The reason why Christianity is so popular.

[3.14]

if wars and conqeust made religion populair then why isn't shamanism more populair i mean the mongol hordes slaughtered over 40 million people (400 of these stadiums full) only outdone by the seconed world war in deathtoll

 

[Mister Emu]

if wars and conqeust made religion populair then why isn't shamanism more populair i mean the mongol hordes slaughtered over 40 million people (400 of these stadiums full) only outdone by the seconed world war in deathtoll

The Mongolian empire practiced freedom of religion...

 

[emiliano]

The Mongolian empire practiced freedom of religion...

This is an interesting point, I’ve always wonder way is it that those that promise absolute freedom do not endure, they don’t last. It seem to me that the reasons for Christianity popularity got nothing to do with tolerating just about anything, or afford freedom to the masses, Christianity is actually very restrictive so I think that the reasons for it popularity is a power beyond our understanding, that when we hear the Gospels we believe. I think that it is the power of the Gospels.

 

[darkendless]

This is an interesting point, I’ve always wonder way is it that those that promise absolute freedom do not endure, they don’t last. It seem to me that the reasons for Christianity popularity got nothing to do with tolerating just about anything, or afford freedom to the masses, Christianity is actually very restrictive so I think that the reasons for it popularity is a power beyond our understanding, that when we hear the Gospels we believe. I think that it is the power of the Gospels.

Replace gospels with sword and power with fear and you have yourself a more reasonable answer.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Replace gospels with sword and power with fear and you have yourself a more reasonable answer.

Better start running!

We'll give you a head start.

 

[Elessar]

Replace gospels with sword and power with fear and you have yourself a more reasonable answer.

Still fails to explain initial popularity of their religion. Except for a few, top-down syncretic or semi-syncretic religions, no religion has started out in a position of power to force conversions.

 

[Elessar]

The Mongolian empire practiced freedom of religion...

Actually, the Mongolians practiced "We don't care what your religion is." In fact, Mongols tended to take up the religion of those they conquered - the greater whole of them became Christian, Muslim, Buddhist or Confucian, depending on where they, personally, conquered.

 

[Mister Emu]

Actually, the Mongolians practiced "We don't care what your religion is." In fact, Mongols tended to take up the religion of those they conquered - the greater whole of them became Christian, Muslim, Buddhist or Confucian, depending on where they, personally, conquered.

Isn't that pretty much what freedom of religion is?

 

[Elessar]

Isn't that pretty much what freedom of religion is?

At first, maybe, but, generally, once they converted to the local religion, they started acting like it - Christians, suppressing Jews, Confucians adopting their place in the local structure, etc.

 

[Stellify]

Good, now we are going somewhere; “even if someone is "converted" by force and doesn't truly believe, the fact that they're willing to act like they're Christian would have it's affect on a community” I take it that this mean that the manner in which these people started to act since the day that they said that they believe appeared good to the community at large, that they changed in a positive way , that it was such that they wanted to imitated them, that it was a good thing. The community saw them as changed to their betterment, that it was good to convert. So the why of their influence is their good/moral living after conversion. These changes for the better were noticed by their children, thus their children were also influenced and that is why the Church grew as it did, surely you know that in the times that we are talking about the were lots of pagan and Saracens, acting in a pagan way, all rational being are attracted to what is good, so their families and the whole of the community were influenced by this new way of living, the good.

No....That's actually not what I was saying at all. Not that it didn't happen in some cases, of course.
I was talking more about...I guess you could call it a kind of a "herd mentality"...If a lot of people you know and trust start doing something, it makes you far more likely to do it yourself. It's one of the reasons people make such a huge deal about "peer pressure" causing kids to do drugs.
I was saying that if some people in the community did it, others would be more likely to follow simply because humans tend to go by examples they are given.
Another example would be fashion trends. Someone starts it, and before you know, the rest of the country is wearing the same kind of clothing and doing their hair the same way.

And a side note about the pagans you mentioned...
Many pagans who were forced into Christian religious practices would have hidden effigies of their own personal deities carved or painted as decorations in the church. So, they acted Christian, but still worshipped in secret.
Same thing with a lot of Santeria/voodoo practitioners in Haiti, etc.
But over time, I think it's easy for later generations to forget the original practices and simply take on the new ones as their only religion. Just my opinion, from some readings I've done in the past.

As it has been said, forced conversion were and are hinder to evangelization, it has damage the Church and has not help them in any away, the crusades of so long ago turn people away even tody, so it isn’t effective, on the contrary the human's mistakes of the past make evangelization more difficult. And this argument is absurd.

I wasn't saying it doesn't turn some people away from Christianity, but I don't think that makes the argument "absurd" (and I would appreciate it if we could avoid that kind of absolute disregard? I find it rude.). It may make some things more difficult in present day, but a long time ago I still think it was an effective way of making people practice certain belief patterns. And, I find it hard to believe the damage the Crusades caused still outweighs the evangelical efforts of today.

And there you have it stelltify, faked conversion are not the reasons for Christianity’s popularity. I told you so!

If you'll read my earlier post, I said that I know that there are exceptions. I never said that forced conversions were the one and only reason for Christianity's popularity. I believe there are many contributing factors to Christianity's success as a belief system.
But, that doesn't mean that forced conversions aren't one of the many reasons. And, considering the history of Christianity, I think it would be ignorant to completely deny the effect conversions like that had on it's spread.

 

[Luminous]

This is an interesting point, I’ve always wonder way is it that those that promise absolute freedom do not endure, they don’t last. It seem to me that the reasons for Christianity popularity got nothing to do with tolerating just about anything, or afford freedom to the masses, Christianity is actually very restrictive so I think that the reasons for it popularity is a power beyond our understanding, that when we hear the Gospels we believe. I think that it is the power of the Gospels.

: OH YEAH, It's the endless power of the gospels...(which hardly any Christian reads)

 

[ChristineES]

: OH YEAH, It's the endless power of the gospels...(which hardly any Christian reads)

Did you actually count them?

 

[darkendless]

Still fails to explain initial popularity of their religion. Except for a few, top-down syncretic or semi-syncretic religions, no religion has started out in a position of power to force conversions.

Popularity of Christianity was celebrated by a murdering rampage, killing every pagan in Rome (apart from Emperor Constantine) that did not convert. Hows that for a violent start? Even Eusebuis documents this, and he loved Constantine so maybe he saw it as a moral victory?
Before Constantine christianity was definately not popular, and many christians were killed for being christian.

 

[emiliano]

Replace gospels with sword and power with fear and you have yourself a more reasonable answer.

Surprisingly enough, you right on this one, this is one of the ways that the Bible explains this power, allegorically thinking of it as sword, and the fear of God as referential fear, something like the fear that a son feels for His father, but that would be to much for you to meditate on at this stage, keep thinking though.

 

[emiliano]

No....That's actually not what I was saying at all. Not that it didn't happen in some cases, of course.
I was talking more about...I guess you could call it a kind of a "herd mentality"...If a lot of people you know and trust start doing something, it makes you far more likely to do it yourself. It's one of the reasons people make such a huge deal about "peer pressure" causing kids to do drugs.
I was saying that if some people in the community did it, others would be more likely to follow simply because humans tend to go by examples they are given.
Another example would be fashion trends. Someone starts it, and before you know, the rest of the country is wearing the same kind of clothing and doing their hair the same way.
And a side note about the pagans you mentioned...
Many pagans who were forced into Christian religious practices would have hidden effigies of their own personal deities carved or painted as decorations in the church. So, they acted Christian, but still worshipped in secret.
Same thing with a lot of Santeria/voodoo practitioners in Haiti, etc.
But over time, I think it's easy for later generations to forget the original practices and simply take on the new ones as their only religion. Just my opinion, from some readings I've done in the past.
I wasn't saying it doesn't turn some people away from Christianity, but I don't think that makes the argument "absurd" (and I would appreciate it if we could avoid that kind of absolute disregard? I find it rude.). It may make some things more difficult in present day, but a long time ago I still think it was an effective way of making people practice certain belief patterns. And, I find it hard to believe the damage the Crusades caused still outweighs the evangelical efforts of today.
If you'll read my earlier post, I said that I know that there are exceptions. I never said that forced conversions were the one and only reason for Christianity's popularity. I believe there are many contributing factors to Christianity's success as a belief system.
But, that doesn't mean that forced conversions aren't one of the many reasons. And, considering the history of Christianity, I think it would be ignorant to completely deny the effect conversions like that had on it's spread.

Well perhaps you can suggest a better word to describe this, someone that think that people can be converted and become a preacher of some negative experiences, the heard mentality has a qualifier, the actions of the mass must be perceived as good by the individual, been force to believe something that you perceive as not been good is …..?????? The secret worshipers thing, surely you know that Christianity influences people by the preaching of the Gospels and that people hear them and converts, it has a power that we don’t fully understand, there are several theories on it, some are more logical than others, now influencing people to convert using force and attributing this to the immense popularity of Christianity, what would you call that? What is the main reason for Christianity popularity?

 

[emiliano]

Popularity of Christianity was celebrated by a murdering rampage, killing every pagan in Rome (apart from Emperor Constantine) that did not convert. Hows that for a violent start? Even Eusebuis documents this, and he loved Constantine so maybe he saw it as a moral victory?
Before Constantine christianity was definately not popular, and many christians were killed for being christian.

Another funny, good one Darklees? If they kill them all but Constantine, who did they converted? a convert is person that believes and that believe with passion, they go out to preach the Gospel to the world (the forcefully converted does none of this and do not contribute to it popularity) that is how Christianity grew to what you see today, Paganism was defeated by this "Before Constantine christianity was definately not popular, and many christians were killed for being christian?
They suffer and preach, that is the reason for Christianity's popularity.

 

[emiliano]

: OH YEAH, It's the endless power of the gospels...(which hardly any Christian reads)

Now this is silly, Billions of people read or hear the pospels that is why their membership is counted in billions.

 

[Pandachen]

Well perhaps you can suggest a better word to describe this, someone that think that people can be converted and become a preacher of some negative experiences, the heard mentality has a qualifier, the actions of the mass must be perceived as good by the individual, been force to believe something that you perceive as not been good is …..?????? The secret worshipers thing, surely you know that Christianity influences people by the preaching of the Gospels and that people hear them and converts, it has a power that we don’t fully understand, there are several theories on it, some are more logical than others, now influencing people to convert using force and attributing this to the immense popularity of Christianity, what would you call that? What is the main reason for Christianity popularity?

Hey there... I'm Panda....

Just wanted to comment on a few things here. Firstly, Yeshua probably wouldn't have wanted Christianity to be the ultimate popularity contest, and would be ashamed that you see it as such.

Secondly, people do convert when they see truth in something, but honestly, the reason Christianity is so widespread is just a matter of circumstance and nothing more. It doesn't have truth more than any other faith. and if we're counting popularity and statistics, Mormonism and Islam are probably the front runners for top religious converts. Most people who convert to these faiths, unlike mideval christianity, were given a choice and were not forced by the hand of a king.

Consider all these things, then consider that Buddhism's spread in Asia TOPPLES the number of Christians in teh States and Europe 2:1. Why shouldn't Buddhism and all it's variants be the most popular faith? Simply because you're too ignorant to know about it? Unlikely.

If you take all the pagan faiths in the world, *yes, this includes new age* and you put them together, you have a number that far amasses the existance of Christainity. It's not that it's popular, it's sociologically, and anthropologically just the way **** went down. Death or change of faith does not, in any way, equal popularity of a religion.

And anyway, though many people do convert to Christianity every year, it has more to do with the fact that they are so down and out that they'll take any rediculous answer to help them out of their position. If you were starving, and were told that with the right thoughts, you too would be fed by God... I bet you'd love to jump on it.

However, you, personally, probably were born into your faith. This means that 1) You didn't really have a choice to make up your mind from a young age. 2) You probably knew nothing else but the Bible since you're evangelical. 3) You only hear what you want to hear.

This post is ultimately pointless to you, because you see nothing except what your blindfolds permit, but this is is for the other people out there trying to help you see that this is not a matter of popularity or of goodness. It's a matter of seeking truth. Twisting words do not change the intent, or the word.

Hopefully this helps.

 

[Stellify]

Well perhaps you can suggest a better word to describe this, someone that think that people can be converted and become a preacher of some negative experiences, the heard mentality has a qualifier, the actions of the mass must be perceived as good by the individual, been force to believe something that you perceive as not been good is …..?????? The secret worshipers thing, surely you know that Christianity influences people by the preaching of the Gospels and that people hear them and converts, it has a power that we don’t fully understand, there are several theories on it, some are more logical than others, now influencing people to convert using force and attributing this to the immense popularity of Christianity, what would you call that? What is the main reason for Christianity popularity?

No, the herd mentality doesn't have that qualifier...honestly, I don't feel like going into complex psychological explanations about group motivations, nor do I think you would really listen even if I did. It's been a long day.
As for "been force to believe something that you perceive as not been good is …..??????"-- ...is being forced. That's the point of force, you do it (whether you think it's good or not), or you die. Actions of the mass don't necessarily have to be perceived as good by the individual. Just less-bad than the consequences.
I think that if you use the argument that you believe people were logical enough to look at whether or not the outcome of Christianity was positive or negative and convert because of that, then I think that kind of contradicts your *poof!* conversion when people read the gospels. One is logic-based and the other more mystical in nature. And, despite hearing the gospels, many pagans continued to worship their gods in secret.
Using force to convert and attributing that to Christianity's popularity? I call that history. And logical. It's not like it's the only religion that's used force to gain more followers. As I said, though, I don't believe it is the only cause for the spread of Christianity. Just one of many contributing factors. I don't feel like there is one "main" reason. I'm not arguing that reading the gospels doesn't convert some people, simply that I don't think you should so utterly discount other reasons.

Ugh. Hope that made sense. Very little sleep and no food since six this morning. Kinda light-headed...gonna go eat now lol :cover:

 

[logician]

The term "popular" in regards to religion is rather odd, like it's some kind of fad or trend.
I think most religions are really just doing everything to hang on these days, go into many churches, and the average age of people in he pews is over 60, religion has lost much of its appeal to the younger generation.