginning and guess what? It still does.

 

[YoursTrue]

Yes, I believe in one God, the creator of the universe. And I believe he cares very much how we treat each other.

Next: do you believe He will do something about those who consistently show they don't care about others? I do. I believe He can sort out what He wants when He wants. I hope so. I look forward to life without all the bills, paperwork, thievery by individuals and corporations, ruination of the earth's resources. Yes, just like God did it...yup Goddidit in the past, I believe He knows how to do it in the future for the benefit of those who love and obey Him. Yup.i believe that.

 

[McBell]

Yeah well I'm still saying that gorillas and chimps were here longer yet they haven't built libraries, etc and more. Sompin' changed, hmm, so it seems.

Some might argue that that makes them smarter...

 

[Subduction Zone]

I checked a Greek interlinear and the wording is interesting. Open to translators' decisions. No doubt about it. Meantime the earth had lots and lots and lots of water at the beginning and guess what? It still does.

Only on the surface. But the scriptures indicate that the writers probably believed in a Flat Earth. That would explain why their stories are so wrong at times.

 

[McBell]

Only on the surface. But the scriptures indicate that the writers probably believed in a Flat Earth. That would explain why their stories are so wrong at times.

Well there you have it.
All that extra flood water just ran off the edge of the Earth...
Probably gave them turtles a much needed drink

 

[YoursTrue]

Nope. ESV. From the preface:

"Words and phrases themselves grow out of the Tyndale-King James legacy...in that stream, faithfulness to the text and vigorous pursuit of precision were combined with simplicity, beauty and dignity of expression. Our goal has been to carry forward this legacy for this generation and generations to come.

To this end, each word and phrase in the ESV has been carefully weighed against the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek, to ensure the fullest accuracy and clarity and to avoid under-translating or overlooking any nuance of the original text."

I would prefer a translation done without political motivation using texts as close to the originals as possible, especially when they were not available to those who did the KJV translation.

American Standard Version makes sense to me insofar as out of water, etc. what's the big deal anyway,? Some people make big deals about everything.

• 5For this they willfully forget, that there were heavens from of old, and an earth compacted out of water and amidst water, by the word of God;

Wow. Compacted out of water amidst water....wow is all I can say now. Sounds like earth was, uh, compacted out of water... earth and water kind of was there...together when the process of preparing the earth for habitation started. See, in the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. Earth compacted out of water, a very nice compact and understandable statement.

 

[YoursTrue]

Some might argue that that makes them smarter...

Could be some might say that, after all, maybe there are humans evolved on other areas way out there...but haven't developed the ability to fly through space. Gorillas can do pretty good athletics though. Or maybe gorilla souls transferred up or down the line accordingly to some. Mathematical possibilities, hmm?
Oh yes maybe gorillas evolved somewhere else also.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Next: do you believe He will do something about those who consistently show they don't care about others?

Do you mean in this life or the next?

As far as this life goes, I think anyone who is honest knows that life is not fair. Criminals become billionaires while good people sleep on the streets.

7Why do the wicked live on, grow strong and powerfully rich?		זמַדּ֣וּעַ רְשָׁעִ֣ים יִֽחְי֑וּ עָ֜תְק֗וּ גַּם־גָּ֥בְרוּ חָֽיִל:
8Their children are well established in their sight with them, and their children's children are before their eyes.		חזַרְעָ֚ם נָכ֣וֹן לִפְנֵיהֶ֣ם עִמָּ֑ם וְ֜צֶֽאֱצָֽאֵיהֶ֗ם לְעֵֽינֵיהֶֽם:
9Their houses have peace from fear, and God's rod is not upon them.		טבָּֽתֵּיהֶ֣ם שָׁל֣וֹם מִפָּ֑חַד וְלֹ֣א שֵׁ֖בֶט אֱל֣וֹהַּ עֲלֵיהֶֽם:

However, despite this, I think that being a good person is intrinsically rewarding. I think those who live ethically feel better about themselves, their lives, and other people. There is a meaningfulness to it that is deeply, deeply satisfying. Those who live unethically cheat themselves out of that.

 

[YoursTrue]

Do you mean in this life or the next?

As far as this life goes, I think anyone who is honest knows that life is not fair. Criminals become billionaires while good people sleep on the streets.

7Why do the wicked live on, grow strong and powerfully rich?		זמַדּ֣וּעַ רְשָׁעִ֣ים יִֽחְי֑וּ עָ֜תְק֗וּ גַּם־גָּ֥בְרוּ חָֽיִל:
8Their children are well established in their sight with them, and their children's children are before their eyes.		חזַרְעָ֚ם נָכ֣וֹן לִפְנֵיהֶ֣ם עִמָּ֑ם וְ֜צֶֽאֱצָֽאֵיהֶ֗ם לְעֵֽינֵיהֶֽם:
9Their houses have peace from fear, and God's rod is not upon them.		טבָּֽתֵּיהֶ֣ם שָׁל֣וֹם מִפָּ֑חַד וְלֹ֣א שֵׁ֖בֶט אֱל֣וֹהַּ עֲלֵיהֶֽם:

However, despite this, I think that being a good person is intrinsically rewarding. I think those who live ethically feel better about themselves, their lives, and other people. There is a meaningfulness to it that is deeply, deeply satisfying. Those who live unethically cheat themselves out of that.

It is said that It is harder for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God. Matthew 29. he watched him go, Jesus told his disciples, “Do you have any idea how difficult it is for the rich to enter God’s kingdom? Let me tell you, it’s easier to gallop a camel through a needle’s eye than for the rich to enter God’s kingdom.”
So that is very interesting to contemplate. Not saying every rich person cannot enter the kingdom but it's not easy. Now the question is--what is the kingdom of God or God's kingdom? Ever think about it?

 

[YoursTrue]

Humans didn't write their history down until around 5000 years ago. For the vast majority of time our species has existed, we had no writing.

It wasn't until we started living in larger groups (small cities) that writing became necessary to keep records. Other great apes don't live in large enough groups that do agriculture so writing isn't needed by them.

Lol you're sure that's why? so let me put it to your thinking this way... you're saying gorillas and chimps have the mental capacity to keep records and develop writing but don't want to because they have no need to keep records, ris that right?

 

[Polymath257]

I checked a Greek interlinear and the wording is interesting. Open to translators' decisions. No doubt about it. Meantime the earth had lots and lots and lots of water at the beginning and guess what? It still does.

Actually, the amount of water compared to other things is quite small.

 

[Subduction Zone]

American Standard Version makes sense to me insofar as out of water, etc. what's the big deal anyway,? Some people make big deals about everything.

• 5For this they willfully forget, that there were heavens from of old, and an earth compacted out of water and amidst water, by the word of God;

Wow. Compacted out of water amidst water....wow is all I can say now. Sounds like earth was, uh, compacted out of water... earth and water kind of was there...together when the process of preparing the earth for habitation started. See, in the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. Earth compacted out of water, a very nice compact and understandable statement.

No, the Earth was not "compacted out of water". You could try it yourself You can get a solid if you squeeze water hard enough. But guess what happens when you take the pressure away?

Phases of ice - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Polymath257]

Lol you're sure that's why? so let me put it to your thinking this way... you're saying gorillas and chimps have the mental capacity to keep records and develop writing but don't want to because they have no need to keep records, ris that right?

Not quite. The other primates haven’t gone through the stages of developing language ( which humans have probably had for over 100000 years.) they have also not gone through the stages of using tools (which the human lineage did before there were modern humans).

So, no, my position is that the other apes are basically where we were about 5 million years ago. But they stayed in the jungle and we went into the savannas. We developed tools and language. They didn’t.

But 5 million years is a very short period of time. If the jungles get smaller and the other primates needed to start using tools ( and don’t go extinct), then I see no reason why they would not be able to develop tools and language over the next few million years.

 

[SavedByTheLord]

Not quite. The other primates haven’t gone through the stages of developing language ( which humans have probably had for over 100000 years.) they have also not gone through the stages of using tools (which the human lineage did before there were modern humans).

So, no, my position is that the other apes are basically where we were about 5 million years ago. But they stayed in the jungle and we went into the savannas. We developed tools and language. They didn’t.

But 5 million years is a very short period of time. If the jungles get smaller and the other primates needed to start using tools ( and don’t go extinct), then I see no reason why they would not be able to develop tools and language over the next few million years.

But your theory makes no sense as there are no writings older than 6000 years .
Nor any civilization at all.
Nor any calendars.
So how was there such a leap of intelligence about 6000 years ago?

 

[Polymath257]

American Standard Version makes sense to me insofar as out of water, etc. what's the big deal anyway,? Some people make big deals about everything.

• 5For this they willfully forget, that there were heavens from of old, and an earth compacted out of water and amidst water, by the word of God;

Wow. Compacted out of water amidst water....wow is all I can say now. Sounds like earth was, uh, compacted out of water... earth and water kind of was there...together when the process of preparing the earth for habitation started. See, in the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. Earth compacted out of water, a very nice compact and understandable statement.

Yes. nice, compact, understandable, and completely wrong.