The sick concept of Eternal hell suffering.

[LittleNipper]

Maybe i need a refresher on greek mythology but if im correct i dont think those gods were kinder and gentler.

The "gods" of Greek mythology were only super human, othere than that, they were just as debased.

 

[sonofskeptish]

I really am looking to understand God, but not this God that humans teach, but the real God of Love , Joy and Peace. Not this God of eternal hell punishing, but the God of Patience, forgiveness and Mercy. You know, the real God, not this insane lunatic that many are trying to pass God off as being. You know, this lunatic that will place humans in this eternal Pain amphlipier and punish them for billions upon trillions of untold time and on into infinity. I just can't imagine how out of control this hell fire belief has gotten. And how much these bloodthirsty christians who teach it have ruined Gods reputation.

The eternal punishing of anything, muchless a human, is a sick concept, yet many believers have swallowed it into their belief, hook, line and sinker. And THAT is evidence of just how much foolishness we will absorb.

Peace.

Not only do believers swallow it, but even "lightly-religious" believers don't object and even teach the concept of eternal hellfire and punishment of sinners to their children.

IMO a real god would be appalled on how he is depicted by the Abrahamic faiths in their literature, etc. Yet, non-believers are the ones blamed for their "lack of morals" and sinful ways.

It's mind-boggling.

 

[mickiel]

Not only do believers swallow it, but even "lightly-religious" believers don't object and even teach the concept of eternal hellfire and punishment of sinners to their children.

IMO a real god would be appalled on how he is depicted by the Abrahamic faiths in their literature, etc. Yet, non-believers are the ones blamed for their "lack of morals" and sinful ways.

It's mind-boggling.

Well I agree with you, wholeheartly. Your observation is percise, I understand it the same. My concept of belief is that all humans will be with God when this strange stuff is over. Thats why I removed myself from the set of conventional believers, I could no longer swallow such nonsense about God.

God is Love, Love far beyond the tribble understandings that we hold about him. That Love will preserve all humans, we were designed to live and have life. I believe in the total rehabilitation of all of humanity, nothingless is worth Christ sacrifice.

Nothingless. He didnot suffer, so that many humans would suffer for eternity.

Peace

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Well I agree with you, wholeheartly. Your observation is percise, I understand it the same. My concept of belief is that all humans will be with God when this strange stuff is over. Thats why I removed myself from the set of conventional believers, I could no longer swallow such nonsense about God.
God is Love, Love far beyond the tribble understandings that we hold about him. That Love will preserve all humans, we were designed to live and have life. I believe in the total rehabilitation of all of humanity, nothingless is worth Christ sacrifice.
Nothingless. He didnot suffer, so that many humans would suffer for eternity.
Peace

'Conventional believers' often believe doctrines that are from pagan origin and not from Scripture. The clergy class has taught them doctrines or traditions of men as was the case even in Jesus day. Mark 7:7; Matt 15:9.

Scripture such as Ecclesiastes 9:5 shows the dead are not conscious of anything. No pain, no bliss.

1st John 1:7 does say Jesus blood cleanses us from all sin. But do 'all' who have the opportunity accept Jesus? Because all do not, that is why Matthew (20:28) wrote that Jesus gave his life as a ransom for 'many' and not all.

Daniel (12:2,13) also mentions 'many' because not all will be resurrected from the dust of the ground to gain eternal life.

This does not mean experiencing pain, but some commit the unforgivable sin of Matthew 12:32; Hebrews 6:4-6. Psalm 92:7 likens such to being fit for being destroyed forever. 2nd Thess 1:9 connects punishment for the unforgivable as: everlasting destruction. Please notice who is destroyed at Psalm 37:20,38. Destruction or having no existence anywhere awaits some.
Those that are from their father the devil (John 8:44) or who follow the devil,
then they will have the same outcome as Satan will have, which according to Hebrews 2:14 B is destruction.

Please notice that destruction, or an eternal death, so to speak, awaits both hell and death. Hell dies, death dies. Rev. (20:13,14) shows after all in hell (gravedom) are delivered up, then emptied-out hell (gravdeom) dies a symbolic death or second death of not ever returning again.

As far as all humans being with God, please notice Rev 21:3 which says that 'God is with men' or with mankind. So instead of humans being with God, so to speak, God is with humans. Verse 4 says what God will do for mankind including the fact that our last enemy death will exist no more. - 1st Cor 15:26.
This will start with Jesus ushering in Peace on Earth toward men of goodwill.

 

[AK4]

The "gods" of Greek mythology were only super human, othere than that, they were just as debased.

Zues was only superhuman? Hades too? I think you are only thinking of the demi gods

 

[AK4]

death dies.
.

You know, i dont think you actually get it. Do you understand the contradiction you are believing in and basing alot of your faith in? You say death dies. So what does that mean? Life. No matter where you and your doctrine tries to place where death is [grave, after judgment, before judgment, it dont matter, whenever], if death dies and ceases to exist, the only other possible conclusion is life for all.

Cant you see that if death dont exist then life is the only other possible solution.

Heres your contradiction. Death dies, no more death exists at all, anywhere. YET there is the many who will be eternally dead. So death still does exist.

You may say "they will be dead so they wont know this". Sounds logical right? No. How can i put this so you can understand, lets say your grandmother is eternally annihilated [dead] and you make it to eternal life. You was real close to your grandmother. In your eternal life you will always know that your grandmother will be eternally dead.

Do you see it? Thus therefore death still exist because you still know that your grandmother is dead, in death, eternally annihilated.

Even the phrase "eternal annihilation" is a contradiction to what you say "death dies". Annihilation is death yet you put eternal in front of annihilation you are basically saying annihilation will live eternal or annihilation will always exist or death will be eternal.

Do you honestly believe in contradictions and confusion?

 

[mickiel]

Jesus said something in Rev. 1:18 that is of intrest. He said he is the Living one, and that he will Live forever. He said that he has the Keys of Death and Hades. Hes got the Keys, the power to open and shut them. In Phil. 3:21 it states that Jesus has the Power to " Subject All things to himself." Two verses that are soaking in Universal Salvation for all of humanity.

Theres the Power right there to save everyone;

sadly certain Christians just don't believe Christ will use that Power, and really don't want him to.

Peace.

 

[AK4]

Jesus said something in Rev. 1:18 that is of intrest. He said he is the Living one, and that he will Live forever. He said that he has the Keys of Death and Hades. Hes got the Keys, the power to open and shut them. In Phil. 3:21 it states that Jesus has the Power to " Subject All things to himself." Two verses that are soaking in Universal Salvation for all of humanity.

Theres the Power right there to save everyone;

sadly certain Christians just don't believe Christ will use that Power, and really don't want him to.

Peace.

When you break down there thought process they are really saying He doesnt have the power, that mans supposed freewill is a "rock to be big that God can not lift", He gave man a power so powerful that it can thwart His own power. Will they admit that truly this is what they are saying? Nope. These types of christians kinda remind me of what Jesus was saying about wolves in sheep clothing.

 

[mickiel]

In Col. 1:20, Jesus shows his Power to " Reconcile All Things to Himself." Its like saying, " Give me the ball and I will score." There is no sin or sinner that Jesus willnot reconcile, all things, all sinners will be reconciled. In Phil. 2:10, Every knee will bow and confess to Christ. Listen, bowing and confessing, that means conversion in my book. When people bow, that means submission, when they confess, that means belief and obedience. And everyone is destined to do this, but no limited minded believer can see this. It takes an unlimited view, of an unlimited Savior to even begin to see this marvelous grace of Gods.

In 1John 2:2 Jesus is the " Propitiation" for our sins, ( our means believers) and not only for believers, but for those of the whole world, ( Meaning unbelievers). Propitiation means God will be satisfied with just Jesus sacrifice as the payment for all sin, including the sins being committed now. It means Jesus death has given EVERY human favor in Gods eyes, NOT just believers! Don't try and shortchange the meaning of Christ death. Don't be small minded and limit it. 1Tim. 2:6 shows the reah of Christ salvationous death, " He is the Ransom for ALL!"

And I want to go into that.

Peace.

 

[jtartar]

Whose god are you talking about here? I see no examples of a loving god.

crystalonyx,
If you think deeply about it, is there not a very god example of a loving God, in that He allows you to continue to live, while continuing your blasphemy against His Holy Name, and continuing to be blessed in enjoying all wonders of creation???
A person is very blind if he cannot see an Almighty God and an unmatchable designer in the wondrous creations in heaven and earth, Ps 104: 24,25, Rom 1:18-25.
The reason you do not see love of God in mankinds affairs today is because God has given rulership of the world over to Satan, because the vast majority of mankind has rejected God as ruler, just as Adam and Eve did, 2Cor 4:3,4, Luke 4:5-7, Rev 12:9, 1John 5:19, John 14:30,16:11.
God has only given Satan rulership for a specific time period. That timeis almost over!! In a short time God will bring about the paradise conditions that He promised, Rev 21:3-5, Luke 23:43, Isa 65:17-25, Acts 17:31.

 

[mickiel]

So many deceived believers think a lot about hell, as if God designed that as a motivation to Love him. Hell is a ruthless baseball bat, used to bang on the heads of humans who do not understand the Grace of God. In Romans 6:14," Sin shallnot win this game, for you are not under law, but under " Grace." All of humanity are under the Grace of God, limited minded believers are teaching that only they are under this Grace.

The very worse way to limit God, is to increase the number of people YOU think are condemned, in your mind.

Let me show you a purposeful contridiction. Rom. 6:23," For the wages of sin is death, but the FREE Gift of God is eternal Life in Christ Jesus our Lord." On the one hand we have sin and death, both very strong realitys. Now, are they stronger than a Free GIFT from God? Certainly not, ANY time God gives a gift, NOTHING can cancel it out, Nothing! Here God is FREELY giving Salvation as a gift, although many believers are trying to take that free gift away from unbelievers. As if THEY determine who gets the gift.

And I want to go into that.

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

Many humans feel as if humans are the determining factor in Life. The almighty " I". I am right, " I" am right, and I am right all of the time. The missing link is " Me." Frank Sinatra sang his song, " I did it MY way", this is how humanity feels and thinks. We grow inward into the evernarrowing world of Self! From this point, the doctrines of religion has been birthed. This is where the false concept of eternal hell suffering has come from. Self manifested religions. Man leading man.

And I want to go into that.

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

Humans leading humans into hell filled concepts, out from which humans are destined to burn forever. I have done this example before, and I will repeat it, because it further reveals the utter nonsense of this unholy belief. Eternal hell suffering suggest that God is planning to create " Super-humanoid suffering beings." It has to play out like this: God must first give these tortured destined beings eternal Life. Then he must give them legs like the incredible Hulk, howelse could they " Stand up forever in fire?" He must give them the lungs of Superman, because surely they will breathe in the flames of hell. He must give them the ability of " Aquaman", able to swim in this great lake of Fire. He must give them super " Consciousness", or they would surely faint into unconsciousness from this incredible level of consistant pain, why torture someone who is unconscious? What fun is that? Any normal human would go complettely insane after, lets say, 10 trillion years of this pain amphlifier.

He must give them the ability to never need nourishment, surely hes not planning to feed them, why the flames would overcook the food, if not outright burn it up! He must give them incredible non combustion bodys, which could endure the heat but not combust. If they are allowed to have eyes, he must create an extraordinary human pupil that could be immune to the flames. Surely he will remove their kidneys, because you just know they are not going to be drinking water in a lake of fire. Who needs kidneys, living in a lake of fire?

These are going to be an incredible formidable group of " Super Humans', and you just know that many of them will be really angry at God, so he'd better post enough Angel guards, we wouldnot want any of these things getting out, now would we?

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

Humans leading humans into hell filled concepts, out from which humans are destined to burn forever. I have done this example before, and I will repeat it, because it further reveals the utter nonsense of this unholy belief. Eternal hell suffering suggest that God is planning to create " Super-humanoid suffering beings." It has to play out like this: God must first give these tortured destined beings eternal Life. Then he must give them legs like the incredible Hulk, howelse could they " Stand up forever in fire?" He must give them the lungs of Superman, because surely they will breathe in the flames of hell. He must give them the ability of " Aquaman", able to swim in this great lake of Fire. He must give them super " Consciousness", or they would surely faint into unconsciousness from this incredible level of consistant pain, why torture someone who is unconscious? What fun is that? Any normal human would go complettely insane after, lets say, 10 trillion years of this pain amphlifier.

He must give them the ability to never need nourishment, surely hes not planning to feed them, why the flames would overcook the food, if not outright burn it up! He must give them incredible non combustion bodys, which could endure the heat but not combust. If they are allowed to have eyes, he must create an extraordinary human pupil that could be immune to the flames. Surely he will remove their kidneys, because you just know they are not going to be drinking water in a lake of fire. Who needs kidneys, living in a lake of fire?

These are going to be an incredible formidable group of " Super Humans', and you just know that many of them will be really angry at God, so he'd better post enough Angel guards, we wouldnot want any of these things getting out, now would we?

Peace.

Continuing with the proposed compisition of these " Super sufferers".

These humanoids will surely be all bald, no human hair could survive these flames, unless of course God remedys that by giving them hair that willnot somehow burn. Which brings up the question of " Fashion in hell?" Will they be naked, or be given uncombustional clothes? If Clothes, what style of garments? Maybe some kind of eternal prison issue. Belts, shoes, or some kind of super sufferer wardrobe?

What about the positioning of the crowd, who stands where and for how long? Who's going to control the crowd and how? What about teeth? Will they have molars and bicusbids, or flame controlled dentures with ganishing teeth? From what I have read, many believers in this most unique belief, say that they will be crying and screaming there. How is a tear supposed to survive in this great heat? Oh so maybe God will have given them " Super Teardrops."

Surely none of them will have sexual organs anymore, so a great castration must first take place. I am sure no intercourse will be taking place. Quite sure of the lack of enjoyment there. All emotional content, except for crying, must then be removed from them.

And to believe that a great God would allow this;

Something is seriously wrong with your emotional content.

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

Continuing with the proposed compisition of these " Super sufferers".


What about the social ramifications that will exist in hell? Will they be allowed to communicate with each other? Or is it everyone for themselves? I think if communication is allowed, that would further promote rebellion. So then NO, don't let these sorry super things communicate with each other. Thats got to be out! Keep family members away from each other, and no married couples can stand in the same area of the flames.

Hell must have strict organization, I mean this will be the most incredible level of constant human punishment ever conceived, so lets get this thing right. There can bo no sun or no night, its got to stay the same all the time. Why if there was a sun, or a calander day , then night would surely come, and these poor jokers might get a slight break in the heat. NO, No, we can't allow that. Keep the heat on man, keep them suffering, thats why they now will eternally exist!

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

Continuing with the proposed compisition of these " Super sufferers".

If theres going to be eternal suffering, then someone's going to have to change God himself, since your proposing that he will eternally co--exist with this great suffering. He can no longer be merciful, he must be given the ability to know and understand that this hell is nesscersary, man, I'd like to see that happen. From what I know about God, such a thing is impossible!

Yet within certain human believers, they have made this possible within their belief. Incredible assumption.

Concerning the human heart in hell. Why allow a human to have a heart in hell? For what? The heart must be removed-- no need! Why have a heart in hell? Its a heartless environment. No heart, no kidneys, no teeth for eating, no liver will be needed either. For that matter, lets remove the hands. Why let them have hands, for what? You can suffer without hands.

But skin, yes, lets let them have renewable skin. Super renewable skin that burns up, then grows back instantly. Yes, yes , thats it! Let them see their skin burn and melt off, then grow back only to continually repeat this process. Yes, thats a good way to torture people, surely God will approve of That.

Peace.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Continuing with the proposed compisition of these " Super sufferers".
If theres going to be eternal suffering, then someone's going to have to change God himself, since your proposing that he will eternally co--exist with this great suffering. He can no longer be merciful, he must be given the ability to know and understand that this hell is nesscersary, man, I'd like to see that happen. From what I know about God, such a thing is impossible!
Yet within certain human believers, they have made this possible within their belief. Incredible assumption.
Concerning the human heart in hell. Why allow a human to have a heart in hell? For what? The heart must be removed-- no need! Why have a heart in hell? Its a heartless environment. No heart, no kidneys, no teeth for eating, no liver will be needed either. For that matter, lets remove the hands. Why let them have hands, for what? You can suffer without hands.
But skin, yes, lets let them have renewable skin. Super renewable skin that burns up, then grows back instantly. Yes, yes , thats it! Let them see their skin burn and melt off, then grow back only to continually repeat this process. Yes, thats a good way to torture people, surely God will approve of That.
Peace.

There is no Scripture that says there will be literal eternal suffering.
2nd Thess 1:9 makes a connection that punishment is everlasting destruction.
Even Satan is destroyed Hebrews 2:14 B; Romans 16:20.

Fire is symbolic of destruction because nothing keeps burning forever.
Gehenna, the garbage dump outside of Jerusalem, burned up dead things.
The garbage dump did not keep live things or dead things burning forever.
That is why Jesus could mention Gehenna [hellfire] in connection to destruction. Gehenna is the word often translated as hellfire.
But is there fire in hell?
The Irish have an expression of helling potatoes. Helling potatoes is not roasting them but burying them.
Jesus according to Acts 2:27,31 was buried in hell.
According to Jesus words at John 11:11-14 Jesus believed that while he was buried in hell he would be having a deep sleep. RIP.

Since the dead are not conscious of anything , (Ecc 9:5,10) then there is no bliss nor any pain in hell (gravedom). Just a deep sleep-like state until the resurrection. Acts 24:15; Daniel 1:2,13.

In the end according to Rev 20:13,14 doesn't hell come to an end?
All in hell are delivered up or resurrected out of hell.
Then, once hell is emptied out, then hell dies a symbolic death.

According to Romans 6:23 death is what is the price tag to pay for sin.
That is why Romans 6:7 can say the dead are freed or acquitted from sin.
Death stamps the price of sin as: "Paid In Full".
(The only exception Matt 12:32; Heb 6:4-6)
Jesus ransom covers 'many' as Matthew (20:28) wrote.

'Many' will be resurrected back to life. Some to heavenly life to rule with Jesus, (Rev 5:9,10) and others to be part of the humble meek to inherit the earthly realm of God's kingdom over earth. -Psalm 37:11,29.

 

[mickiel]

Continuing with the compisition of " Super Sufferers."

For hell to exist, it must be seperate from the environment of those not included within it. Unless God plans on making it a type of " Zoo". You know, allow those basking in glory to come and see those poor human misfits who didnot make it. Give away some heavenly popcorn, while you look at these Super Sufferers being endulged in pious pain that must last forever. No, put this place into a kind of " Negative Zone", far away from the righteous people. If not, God risk the righteous perhaps growing tired of it themselves, and they might rebel against God, in effort to put an end to this incredible insanity!

One could only enjoy the misery of others for so long, until you can see that its a misery that you even entertain the thought of this burdened place yourself.

In hell, as pain stacks upon pain, and suffering multiplys, what would that create within the mind of the human sufferer? UnlessGod makes them automotons and mindless, they will be conscious. Just think, how they will be thinking, during this eternal torment. Lets look into the possible thoughts of these poor puny humans.

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

In hell, as pain stacks upon pain, and suffering multiplys, what would that create within the mind of the human sufferer? UnlessGod makes them automotons and mindless, they will be conscious. Just think, how they will be thinking, during this eternal torment. Lets look into the possible thoughts of these poor puny humans.

Peace.

Let me place myself in hell, and imagine how I would feel and think. Perhaps, knowing me, for the first 80,000 years of immense fire burning me, I'll blame myself and endure it. I am good at blaming myself, I can take it when I am wrong. But then I may have been wrong in my human life for 70 years, eventually I would have to ask, why am I being punished 80,000 years, for being wrong 70 years? The punishment does not fit the crime. Well perhaps I am wrong about that, 80,000 years for 70 years of sin, maybe it is fair, and I just cannot see it. But then I face an additional eternity of being punished, good greif, I may have a point.

Yet I must think about Gods Goodness, his Fairness, his Kindness, his Love, and I have time to think about it.

I see no other avenue but to hate God while I am suffering in this eternity. Its just not fair! And my mind knows this, so I am placed into a reality that will eventually generate hate against God.

And I want to go into the ramifications of that.

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

Yet I must think about Gods Goodness, his Fairness, his Kindness, his Love, and I have time to think about it.

I see no other avenue but to hate God while I am suffering in this eternity. Its just not fair! And my mind knows this, so I am placed into a reality that will eventually generate hate against God.

And I want to go into the ramifications of that.

Peace.

Why would God place humans who hated him, into an environment that would further generate that hate for him, and expect that to be Love? I don't understand that rationale at all. If God is Love, then all he does must be defined by that Love. I see no Love at all in eternally punishing humans! I don't care what you have done, how long you did it, NOBODY deserves an eternity of misery, and God cannot,in ANY manner, be excused from this.

The concept of eternal punishment is sick! Its just insane, no question about it, and yet certain believers have made room for this sickness in their belief! Then they teach Gods Love. From this sick vantage point, the perverted doctrines of belief has been born. And been spread. The true Love of our Father has been perverted and its embarrising, humilitaing, for me to have to defend against this dirty dogma.

And let me move into that.

Peace.