To the Non Believers.

[tumbleweed41]

More People Have Been Killed in the Name of Atheism & Secularism than Religion?

Nice. Did you read what you linked to?

How Many Have Been Killed by Communists in the Name of Atheism & Secularism?:

None, probably. How can that be? After all, millions and millions of people died in Russia and China under communist governments — and those governments were both secular and atheistic. So weren't all of those people killed because of atheism — even in the name of atheism and secularism? No, that conclusion does not follow. Atheism itself isn't a principle, cause, philosophy, or belief system which people fight, die, or kill for. Being by an atheist is no more being killed in the name of atheism than being killed by a tall person is being killed in the name of tallness. Communists Don't Kill in the Name of Atheism...

Atheists are Intolerant for Criticizing Religion, Theism:

There are several myths here, all tightly intertwined for the apparent purpose of getting atheists to cease making uncomfortable and unwelcome criticisms of religion and theism. Religious believers, mostly Christians, are responding to atheistic critiques of religion by claiming that vocal, unapologetic atheists are analogous to religious terrorists and that criticism of religion is a form of religious intolerance. The implication is that believers shouldn't have to be faced with criticism. This is wrong: religion and theism aren't owed any deference or respect. Criticism of Religion & Theism is Not Intolerance...

Many associate atheism with anti-social and even criminal behavior, but such assertions are usually little more than that: bare assertions without substantiating evidence or arguments. The most people offer may be question-begging claims about religion and god being necessary for moral behavior. Here, however, we have a new twist which claims that there is a physiological, biological reason behind people - or at least men - rejecting religion and gods. Unfortunately, it's rife with flaws.

(BTW, Austin Cline and I are old chat buddies from over ten years ago.)

 

[Wotan]

So our devout and fair minded believer wants us to think that the atheists Stalin and Mao killed hundreds of fellow atheist members of CPSU and the CPC because . . . they were atheists.

And THIS we are told is a rational argument.

Just believing these mythologies corrodes reasoning ability. Example above.

 

[DeitySlayer]

In 1984, after Sikh guards riddled prime minister Indira Gandhi with 50 bullets

In defence, this was after she had ordered the Indian Army to storm the Golden Temple in Amritsar; the rough equivalent of someone ordering a military strike on Mecca or the Vatican.

 

[tumbleweed41]

In defence, this was after she had ordered the Indian Army to storm the Golden Temple in Amritsar; the rough equivalent of someone ordering a military strike on Mecca or the Vatican.

Oh, unlike the author of the OP, I am not placing blame on any one group or philosophy.

 

[Autodidact]

Answer my post mam. Where the hell do atheists get off making unsubstantiated claims? You want to put a believer on the rack but when the tables are turned you present nothing.

What unsubstantiated claim?

It is an attack on faith when you say that there is all the killing in the name of God when the fact is God has not got much to do with it. People do. People are sadistic and murderous. We all have it in us God or not.

I've never said all. What I say, and stand by, is that religionists kill other people in the name of God quite frequently, and have always done so. Do you deny this? If so I'll be happy to provide you with a few zillion instances.

Of course God has nothing to do with it; there is no God. Bada bing. It's people's belief in God that causes them to kill in His name.

 

[Wotan]

"It's people's belief in God that causes them to kill in His name.'

I am always perplexed by theist apparent inability to grasp this simple distinction.

It is NOT "god" that is the problem. It is the BELIEF in "god."

The "I am right absolutely right w/o possibility of error RIGHT. What MY religion teaches is THE Truth, the ONLY Truth and the COMPLETE Truth.

What YOU believe is nonsense and error or Evil. And YOU had best abandon it or we believers will have to take certain steps to see that you DO."

THAT is the attitude that is the problem.

 

[Archer]

Nice. Did you read what you linked to?

How Many Have Been Killed by Communists in the Name of Atheism & Secularism?:

None, probably. How can that be? After all, millions and millions of people died in Russia and China under communist governments — and those governments were both secular and atheistic. So weren't all of those people killed because of atheism — even in the name of atheism and secularism? No, that conclusion does not follow. Atheism itself isn't a principle, cause, philosophy, or belief system which people fight, die, or kill for. Being by an atheist is no more being killed in the name of atheism than being killed by a tall person is being killed in the name of tallness. Communists Don't Kill in the Name of Atheism...

Atheists are Intolerant for Criticizing Religion, Theism:

There are several myths here, all tightly intertwined for the apparent purpose of getting atheists to cease making uncomfortable and unwelcome criticisms of religion and theism. Religious believers, mostly Christians, are responding to atheistic critiques of religion by claiming that vocal, unapologetic atheists are analogous to religious terrorists and that criticism of religion is a form of religious intolerance. The implication is that believers shouldn't have to be faced with criticism. This is wrong: religion and theism aren't owed any deference or respect. Criticism of Religion & Theism is Not Intolerance...

Many associate atheism with anti-social and even criminal behavior, but such assertions are usually little more than that: bare assertions without substantiating evidence or arguments. The most people offer may be question-begging claims about religion and god being necessary for moral behavior. Here, however, we have a new twist which claims that there is a physiological, biological reason behind people - or at least men - rejecting religion and gods. Unfortunately, it's rife with flaws.

(BTW, Austin Cline and I are old chat buddies from over ten years ago.)

Well it is well done but no numbers. The links point to the millions killed as well.

Even if you take the stand that atheism is not a religion you still need consider these were Atheistic entities doing the killing.

I just think it is closer to religion than atheists care to admit.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Well it is well done but no numbers. The links point to the millions killed as well.

Even if you take the stand that atheism is not a religion you still need consider these were Atheistic entities doing the killing.

I just think it is closer to religion than atheists care to admit.

I fully admit that communism is a full-fledged religion. Hence, why it can manipulate so many into religious fervor. Of course, atheism isn't a religion. That's just moronic.

 

[tumbleweed41]

Well it is well done but no numbers. The links point to the millions killed as well.

Even if you take the stand that atheism is not a religion you still need consider these were Atheistic entities doing the killing.

I just think it is closer to religion than atheists care to admit.

I will ask again...

Did you read what you linked too?

 

[DeitySlayer]

you still need consider these were Atheistic entities doing the killing.

Strangely enough, I also notice that there was an overwhelming majority of black-haired entities in that list.

Archer-style reasoning leads me to believe that having black hair is a religion, and that black-haired people are predisposed to pyschopathic murder, despite there being no demonstrable link between black hair and the murders themselves.

 

[tumbleweed41]

Face it Archer. Your flimsy link between atheism and violence is falling apart right in front of you, but you refuse to acknowledge it.

You started out this thread whining about feeling persecuted as a believer, and then went off on this atheism tangent. Why do you feel the need to pull atheism down to your level of 'belief'. Does it make you feel better if you can call atheists 'religious' so that they are playing in the same field as you?

 

[babaghanoush]

I have absolutely no problem with people believing in one religion or another. However, I do have a problem when their specific beliefs are pushed onto me. Specifically, those beliefs that I find atrocious (gay marriage, abortion, "creationism"). When my gay friend cannot have the same rights as me and my other straight friends, then I have a problem. When a relative is raped and impregnated and cannot have an abortion, then I have a problem. When people are trying to get creationism taught in SCIENCE classes and put into SCIENCE textbooks, then I have a problem.

 

[DeitySlayer]

Archer, this thread has been going for 28 pages, and you have yet to demonstrate that atheism leads to murder. All you have shown is that the majority of dictators in the 20th century were atheist. So what? The majority also had black hair.

 

[Wotan]

Archer, this thread has been going for 28 pages, and you have yet to demonstrate that atheism leads to murder. All you have shown is that the majority of dictators in the 20th century were atheist. So what? The majority also had black hair.

But consider: 100% of them drank milk as children. Now there's a correlation for you.

 

[Autodidact]

Strangely enough, I also notice that there was an overwhelming majority of black-haired entities in that list.

Archer-style reasoning leads me to believe that having black hair is a religion, and that black-haired people are predisposed to pyschopathic murder, despite there being no demonstrable link between black hair and the murders themselves.

What all those killers have in common is being male. Therefore being male is the most dangerous religion on the planet.

 

[logician]

Archer, this thread has been going for 28 pages, and you have yet to demonstrate that atheism leads to murder. All you have shown is that the majority of dictators in the 20th century were atheist. So what? The majority also had black hair.

Hitler was Christian, I believe he was he worst.

 

[Madhuri]

What all those killers have in common is being male. Therefore being male is the most dangerous religion on the planet.

Not exactly a false statement...

 

[linwood]

Why is it a constant believer bashing around here?

Why? Are you looking for understanding of what is incomprehensible to you?
Are you missing something in your life and feel that you must make others like you?

I have heard religion blamed for everything but the people are individuals and think for themselves. I say dont blame the faith or the believers just take it out on the individuals.

Please explain to me why the constant attack on religion.

The name of the forum you just posted this OP in is "General Religious Debates".

 

[MysticSang'ha]

If it would make you feel better, you could always start a thread questioning the morality of karma, or the validity of the story of Siddhartha, or whether there is such a thing as rebirth, or even if you want to challenge the patriarchy, homophobia, or xenophobia present in some of the Buddhist cultures and/or schools of thought.

Would that help?

 

[Archer]

I will ask again...

Did you read what you linked too?

Yes I did and that is one reason I posted it. I am not going to split hairs over whether I believe atheism is a religion or not because I do believe it exhibits some of the same traits and your God is youeself.

This is my point, from that article:

Whether theism can be slightly more culpable than atheism is a matter of dispute. Not being any belief at all, atheism can't motivate anyone in any direction to do anything. Theism is a belief, however, so at least the potential for some sort of motivation in some direction exists. It's been argued, for example, that monotheism is inherently more prone to violence because of the way it tends to be exclusivist — unlike polytheism, which tends to be more tolerant of cultural and religious differences.
It's difficult to say, though, how many of these problems are really inherent in the type of theism and how many are cultural products of the religious belief systems that incorporate them. Whatever culpability theism itself might have, it's likely small enough to dismiss, allowing us to treat it and atheism as functionally equal in this context.

Kind of goes along with what I have been trying to say. More have been killed by Atheists though

Atheists need to get off it. Humans are at fault the killers will kill with or without God. The difference is some need a scape goat, God.