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The Challenge in the Qur'an

nawab

nawab

Active Member
My Friend the challenge stated is that if all the humans and Jinn come together then just simply understand it that way that the challenge is in arabic and non-arabic, it should be that way. because for Gods knowledge, Arabic and any other language, God knows them equally well

so you do it in the language you know, because you and me we are weak how many languages can we know as comparred to God


YmirGF said:
I do find it amusing that some say we need to use Ancient Arabic and Fatihah claims we do not. I wonder if these folks can actually get their own "challenge" straight.
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nawab

nawab

Active Member
the arabic the banu hasim (the tribe of Muhammad PBUH) spoke which was the dialect of the Prophet Ishmael,
 
Ghostaka

Ghostaka

Active Member
YmirGF said:
I do find it amusing that some say we need to use Ancient Arabic and Fatihah claims we do not. I wonder if these folks can actually get their own "challenge" straight.
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What's the point of a debate? People learn new things everyday... :rolleyes:

Peace be upon you.
 
YmirGF

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
Ghostaka said:
What's the point of a debate? People learn new things everyday... :rolleyes:

Peace be upon you.
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But you folks have had these ideas for 1400 years. One would expect that the criteria would be fairly specific by now.

Next question.

Who judges if a challenge meets all the requirements?
 
Riverwolf

Riverwolf

Amateur Rambler / Proud Ergi
Premium Member
nawab said:
yes actually you are right here, it does

like the miracles of Moses, convinced the magicians, being in a land of magic
like the miracles of Jesus, being in a land of the learned scribes being in a learned time
and the language/expressions had to convince the dumb Bedouin Pagan tribes
God Almighty knew that when Islam will enter into other lands a different translation will be available accordingly due to time, so if you think you cant learn arabic then do it in the language you master, use all the computer technology with all things i include you will not be able to produce it, just by watching the second video which can clearly explain the miracle of mathematical numbering of words in the Quran was impossible for an Arab, some Arabs or all of them to produce
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I say again that these are fine criteria, but under whose authority are they the specific criteria?

After all, the challenge is to produce a single Surah, not reproduce the entire Qur'an.

And how do we know the Arab pagans were dumb? They may have been very smart and very wise. We can't know.
 
kai

kai

ragamuffin
Riverwolf said:
I say again that these are fine criteria, but under whose authority are they the specific criteria?

After all, the challenge is to produce a single Surah, not reproduce the entire Qur'an.

And how do we know the Arab pagans were dumb? They may have been very smart and very wise. We can't know.
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they were smart enough to produce the Qasida and the seven golden odes.

The Mu'allaqāt (Arabic معلقات, /al-muʕallaqaːt/) is the title of a group of seven long Arabic poems or qasida (singular qaṣīda, plural qaṣā'id) that have come down from the time before Islam. Each is considered the best work of these pre-Islamic poets. The name means The Suspended Odes or The Hanging Poems, the traditional explanation being that these poems were hung on or in the Ka'ba at Mecca.


Mu'allaqat - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



The classic form of qasida maintains a single elaborate meter throughout the poem, and every line rhymes. These poems are considered some of the most elaborate in the world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qasida



not bad for dumb pagans
 
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rojse

rojse

RF Addict
If we were going to presume that the Quran was a revealed book, and that all other religious books, as a consequence, must not be (in the context of this challenge) wouldn't the Book Of Mormon answer this challenge (except in regards to it's written language), having been penned by a single man?
 
kai

kai

ragamuffin
TashaN said:
Do they mean the one we still speak but they think we don't because ... umm! i forgot what i wanted to say!!! :faint:
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nawab said:
the arabic the banu hasim (the tribe of Muhammad PBUH) spoke which was the dialect of the Prophet Ishmael,
Click to expand...


Hi TashaN
Is the Arabic you speak now the same as at the time of the prophet? is it written the same?
 
kai

kai

ragamuffin
TashaN said:
Yes. :yes:
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wow that's amazing are you telling me that you could have a conversation with someone from the 7th century and that you right the same charactors in your day to day life as they would.

wow again! 7th century English would be unintelligable to us.

hold on a minute me thinks thou doust pull a fast one here, do you mean classical Arabic that is used in Islam? and whats nawab on about then?


Arabic language - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Breathe

Breathe

Hostis humani generis
kai said:
hold on a minute me thinks thou doust pull a fast one here,
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:D What 7th century English is that? I think you're 1,000 years late/early with that one Kai. :p

Hwær is se feltun bidde? - What's the bathroom, please? = In 7th Century English. :D One of the only phrases I know in old English.. don't ask how I know it. :D
 
kai

kai

ragamuffin
Odion said:
:D What 7th century English is that? I think you're 1,000 years late/early with that one Kai. :p


what? thats how weuns speake here in zumerzet

Hwær is se feltun bidde? - What's the bathroom, please? = In 7th Century English. :D One of the only phrases I know in old English.. don't ask how I know it. :D
Click to expand...

Bathroom thats posh!:yes:
 
riverfox

riverfox

A slave of Allah (swt)
First,Understand that showing more than a translation to distort Qur'an is meaningless.
The Holy Qur'an is book that exist in it's original only one text.
2:23
و إن كنتم في ريب مما نزلنا على عبدنا فأتوا بسورة من مثله وادعوا شهداءكم من دون الله إن كنتم صادقين
4:82
أفلا يتدبرون القرآن و لو كان من عند غير الله لوجدوا فيه إختلافاً كثيراً
17:88
قل لئن اجتمعت الإنس والجن على أن يأتوا بمثل هذا القرآن لا يأتون بمثله ولو كان بعضهم لبعض ظهيراً
So many Arabs converted to Islam after reading the Qur'an and realizing that people and
poets couldn't write such a book,and that Qur'an is not poetry.I believe that the translation can't show exactly the same rhetorical and literary miracle of the Qur'an.but whether you speak Arabic (The Arabic dialect of the Qur'an became the standerd Arabic since it was revealed)or any language you will not be able to produce such a book.
Rhetorical and literary side of the Qur'an may not mean too much to many,but this is only a part of the Qur'anic challenge.Qur'an is giving you a challenge
2:23
And if ye are in doubt as to what We have revealed from time to time to Our servant, then produce a Surah like thereunto; and call your witnesses or helpers (if there are any) besides Allah, if your (doubts) are true.
4:82
82. Do they not consider the Qur'án (with care)? Had it been from other than Allah, they would surely have found therein much discrepancy.
17:88
Say: "If the whole of mankind and Jinns were to gather together to produce the like of this Qur'án, they could not produce the like thereof, even if they backed up each other with help and support
18:1
Praise be to Allah, Who hath sent to His Servant the Book, and hath allowed therein no Crookedness:
41:41-42
Those who reject the Message when it comes to them (are not hidden from Us). And indeed it is a Book of exalted power.
If you think people can write it, show us a single Book (in any language) Like the Qur'an,a book written 1400 years ago that explains scientific facts Quran Miracles - Miracles of the Qur'an , has no erros http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/quranic-debates/79891-quran-free-errors.html (post #6-)
2.24
But if ye cannot, and of a surety ye cannot, then fear the fire whose fuel is Men and Stones, which is prepared for those who reject Faith.​
 
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