The "F word" for those who hate the word "feminist"

[Revoltingest]

The Men's issues in green is utterly daft.
It's tough being a bloke.

Of course, the Men's Issues forum allows anyone interested in such advocacy.
Its problem is that the rules for <green> forums haven't been applicable, ie,
hostile posts are tolerated as though it were an "uncolored" forum.
So the forum is redundant.

 

[Revoltingest]

FGM is one of the biggest concerns of feminists I'm aware of, at least the ones here. I think you're painting feminism with a broad brush based on what a small minority of feminists believe.

I'd add that FGM & MGM (new initialism) are both well covered here.
And in the general media, FGM is widely decried by feminists & nons.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

Of course, the Men's Issues forum allows anyone interested in such advocacy.
Its problem is that the rules for <green> forums haven't been applicable, ie,
hostile posts are tolerated as though it were an "uncolored" forum.
So the forum is redundant.

So is the Men's Issues thread only for those who are sympathetic to the Men's Right Movement or the issue of Men's Rights? Can women talk about Men's Issues? What about those men who are hostile towards the MRA's, are they welcomed and if they posted criticism of the MRM would that be alright?

 

[oldbadger]

I think this thread is a great example of why there needs to be a Feminism DIR

Correct......
Feminism being in an exclusive section for a selected group......
in contrast to the total impossibility of having an exclusive forum for the socially balanced Egalitarian movement (nobody could ever be excluded) ....
This serves to remind us all how incomplete the Feminist movement is ....
Just compare.........

 

[Revoltingest]

I think the two highlighted parts contradict each other.

Oh, I disagree...the 2 parts are quite compatible.
For something to be not rare is not the same thing as being a majority.

Even if most feminists on RF were extremists like the ones you described above, that wouldn't necessarily be representative of the feminist movement in general. Most Christians I know hold different views than most Christians on RF, for example, so I wouldn't say that what I have seen here and what I have seen online mirror or represent each other.

I don't say most are problematic. But a few vocal ones do have a large public presence.

There are many feminists here who accept criticism and don't call everyone who disagrees with them "misogynistic" or anything of the sort. I'm not sure why someone would pick out the more negative comments and hold them up as examples of the feminist movement's stance in general instead of the more tolerant ones.

Aye, there are some fine feminists here. But feminist culture is a diverse thing which is defined by all, & not just the exemplary ones, or the fringe which reflects my beliefs.

 

[dawny0826]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJPT_U97lNs

Laci Green is one of my favorite youtubers and puts it really well. All the time feminists such as myself hear people hating on the movement or on the word itself because of the negative connotations that have been attached to it by it's opponents or the idea that feminism is "wrong" simply because it focuses on the issue of gender specifically. Hopefully this will help shine some light on the issue and show that feminism is not a dirty word at all.

please note, this has nothing to do with people who hate labels or the idea of labels in general. This is simply a rebuttal in response to those who hate or misunderstand this particular label.

Feminism runs the gamut of perceptions, understandings and experiences.

I consider myself a feminist but can't always relate to other feminists and some of their ideals. I've encountered feminists that I could high-five and learn a great deal from and those that really do embody the negative stereotypes.

Education through patient, non-confrontational channels with a desire to understand the perspectives of others if the way to go, in my opinion.

 

[oldbadger]

You absolutely have to be joking. I mean seriously?

Yeah..... seriously.......
Now I have mentioned FGM three times on this thread, but plx will you now dig up a FEMINIST thread in purple that has addressed this issue in any depth. ??

Seriously!
Then we can list a few other deadly serious issues that are (or have been) either ignored, overlooked or distanced.....

 

[Revoltingest]

So is the Men's Issues thread only for those who are sympathetic to the Men's Right Movement or the issue of Men's Rights?

I'd say it's a little broader than that, ie, sympathy or positive advocacy
for any issue affecting men. This would include any gender.

Can women talk about Men's Issues?

Absolutely. Mystic, for example, has often expressed advocacy for problems men & boys have.

What about those men who are hostile towards the MRA's, are they welcomed and if they posted criticism of the MRM would that be alright?

Criticism would be fine for anyone to post, but non-members should be respectful as is required in a green forum....

-For any DIR or discussion sub-forum that is colored green, non-members of that area may make respectful posts that comply with the tenets and spirit of that area. This includes questions, as well as knowledgeable comments.

Who is a member of a Men's Issues forum? I suppose it would imply anyone
who advocates improving men's lot in life. Pretty sweeping in scope, eh?
So a good rule of thumb is if a poster is feeling hostility, then it would be appropriate
to be critical but civil....which is a great default position in any forum.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

I'd say it's a little broader than that, ie, sympathy or advocacy for any issue affecting men.
This would include any gender.

Absolutely. Mystic, for example, has often expressed advocacy for problems men & boys have.


Criticism would be fine for anyone to post, but all posters should be respectful as is required in a green forum, more so than open forums as I understand the rules.

And people have been respectful and even respectful in their criticism of some of the issues that were brought up. I just don't want to see that subforum to become a haven for those sympathetic towards the MRM to express their misogyny without being questioned and criticized for it. If that is going to be the case then maybe a Whites Only subforum should be created or a Black Separatist subforum.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

I suppose it would imply anyone
who advocates improving men's lot in life.

And that would mean it includes feminists.

 

[Revoltingest]

And that would mean it includes feminists.

A great many of them.

 

[oldbadger]

FGM is one of the biggest concerns of feminists I'm aware of, at least the ones here. I think you're painting feminism with a broad brush based on what a small minority of feminists believe.

Oh really..... you know your way about this site. Plx dig up a Purple Femmie thread that has addressed this issue in depth.

I would like to see that whole list and why you think it will make feminism "turn its face away."

That's going to be big.
I will need a sleepless night to prepare this one. You might get lucky 'cos this is the hottest night of the year so far.
But while I wait for sleeplessness, plx dig up any purple Femmie thread that addressed the issue of Female Bishops in Christianity... this would be pertinent since some Feminist sites are claiming victory for what the C of E Synod voted for this week. That is so deceitful.

I think a lot of the changes that break down bigotry are a result of feminist principles becoming more widely accepted.

No..... no.... Gender Balance is being achieved in some countries through EQUALITY being more widely accepted.

Women's suffrage, despite being a right that shouldn't even be in question, was fought for by feminists until it was widely accepted.

Yes...... But brave ladies demonstrating and chaining themselves to gates so that they could not be removed..... 90 years ago..... is not going to fuel modern day Feminism, is it..... it's fuelling modern day egalitarianism.... and those folks can be thrown off your Feminist purple section...... for shame!

I don't think there's any reason to view feminist ideals and breaking down bigotry as two different things.

.... not true! The very fact that Feminists can make themselves exclusive shows that the breaking down of bigotry is due to a much more powerful and larger influence. I don't mind feminists having an additional interest in female equality.... I just wish that they would get on with it 'hand-in-hand' with the Big Force in the world... Eggies and Humanists... instead of pushing them away and then trying to grasp laurels due to others.

 

[Revoltingest]

And people have been respectful and even respectful in their criticism of some of the issues that were brought up. I just don't want to see that subforum to become a haven for those sympathetic towards the MRM to express their misogyny without being questioned and criticized for it. If that is going to be the case then maybe a Whites Only subforum should be created or a Black Separatist subforum.

No argument here.

 

[oldbadger]

Of course, the Men's Issues forum allows anyone interested in such advocacy.
Its problem is that the rules for <green> forums haven't been applicable, ie,
hostile posts are tolerated as though it were an "uncolored" forum.
So the forum is redundant.

Absolutely!
I can't think why it ever got invented.
To stifle debate is unhealthy, and where a member is really very very personally nasty the staff can move in.

 

[oldbadger]

No argument here.

...... no argument where?
Man up, Sir! Expose yourself D) , or rather, your true messages!

I must try to go to bed, so that I can fail to sleep, so that I get up and write a long list of equality issues to present here.....

'night all....

 

[Revoltingest]

...... no argument where?
Man up, Sir! Expose yourself D) , or rather, your true messages!

I quoted the post I had no argument with.

I must try to go to bed, so that I can fail to sleep, so that I get up and write a long list of equality issues to present here.....
'night all....

Be sure to return rested & spunky!

 

[freethinker44]

What exactly is ridiculous about believing in equal rights for women?

Come on now, we both know there is so much more to it than just equal rights for women.

Continuing with the creationism comparison, a feminist saying feminism is simply wanting equal rights for women is like a creationist saying they simply believe that humans came into existence at some point in history. It's not the "what" that is ridiculous, it's the "how" and "why".

 

[CynthiaCypher]

Come on now, we both know there is so much more to it than just equal rights for women.

Continuing with the creationism comparison, a feminist saying feminism is simply wanting equal rights for women is like a creationist saying they simply believe that humans came into existence at some point in history. It's not the "what" that is ridiculous, it's the "how" and "why".

Ok, please tell us what feminism is really about.

 

[freethinker44]

Ok, please tell us what feminism is really about.

You've never heard of feminist theory? It's not just one sentence that says "women deserve equal rights". There is a whole philosophy about it. Don't pretend it's as simple as equal rights for women.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

You've never heard of feminist theory? It's not just one sentence that says "women deserve equal rights". There is a whole philosophy about it. Don't pretend it's as simple as equal rights for women.

And please tell us what is ridiculous about it?