The trinity is false - I have proof

[Colt]

Actually, not true. All Jews are considered "sons of God", and "son of man" is messianic, which is an opinion but not considered blasphemy. Jesus wasn't the only one to make such a claim.

16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

The trial:

63 But Jesus kept silent. And the high priest answered and said to Him, “I put You under oath by the living God: Tell us if You are the Christ, the Son of God!” 64 Jesus said to him, “It is as you said. Nevertheless, I say to you, hereafter you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Power, and coming on the clouds of heaven.” 65 Then the high priest tore his clothes, saying, “He has spoken blasphemy! What further need do we have of witnesses? Look, now you have heard His blasphemy! NKJV

 

[metis]

16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

The trial:
63 But Jesus kept silent. And the high priest answered and said to Him, “I put You under oath by the living God: Tell us if The

The key word here is "the ...", which implies one and also implies Jesus actually being God, which indeed falls under "blasphemy". Some theologians have strong doubts that Jesus ever made such statements or Jews would never likely have been attracted to him in the first place.

 

[LuisDantas]

I just don't see how the Trinity could ever be a big deal either way, nor how it could possibly be beyond the means of the Ultimate Exception that is Abraham's God.

 

[Colt]

The key word here is "the ...", which implies one and also implies Jesus actually being God, which indeed falls under "blasphemy". Some theologians have strong doubts that Jesus ever made such statements or Jews would never likely have been attracted to him in the first place.

Errrrm, yea, Jesus wasn't real popular among the "theologians" of his day. He appealed more to the common man and even then he was largely rejected by his own.

Parable of the Landowner​

33 “Listen to another parable. There was a [a]landowner who planted a vineyard and put a [b]fence around it, and dug a wine press in it, and built a tower, and he leased it to [c]vine-growers and went on a journey. 34 And when the [d]harvest time approached, he sent his slaves to the vine-growers to receive his fruit. 35 And the vine-growers took his slaves and beat one, killed another, and stoned another. 36 Again, he sent other slaves, more than the first; and they did the same things to them. 37 But afterward he sent his son to them, saying, ‘They will respect my son.’ 38 But when the vine-growers saw the son, they said among themselves, ‘This is the heir; come, let’s kill him and take possession of his inheritance!’ 39 And they took him and threw him out of the vineyard, and killed him. 40 Therefore, when the [e]owner of the vineyard comes, what will he do to those vine-growers?” 41 They *said to Him, “He will bring those wretches to a wretched end and lease the vineyard to other vine-growers, who will pay him the fruit in the proper seasons.”

42 Jesus *said to them, “Did you never read in the Scriptures,

‘A stone which the builders rejected,
This has become the [f]chief cornerstone;
This came about from the Lord,
And it is marvelous in our eyes’?

43 Therefore I say to you, the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a [g]people producing its fruit. 44 And the one who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces; and on whomever it falls, it will crush him.”

45 When the chief priests and the Pharisees heard His parables, they understood that He was speaking about them. 46 And although they sought to arrest Him, they feared the crowds, since they considered Him to be a prophet.

 

[metis]

Errrrm, yea, Jesus wasn't real popular among the "theologians" of his day. He appealed more to the common man and even then he was largely rejected by his own.

Parable of the Landowner​

33 “Listen to another parable. There was a [a]landowner who planted a vineyard and put a [b]fence around it, and dug a wine press in it, and built a tower, and he leased it to [c]vine-growers and went on a journey. 34 And when the [d]harvest time approached, he sent his slaves to the vine-growers to receive his fruit. 35 And the vine-growers took his slaves and beat one, killed another, and stoned another. 36 Again, he sent other slaves, more than the first; and they did the same things to them. 37 But afterward he sent his son to them, saying, ‘They will respect my son.’ 38 But when the vine-growers saw the son, they said among themselves, ‘This is the heir; come, let’s kill him and take possession of his inheritance!’ 39 And they took him and threw him out of the vineyard, and killed him. 40 Therefore, when the [e]owner of the vineyard comes, what will he do to those vine-growers?” 41 They *said to Him, “He will bring those wretches to a wretched end and lease the vineyard to other vine-growers, who will pay him the fruit in the proper seasons.”

42 Jesus *said to them, “Did you never read in the Scriptures,

‘A stone which the builders rejected,
This has become the [f]chief cornerstone;
This came about from the Lord,
And it is marvelous in our eyes’?

43 Therefore I say to you, the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a [g]people producing its fruit. 44 And the one who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces; and on whomever it falls, it will crush him.”

45 When the chief priests and the Pharisees heard His parables, they understood that He was speaking about them. 46 And although they sought to arrest Him, they feared the crowds, since they considered Him to be a prophet.

First of all, I don't believe everything I read, and that includes scripture.

Secondly, the Gospels and epistles certainly glorify Jesus, which is quite understandable, but objectivity was and is not to be expected.

Finally, my respect and love for Jesus does not come from claims about him but from his teaching of peace and his synthesizing of the Laws of Moses to his most basic message of love.

 

[Glaurung]

The Trinitarian concept in Catholicism has it that there are not three gods but one God with Jesus and the Holy Spirit being of the "essence" of God.

This is incorrect. God is three persons with one divine essence. Jesus and the Holy Spirit are not of the essence of God. They are God. All three persons are God in their own right.

I believe the trinity is false. God is not a trinity. Proof?

1 Corinthians 14.33
For God is not the author of confusion

The trinity create confusion.

And

Exodus 20.5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God

According to the trinity God has three I. But according to Exodus 20.5 God has only one I

Christianity does teach that the Trinity is a mystery beyond human reason. But it is not that hard to understand that the Triune God is a single divine reality. God may be a trinity, but He is still one God.

Trinity was needed to make ambiguous the position of the holy spirit. That was needed to make unclear the clear prophecies regarding Mohammad (s). If people understood how Elyas (a) came back and the position of the holy spirit he held till Mohammad (s), then the prophecies of Jesus (a) about both become clear.

Absurd.

The position of the Holy Spirit is not ambiguous. The Holy Spirit is the third person of the Blessed Trinity. He is God. When Christian orthodoxy was being hammered out, no one was trying to cover up the claims of a religion that would not exist for centuries after the fact.

 

[metis]

This is incorrect. God is three persons with one divine essence. Jesus and the Holy Spirit are not of the essence of God. They are God. All three persons are God in their own right.

Then whom was Jesus praying to when on the cross? Why did he say he didn't know when the end times would be as only the Father would know?

IOW, if three individuals have different names, then obviously they cannot be the same-- unless one uses "essence", which the Church used at least in the 4th century at the Council of Nicaea when the Trinitarian concept was formulated.

 

[Link]

This is incorrect. God is three persons with one divine essence. Jesus and the Holy Spirit are not of the essence of God. They are God. All three persons are God in their own right.


Christianity does teach that the Trinity is a mystery beyond human reason. But it is not that hard to understand that the Triune God is a single divine reality. God may be a trinity, but He is still one God.


Absurd.

The position of the Holy Spirit is not ambiguous. The Holy Spirit is the third person of the Blessed Trinity. He is God. When Christian orthodoxy was being hammered out, no one was trying to cover up the claims of a religion that would not exist for centuries after the fact.

Salam

Gog and Magog were introduced so as to be aware of a society that misguides humanity. Many religions went astray before Christianity as well.

Gog is a oracle and sorcerer that the possessor is Satan himself. Magog are followers of Gog and have their own Satanic entities from the Jinn possessing them.

As for these people, they always first try to make ambiguous what is clear, and so the first war is against interpretation and they decontextualize words.

Then after that, if they can, they will change words literally and sabotage as much as the revelation as possible.

If it weren't for this society, none of the religions would go astray.

Yazeed was a Kahen too, and most likely a Gog himself.

 

[viole]

I believe the trinity is false. God is not a trinity. Proof?

1 Corinthians 14.33
For God is not the author of confusion

The trinity create confusion.

And

Exodus 20.5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God

According to the trinity God has three I. But according to Exodus 20.5 God has only one I

I could use the same argument to prove that there is no God connected to Corinthians.

Premise: God is not the author of confusion.
Observation: people believe and believed in thousands of mutually contradicting gods. Even within the same belief bubble. A theological mess.
Conclusion: either the premise is false, or there is no God Who ever said that.

at any rate, we can logically infer that if Corinthians is from God, then that God cannot exist.

ciao

- viole

 

[paarsurrey]

The trinity is false - I have proof

I agree, it sure, is false out and out, please, right?

Regards

 

[Muffled]

The trinity is false - I have proof

I agree, it sure, is false out and out, please, right?

Regards

I believe your belief has no basis.

 

[Muffled]

I read that the trinity was made because many of the surrounding religions were trinities. How Ancient Trinitarian Gods Influenced Adoption of the Trinity

I believe that is false. The Trinity became doctrine because it is in the Bible.

 

[Muffled]

No. It's more like the Bible is just a book, same as any other book out there with people getting their own personal take in reading it.

What that tells me is the Bible isn't divine or special in any way , and the proof is all the confusion with no direction at all to speak for it.

I o not believe God becomes less communicative simply because people are stupid. There is enough plain truth so that even a simpleton can understand it. It usually is the highly intelligent who tend to mess things up because they want it to be more complicated.

 

[Sand Dancer]

I believe that is false. The Trinity became doctrine because it is in the Bible.

The reason I gave is why it could have been put in the Bible.

 

[paarsurrey]

The trinity is false - I have proof

I believe the trinity is false. God is not a trinity. Proof?

1 Corinthians 14.33
For God is not the author of confusion

The trinity create confusion.

And

Exodus 20.5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God

According to the trinity God has three I. But according to Exodus 20.5 God has only one I

I read that the trinity was made because many of the surrounding religions were trinities. How Ancient Trinitarian Gods Influenced Adoption of the Trinity

Sure Trinity is false, please, did Jesus- the truthful Israelite Messiah, ever use the word Trinity or advocate it?
If yes, then anybody to kindly quote from Jesus in first person, please.
I agree with one here, right?

poster #52 The Trinity became doctrine because it is in the Bible

The reason I gave is why it could have been put in the Bible.

poster #52 The Trinity became doctrine because it is in the Bible.
But Bible was never authored/narrated and or written by any express permission of Yeshua*- the truthful Israelite Messiah, right, please?

*who was never a Jew

Right?

Regards

 

[amatuerscholar]

I believe the trinity is false. God is not a trinity. Proof?

1 Corinthians 14.33
For God is not the author of confusion

The trinity create confusion.

And

Exodus 20.5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God

According to the trinity God has three I. But according to Exodus 20.5 God has only one I

I think the issue is that the Trinitarian view is complex, and people don't like complex, so they overly simplify it, which then leads to confusion. The Trinity doesn't create confusion, but people's mistaken views of over simplification of the theology, creates confusion. This can be applied basically to anything.

The idea of the Trinity also isn't that it is 3. God is still one. God is singular. But there are difference facets of God. This isn't just a Christian view.

Daniel Boyarin has produced some great work here on the binitarian view of God in Hebrew scripture. For instance, we have depictions of Wisdom being the personification of God. It's not that Wisdom is another god or God, but that it is a facet of God. We have this with the Spirit of God as well. The Spirit of God is not another god, but is a facet of God.

This view is then adopted by those within the early Jesus movement. They already had a binitarian view of God, and a trinitarian view only adds one more facet. This facet isn't completely original either. If we look at say Philo of Alexandria, what we see is this talk about the logos. This idea of the logos really is taking from the wisdom literature. So one can make a connection between the personification of Wisdom as a facet of God, and logos. This is adopted by the author of John, who takes this connection and attaches it to Jesus.

So we aren't talking about different gods, or God being more than one. We are talking about facets of God. God is one, but God has different facets.

No. It's more like the Bible is just a book, same as any other book out there with people getting their own personal take in reading it.

What that tells me is the Bible isn't divine or special in any way , and the proof is all the confusion with no direction at all to speak for it.

The Bible is more like a collection of books that make up many different genres, that need to be treated differently. While people often take their own personal views while reading such books, it doesn't mean that all such views should be held equally. Some are more right than others. Some are simply wrong.

To simply dismiss it because of confusion that is created by people who are misinformed isn't logical.

Now, maybe the Bible isn't divine. I personally wouldn't argue that it is. I think it would be more accurate to say maybe it's divinely inspired at best. But that doesn't mean it isn't special or can't be special.

 

[Yokefellow]

I believe the trinity is false. God is not a trinity. Proof?

Because you do not possess the wherewithal to understand the Trinity, then it MUST be false.

Unreal.

 

[Tinkerpeach]

I believe the trinity is false. God is not a trinity. Proof?

1 Corinthians 14.33
For God is not the author of confusion

The trinity create confusion.

And

Exodus 20.5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God

According to the trinity God has three I. But according to Exodus 20.5 God has only one I

I’m sorry you are confused about the Trinity.

Many of us are not.

Perhaps the error lies with you?

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

I believe the trinity is false. God is not a trinity. Proof?

1 Corinthians 14.33
For God is not the author of confusion

The trinity create confusion.

And

Exodus 20.5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God

According to the trinity God has three I. But according to Exodus 20.5 God has only one I

I used to believe in the Trinity doctrine when I was still a devout Christian, but I've since come to believe that it, like stories about Jesus, has pagan roots. I decided to reexamine it and conduct my own research to uncover its true origins after reading some informative posts about it by another member. It's similar to how I decided to reject my Christian-indoctrinated beliefs about Satan and demons after reading some informative posts by a Baháʼí member.

As a former Christian, I now believe that the Trinity doctrine was copied and adapted from paganism, and these two articles will explain why.

First article: Pagan Roots of the Trinity Doctrine

Second article: How Ancient Trinitarian Gods Influenced Adoption of the Trinity

 

[Kathryn]

I’m sorry you are confused about the Trinity.

Many of us are not.

Perhaps the error lies with you?

You took the words right out of my mouth and fingers.