Would it be weird to post the conversation I'm having here so maybe you can give me tips on how to get this conversation booming? I struggle moving beyond small talk.
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The Sum of Awe's search for love and confidence
- Thread starter The Sum of Awe
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PoetPhilosopher
Veteran Member
I don't have an answer to that. But if you do, you might want to maybe at least cross out any names and personal information. Or just post the text, and not post any personal parts.
Though I don't really see why you can't just tell us what specific part you're struggling with, and see if we have any ideas.
I guess it couldn't hurt, but you can't expect too much help from me personally in that department: I'm really lousy at small talk myself.
And today was pretty bad...
I was working with my friend group even! And they were nice and everything. But the boss lady, she used condescending tone of voice and kinda ridiculed me. I understand I made a mistake, but did she really have to call me out in such a mocking way "Why are you starting the job when you haven't read your book?" in such a rude way? and then it makes me nervous more and more, and then I keep making mistakes because I'm on edge, like a domino effect, for the rest of the day. And I made a crap load of mistakes today (small things, but a lot of them) worked slow, etc. and was visibly nervous, antsy to stay busy and not able to relax. My friend group that I was working with seemed to be slightly annoyed by my constant mistakes, I didn't want to explain that I was having nervousness issues because that would seem like I'm making excuses or trying to get their pity or something, so I kinda just kept to myself and I did apologize for my mistakes to them once but all they said was "we don't care" and "just gotta keep trying better".
The boss lady kept showing annoyance/mild anger towards me and it made me more nervous each time.
I was working with my friend group even! And they were nice and everything. But the boss lady, she used condescending tone of voice and kinda ridiculed me. I understand I made a mistake, but did she really have to call me out in such a mocking way "Why are you starting the job when you haven't read your book?" in such a rude way? and then it makes me nervous more and more, and then I keep making mistakes because I'm on edge, like a domino effect, for the rest of the day. And I made a crap load of mistakes today (small things, but a lot of them) worked slow, etc. and was visibly nervous, antsy to stay busy and not able to relax. My friend group that I was working with seemed to be slightly annoyed by my constant mistakes, I didn't want to explain that I was having nervousness issues because that would seem like I'm making excuses or trying to get their pity or something, so I kinda just kept to myself and I did apologize for my mistakes to them once but all they said was "we don't care" and "just gotta keep trying better".
The boss lady kept showing annoyance/mild anger towards me and it made me more nervous each time.
I’m so misunderstood. And I’m very careful about what I do and say constantly. But the stuff I keep to myself, well, those are just things you don’t tell people. And I don’t know what to do instead from what I’m already doing, I’m aware that I’m overly nice and that’s the best way I can explain it. I never get angry and therefore people don’t trust or understand me. But I control my anger I keep it to myself. I am more so just miserable and depressed rather than angry and you’re really not supposed to show that.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Maybe an activity that lets you get some of that anger out would help. Something that lets you yell a bit without being crazy. If you are a bit nerdy you might try larping. Live Action Role Playing. I don't think it is healthy to keep all of that bottled up.
I don’t really feel angry I’m good at letting things go. Just upset. Then posting on here and talking to my therapist is a way I let it out.
PoetPhilosopher
Veteran Member
What worked for me may not work for you, but I've had some pretty great success for myself these past two weeks by doing this:
Taking the concept of "Think positive thoughts" a bit further and less basically. By "channeling positive thoughts and memories" instead, and using them as a source of energy, motivation and inspiration. Possibly even in a slightly spiritual way.
Taking the concept of "Think positive thoughts" a bit further and less basically. By "channeling positive thoughts and memories" instead, and using them as a source of energy, motivation and inspiration. Possibly even in a slightly spiritual way.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
That is possibly even better.
Koldo
Outstanding Member
It is just how the game works. While you are talking to those girls, a dozen other guys are talking to them too. Some of them are prettier, some are rich. And this means you are not on the top of the list. Men need to try much harder than women. That's how it is.
The reason I will never end up in a relationship it seems is because I'm a 'nice guy'. I don't know how to undo this part of my personality, I always thought I was so strong for being able to have so much patience and to maintain my kindness in spite of whatever bothers me. Apparently that's not how girls see it, most sources say.
What more can I do? I don't get angry, I choose not to complain, I choose not to brag. I choose to be what i see as moral, and I put so much effort into maintaining that when building my personality. I chose that to be my strongest trait.
Admittedly I don't know how to stick up for myself. Whenever someone yells at me I get quiet and nervous. Maybe I could work on that at least, but often I am convinced I am the one to blame in those situations, and I'm bad at thinking of ways to defend myself.
What more can I do? I don't get angry, I choose not to complain, I choose not to brag. I choose to be what i see as moral, and I put so much effort into maintaining that when building my personality. I chose that to be my strongest trait.
Admittedly I don't know how to stick up for myself. Whenever someone yells at me I get quiet and nervous. Maybe I could work on that at least, but often I am convinced I am the one to blame in those situations, and I'm bad at thinking of ways to defend myself.
There's nothing wrong with being a nice guy.
Perhaps you just need to find a nice girl.
Maybe you're right. What if there's some truth to this though? I've seen so many sources saying this same thing. Most girls aren't attracted to 'nice guys' because being kind and a good listener is seen as the 'minimum' of good social behavior, and it also shows submission and not having a backbone.There's nothing wrong with being a nice guy.
Perhaps you just need to find a nice girl.
Some girls aren't. But there will be at least a few who are. You might have a little more trouble finding them, but they're out there.
PoetPhilosopher
Veteran Member
You probably are a nice guy.
However, I don't think that's quite the right attitude to have when dating. Instead of thinking:
"I'm a nice guy. I deserve a woman. I guess women don't like nice guys."
Think:
"I'm the kind of guy that lets the woman determine what kind of guy I am."
You don't have to apply this rule universally though. You can be confident in yourself, and see that you're nice. What gets awkward is if you tell women, rather than show women you're a nice guy.
PoetPhilosopher
Veteran Member
Some women are into submission, and some women are into dominance.
Just be careful of internet advice written by mostly men (and some women) which says you have to be an arrogant, macho, not very nice alpha male to get someone. All that does is try to manipulate people into hookups.
I think a better attitude "may" be to look at it like this: "I am dating with the hopes of a woman choosing to make an emotional investment in me."
You don't have to follow my advice or statement 100%, either. You can still be your own person, carve your own path, and I'm just offering suggestions.
That is a good way to think about it. Perhaps I have always been trying to be nice, in hopes to get love and respect. I don't know if I'd say I'm a pushover, I do express my disagreements and opinions in minor things but overall just tend to avoid discussions about major things I disagree with (talking about opinions of other people, or talking about other big things I have an opinion on, or things I find unfair I don't express it I pretend that 'everything is what it is' and I've convinced myself that but at the same time maybe I should be open to the idea that I can express my deeper opinions on things I dislike)
And of course I don't tell women that, hehehe, that would be part of boasting which I always avoided as well.
People say 'be yourself' and I've thought I knew what it meant, then I realized I didn't. Then I interpreted it differently, thought I had it, but once again realized I didn't. This is another one of those moments. There are obviously limits to expressing yourself, even if nobody admits it. It's hard to figure out what the line is. But I'm starting to realize that's for me to decide and I may accidentally overstep some lines for others. I don't know where I want to draw my lines, I don't understand socializing much at all. Or maybe, this entire time I have been drawing my lines and I'm still just figuring out where to put them, they're still adapting until I feel comfortable.
At the same time I have to accept sometimes I will feel uncomfortable even when I do have my lines. For example, yesterday I know it would've been wrong for me to talk back to my boss. But at the same time I wanted to explain myself to my friend group that 'I keep making mistakes when I get nervous' so they understood. Maybe I could've done that. Or maybe I just didn't have to. The reason I didn't is because I felt like I was just trying to defend my ego, but they didn't appear to hate me they were just somewhat annoyed. So in the end I decided to not explain myself and just try to do better. Maybe I can feel confident about my choice yesterday.
I wish these people could see how strong I am on the inside, that's where I'm proud of myself at. But on the outside I don't think it shows that much.
Sorry just rambling.
I know how cliché' this sounds but the only advice I can give you on this is to be yourself, mainly because it's the only act that you're ever going to be able to pull off convincingly.
One of the main reasons women don't usually go for nice guys is because most nice guys aren't really nice guys: they're just garden-variety guys who are acting especially nice atm because they're under the mistaken impression that it might help them get something they want. Women can see though this (even when we can't
).To me it sounds like you're trying to figure out who you should be in order to attract women. That's not going to work.
PoetPhilosopher
Veteran Member
If that's the case, I'd say a lot of women are pretty good at seeing through it.
There's an older saying that goes... "I never knew how many problems I had until I dated a woman."
We're living more and more in a time where it's okay for a man to not act like the next Chuck Norris.
When talking with another person, just remember you both have boundaries and wants, and boundaries and preferences are a two-way street.
Maybe. But I'd say some people - not all - may be more perceptive than you might think.