To the Non Believers.

[Badran]

" I have never claimed that believing in God and following religion makes one a better person. A person makes himself a better person. Believing in God for me, is the belief in what is true (for me) and that's it."

That MAY be true for YOU personally. But your religion and the other variants of it disagree. In fact we are told daily that personal morality and eternal salvation are the reasons why one must be a believer.

Otherwise one becomes a godless amoral atheist who kills kittens and roasts 4 mon old babies for picnics.

Or kills in the name of progress.

Yes i know these claims are made by some or may be most believers to be honest. I understand how this triggers the criticism and sarcasm towards them.

But just like any other group, not all believers act or think alike. So i wish people wouldn't generalize when talking about believers or Theists or religion.

 

[Archer]

"I hear atheists speak of their moral supremacy and then I see posts like the ones blaming faith for atrocities and still nothing of any substance to retort my post. "

Perhaps 9/11 escaped your attention.

9/11 was a pin prick compared to what your kind have done!

 

[Wotan]

Why believers do you NEVER read this headline.

Atheist gunman invades Church. Kills godly worshipers.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

You are no better you and those like you spread lies and misinformation. You bend things to meet your agenda. You discount or distort the truth in an attempt to convince people that you have superior morals.

Can you quote one example of anybody in this thread making any such claim?

I point out that the vast majority of monstrous killings were done by godless people not those of faith.

Again, I very much doubt that. Not because atheists are superior, but because religion's already proven pretty unbeatable in that department throughout history.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

9/11 was a pin prick compared to what your kind have done!

Now there's a blanket statement!

 

[Wotan]

Yes i know these claims are made by some or may be most believers to be honest. I understand how this triggers the criticism and sarcasm towards them.

But just like any other group, not all believers act or think alike. So i wish people wouldn't generalize when talking about believers or Theists or religion.

I appreciate your candor.

Fruballs.

 

[Archer]

Why believers do you NEVER read this headline.

Atheist gunman invades Church. Kills godly worshipers.

Give me the numbers. You cant account for it. How many murders are carried out by the Godless? The liberal press never tells the faith of every murderer or lack of faith they just point out Christians, Muslims and Jews. Again you are grasping at straws.

 

[LuisDantas]

Let me see if I got this straight, Archer.

You're accusing Atheism of being just "another religion".

You claim that we talk about our moral supremacy, apparently solely because we point out that faith has often fueled cruelty of various kinds.

And you also claim that there is no difference between us and theists.

Sorry to say, but you are very mistaken in many ways. For one, you fail to realize that people don't commit attrocities due to lack of belief in God. Or do you know of any? I sure don't.

 

[Eliot Wild]

Per the definition religion does not need a god to be a religion. All athiests may not be religous in the dislike of the fact that some of us have God but the groups trying to remove God are a religion.

I honestly mean no disrespect to you or your beliefs. And furthermore, I do not mean to be consdescending or pedantic, but I think you might want to take another tact or approach.

I have begun to notice that some people on RF tend to let rhetorical devices lead them astray. And what I mean by that, is that they will employ rhetorical and/or poetical devices in their arguments, such as the use of oxymorons like "atheistic theists" or "religious atheists". These exressions may have some bombastic or articulate value, meaning they may serve to stress a point or highlight a particular element of one's argument, but they are misapplied when one seeks to make a pronouncement of actual truth with them.

Atheism is NOT a religion. And while the behavior of some atheist might indeed appear almost canonical or prescribed by doctrine, I assure you there is no organized Atheistic religion with documented observances and instructions. There is nothing which all atheists worship in common. Now, one might claim that certain atheists worship "TRUTH" or "REASON", and that might be somewhat correct, at least figuratively. But again, that would be a rhetorical pronouncement. Since atheists actually worship nothing but submit to verifiable truth or the dictates of reason, then one might make a poetical or rhetorical pronouncement that, "atheists worship reason", but this wouldn't be literally correct.

I don't know. I am sincerely trying to help, not to ridicule or insult. I am an amateur writer and I notice these misapplications of words and meanings all the time. I am as guilty as anyone on RF because I often let my poetry and my prose get the best of me. But doing so can hold dire consequences for one's argument.

 

[DeitySlayer]

9/11 was a pin prick compared to what your kind have done!

You're so slow Archer. How many times do we have to say this?

Atheism. Was. Not. The. Cause. Of. The. Crimes.

Stalin did not kill for atheism. Hitler did not kill for atheism.

They killed, and they were atheist. But they didn't go 'Oh, I don't believe in God, hence I will kill people'. No, they killed people because they were pyschopaths. You could just as easily make the argument that Stalin and Hitler killed people because they had moustaches.

 

[LuisDantas]

9/11 was a pin prick compared to what your kind have done!

For instance?

 

[Badran]

I appreciate your candor.

Fruballs.

Thank you.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

What Archer believes:

 

[Archer]

What the hell did the most evil men of their century have in common. I don't mean what we perceive as evil I meal the ones who committed human atrocities. I never said the killed in the name of atheism I am saying that they were atheists and you people need to get off your high horses because if I do the math more have been killed by atheists than theists. Sure you will argue this but it is a fact! Please stop making all of the false accusations and telling outright lies about the faithful.

Atheism is a religion just as you group the Jew, Muslim and Christian together though we believe different things. Atheists don't believe in a god though they are not the same.

 

[Archer]

For instance?

I already covered the atrocities committed by atheists. I guess I could go further but there is no point. Please defend your beliefs and how they are superior or just admit we are all human and God has nothing to do with it.

Just think I have not even gotten started.

 

[Falvlun]

Atheism is a religion just as you group the Jew, Muslim and Christian together though we believe different things. Atheists don't believe in a god though they are not the same.

Just a quibble: The function of religion is to serve/praise/worship God or to find enlightenment/Nirvana/etc. Atheism does not have either of those goals, so it is by definition, not a religion. At best, you could call it a belief system or a worldview.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

What the hell did the most evil men of their century have in common. I don't mean what we perceive as evil I meal the ones who committed human atrocities. I never said the killed in the name of atheism I am saying that they were atheists and you people need to get off your high horses because if I do the math more have been killed by atheists than theists. Sure you will argue this but it is a fact!

Again, I doubt that it's a fact. I'm sure many people have died under the regimes of Mao or Stalin, but I very much doubt that those quantities are larger than all religious atrocities throughout history.

Please stop making all of the false accusations and telling outright lies about the faithful.

What accusations do you think we've been making?

Atheism is a religion just as you group the Jew, Muslim and Christian together though we believe different things. Atheists don't believe in a god though they are not the same.

What are you talking about? We've already explained to you, in detail, why atheism is not a religion - and yet without refuting those explanations you keep saying it. Repeating a point that has been demonstrated to be false does not make it any more true.

 

[Archer]

What Archer believes:

More like this: BBC NEWS | Asia-Pacific | China's Christians suffer for their faith any other questions? I could dig but this was the first hit I got. You people try to convert by the sword just as every other faith yet you claim you are better.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

More like this: BBC NEWS | Asia-Pacific | China's Christians suffer for their faith any other questions? I could dig but this was the first hit I got.

Congratulations, you found an example of Christians being persecuted.

Now, how was that caused or justified by atheism?

You people try to convert by the sword just as every other faith yet you claim you are better.

Can you quote a single example of an atheist in this forum making such a claim?

 

[Archer]

Again, I doubt that it's a fact. I'm sure many people have died under the regimes of Mao or Stalin, but I very much doubt that those quantities are larger than all religious atrocities throughout history.


What accusations do you think we've been making?


What are you talking about? We've already explained to you, in detail, why atheism is not a religion - and yet without refuting those explanations you keep saying it. Repeating a point that has been demonstrated to be false does not make it any more true.

And still no backup. Give me some numbers that are not similar to mine and then we can have a peeing contest that I have no doubt you will loose.

I wont repest how you blame belief in God for mass atrocities yet I have shown that belief in no gad has killed more.

Explain what you wish. You are still on the run and grasping at straws.