Top 10 reasons why Jesus Christ Isn't God

[Godobeyer]

Not sure if you will understand this spiritual concept.
If you walk by religious laws then you will also be in bondage.
If you tell a kid not to do something then it becomes a resistance and a temptation to the kid to be obedient if he obeys out of the law.If he obeys out of love then he is free to choose whether to be obedient or not without the resistance of the law.Those who walk in love walk above the law and are not in bondage to its resistance.
When your sins are forgiven and you walk in the love of Christ than you are free from the law of sin and death.

All the Muslims love Jesus (pbuh) , you know what , (i know that they tried to killed him )
and i know that Jesus did not die , because God saved him .

but if we suppose that He gonna killed :
but believe me if i was there i would defend for him , and i don't let him die , until i die . did his believers die to help/defend for him ?

don't tell me that you love Jesus (pbuh) more than us .

remark
and as i know you believe that Jesus (pbuh) die for the Original sin

 

[Wotan]

look sister , if you test it , take serieux muslim to magician using the Satan/infidel Jiny , then the Muslim read the Quran before the meeting (of magician)
there are two possibility :
1- the magician accept the meeting with the muslim ==== that mean i am wrong and i just put the lies here

2- the magician did accept the meeting with the muslim === that mean the Quran effect to the Satan/infidel Jiny , the Quran disable the work of the infidel Jiny

Notice that the magician did not know you , and did not know that the Muslim read the Quran before the meeting .

Your "test" is silly. There is NO Satan/Jiny thing creature spirit whatever you imagine.
There are magicians who are skilled at creating illusions. That's it. An illusion. Nothing more.

You don't really BELIEVE the rabbit materialized in that hat?

Or maybe you DO.

 

[Godobeyer]

I'm not, I'm the opposite side of the world, pretty much. I'm closer to you than I am to India.

sorry i guess you from india, and you are there

I don't believe in Satan or jinn.

again , i don't know that you don't believe

Importantly: How do you know that they are using Satan/infidel jinn? They could easily, after all, claim that the magicians are using the true jinn, and using the reading of Quran is the Satanic/evil force--this doesn't mean it is, now, does it? All that it would be is insulting someone for having a different belief, which I don't approve of people doing.

because they could know your name , or your family name and your future , and hide secrets to easy , and using the Jiny to do tasks to someone (you hate) or (you love)

The christians and the jews hate the Quran because it did not according what their beliefs , for that they called it Satanic book

I have a more.. secular view of most "magicians": conmen. No Satan, spirits, demons, jinn, gods, or angels are required. Most of it is sleight of hand, illusions, and guesswork, generally preying on people who are gullible. Others, although technically conmen, may give a natural remedy to cure "a curse" which may aid one in getting better. I don't see any of them as truthful or having magic/demonic/angelic/supernatural powers though, so why would I cost myself money to go see one? Unless you pay for me to visit one, that is.

there are two kind of magicians , who using the Satan/infidel Jiny , and who did not use it , just hand talent (or something like that)

What good would taking a "good Muslim man" with me to the magician and making him read the Quran beforehand?

yes few minutes before the meeting , and read with low sound or inside the heart

Will the magician not be able to summon his jinn (for the sake of argument that they exist)?

yes ,you correct the magician would not able to use infidel jiny /Satan,if the muslim got room meeting

What if the magician does summon his jinn or cast spells or something?

i don't understand your point here

Then it must be the fault of the Muslim for not being good/pious enough to stop the entities with his Quran recitaton, yes? Or would it be something else, like this magician was not using Satan/jinn to help him?

yes, It perfered to take with you pious Muslim man

that mean that he is not magician , he is just hustler/wind-cheater .

 

[Breathe]

sorry i guess you from india, and you are there

I'm not from India, though.

again , i don't know that you don't believe

Hindus don't believe in Satan nor jinn.

because they could know your name , or your family name and your future , and hide secrets to easy , and using the Jiny to do tasks to someone (you hate) or (you love)

They could claim that they were using good "jinn" (or something else) and that Muslims were the evil ones. It doesn't make it any more right or wrong, now, does it? So why would I, or another, believe that they were using evil jinn/Satan jinn, as opposed to them knowing who I am through other means?

there are two kind of magicians , who using the Satan/infidel Jiny , and who did not use it , just hand talent (or something like that)

There is only one kind of magician, then: one who fools people, but has no supernatural influence.

i don't understand your point here

I meant: What if I brought a pious Muslim man along with me, and he still managed to do his 'summoning of jinn' to do his bidding (if they existed which I doubt, but for the sake of argument I will say they do in this case)--if the magician can perform his little magic tricks the same as without a Muslim there, then does it mean the Muslim is not pious?

that mean that he is not magician , he is just hustler/wind-cheater .

You make the mistake of separating the two.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

there are magician (used the Satan in every where) , We (7 persons) used this test with one of them ,one of us (7 persons) read the Quran (few moment before to got in the house of the magician ) He (the magician ) asked who read Quran to stop and don't let him got in , in his house !!!!

Why the magician , choose that man to don't enter ?!!!

the magician who used the Satan(infidel Jiny ) would never let you got in his house,because the Satan would gone.(the satan would leave the magician )

I've got another theory... let me know what you think of it:

- there's some sort of history between you and this "magician" that caused you to decide he was a "magician". I think this is a reasonable assumption, since you must have had some reason to conclude that he was a magician in the first place.

- you don't get along with this guy. At worst, you and he (or maybe your friend and he) have had actual altercations; at best, you and he simply don't associate with each other. After all, you don't strike me as the sort of person who'd be friendly with a servant of Satan.

- when you went to visit this guy, your visit wasn't one of a friend; instead, he considered you either a stranger or an enemy.

Now... do you invite strangers or enemies into your home?

 

[Godobeyer]

I've got another theory... let me know what you think of it:

- there's some sort of history between you and this "magician" that caused you to decide he was a "magician". I think this is a reasonable assumption, since you must have had some reason to conclude that he was a magician in the first place.

- you don't get along with this guy. At worst, you and he (or maybe your friend and he) have had actual altercations; at best, you and he simply don't associate with each other. After all, you don't strike me as the sort of person who'd be friendly with a servant of Satan.

- when you went to visit this guy, your visit wasn't one of a friend; instead, he considered you either a stranger or an enemy.

Now... do you invite strangers or enemies into your home?

i guess you misunderstand the situation ,
i have the to you one question , the magician recieve all the world , it's his work
what enemy and what stranger , you talking about !!!!

 

[Godobeyer]

I'm not from India, though.


Hindus don't believe in Satan nor jinn.


They could claim that they were using good "jinn" (or something else) and that Muslims were the evil ones. It doesn't make it any more right or wrong, now, does it? So why would I, or another, believe that they were using evil jinn/Satan jinn, as opposed to them knowing who I am through other means?

good claim , ok let go pray the infidel Jiny/Satan , and the magician is his prophet lol

There is only one kind of magician, then: one who fools people, but has no supernatural influence.

i told you that there is two sorts , one use the infidel jiny/satan and one don't (only fools people and steal their money),it's not my problem that you don't believe in the first one

I meant: What if I brought a pious Muslim man along with me, and he still managed to do his 'summoning of jinn' to do his bidding (if they existed which I doubt, but for the sake of argument I will say they do in this case)--if the magician can perform his little magic tricks the same as without a Muslim there, then does it mean the Muslim is not pious?

in the most cases the magician would not let the pious muslim got in his house , why i told you pious because , he is so close to god, and pray god , and God protect him from the satan/infidel jiny

You make the mistake of separating the two.

you know that the english is not my first language

 

[Godobeyer]

Your "test" is silly. There is NO Satan/Jiny thing creature spirit whatever you imagine.
There are magicians who are skilled at creating illusions. That's it. An illusion. Nothing more.

You don't really BELIEVE the rabbit materialized in that hat?

Or maybe you DO.

Your picture show us that there is a magician carry a stick lol

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

i guess you misunderstand the situation ,
i have the to you one question , the magician recieve all the world , it's his work
what enemy and what stranger , you talking about !!!!

Okay... let's back up a bit.

How do you know that this person is a magician? What did you learn or what did you see that convinced you that he is a magician?

 

[Breathe]

good claim , ok let go pray the infidel Jiny/Satan , and the magician is his prophet lol

:areyoucra

i told you that there is two sorts , one use the infidel jiny/satan and one don't (only fools people and steal their money),it's not my problem that you don't believe in the first one

Why would I believe in it, though? I don't see anything magical in what these people do, nor do I believe in Satan or jinn. If I was going to believe that there were people who cold do it through supernatural means, why would I think that it could be from another religion as opposed to my own?

in the most cases the magician would not let the pious muslim got in his house , why i told you pious because , he is so close to god, and pray god , and God protect him from the satan/infidel jiny

Forgive me for being doubtful of this claim, but I can understand your opinion on this.

you know that the english is not my first language

It's fine, I understand you.

 

[Godobeyer]

:areyoucra


Why would I believe in it, though? I don't see anything magical in what these people do, nor do I believe in Satan or jinn. If I was going to believe that there were people who cold do it through supernatural means, why would I think that it could be from another religion as opposed to my own?


Forgive me for being doubtful of this claim, but I can understand your opinion on this.



It's fine, I understand you.

brother , I feel that you close to understand my point very well , except you don't believe that some magicians use the infidel Jiny/Satan . it's experience thing , no one could believe until he go to the magician , and magician told you secrets about your life , or things to come , or use his Jiny to let some one love you , or some one hate some , ....you could not believe this until you have this experience by your self .

accautly the Islam and Christianity and Judiasm believe in Jiny and angels , but i don't know if they (the christians, jews) believe that the magician can use the jiny or not

i want to some one (christian or jewish) confirme this or deny it :
Solomon used the Jiny , but I guess Moses met the magicians ,and they fought him by the magic front of Phoaroh , and Adam and Eve spoke with Satan in the paradise .

 

[javajo]

look brother , ELohim is hebrew plural of God, it's not mean that God is plural , it's used for the glory/holy the God , ask any jewish would tell you this , him is sign of plural , but some times used for glory , as exactly the arabic .




look brother i guess you don't understand my point , i know all this , my question is
how Jesus (pbuh) get back to Paul,Mark.....etc , but He did not said in the new testement that He would comeback to give the inspirations to authors ?!!!


because the verses of the Comfort is a show that Jesus (pbuh) would never comeback soon , until God sent the Comfort .


look brother i will explain to you my dates for eg:
if we suppose that :Jesus (pbuh) said to his friends that He will go to God , than God send the Comfort == at 30 AD ok? that mean Jesus (pbuh) would never comeback (until the Comfort come )
after one years Jesus (pbuh) raise to God ok ?
When Jesus told his friend that He would go to god , and then God sent Comfort , that mean the mission of Jesus (pbuh) is end, at his raise to God exactly at 31 AD. (die as you believe)


Jesus (pbuh) came to inspire Mark at 65
Jesus (pbuh) came to inspire John at 80–95
Jeuss (pbuh) came to inspire Matthew at 63
Jesus (pbuh) came to inspire Luke to 80-90
Jesus (pbuh) came to inspire Paul

counter how many times Jesus (pbuh) as you believe comeback ? at least 5 times ok
this is great contradiction : He told his friend that He go to god , then he will sent the Comfort , then He came back to inspire !!!!!

inspire who Paul/Saul one of His enemies , and maybe the other authors also never saw Jesus (in their life)

John, Paul and Mark were inspired by the Holy Spirit to write their letters. Jesus said in John 14: These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

John was "in the Spirit" when he was given the revelation. In Revelation John said: The Holy Spirit took complete control of me on the Lord's Day. I heard a loud voice behind me that sounded like a trumpet. The voice said, "Write on a scroll what you see.

Paul had a unique encounter with Christ, not on earth as a man, but in the air as a blinding light. Just as Christians will be caught up and will meet Christ in the air prior to the Seven Year Tribulation, after which Christ actually will come to the earth, splitting the mount of olives in two, coming in power and glory as King of King and Lord of Lords.

 

[Godobeyer]

John, Paul and Mark were inspired by the Holy Spirit to write their letters. Jesus said in John 14: These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

John was "in the Spirit" when he was given the revelation. In Revelation John said: The Holy Spirit took complete control of me on the Lord's Day. I heard a loud voice behind me that sounded like a trumpet. The voice said, "Write on a scroll what you see.

Paul had a unique encounter with Christ, not on earth as a man, but in the air as a blinding light. Just as Christians will be caught up and will meet Christ in the air prior to the Seven Year Tribulation, after which Christ actually will come to the earth, splitting the mount of olives in two, coming in power and glory as King of King and Lord of Lords.

Paul of Tarsus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Paul's conversion can be dated to 33 - 36[17][18][19] by his reference to it in one of his letters.[9] According to the Acts of the Apostles, his conversion (or metanoia) took place on the road to Damascus where he experienced a vision of the resurrected Jesus after which he was temporarily blinded.[Acts 9:1-31] [22:1-22] [26:9-24] This event is the source of the phrase Pauline conversion.

Paul met Jesus (pbuh) (as He said)

and another eg from :
Gospel of Mark - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Two important themes of Mark are the Messianic Secret and the obtuseness of the disciples. In Mark, Jesus often is guarded regarding aspects of his identity and certain actions.[6] Jesus uses parables to explain his message and fulfill prophecy (4:10-12). At times, the disciples have trouble understanding the parables, but Jesus explains what they mean, in secret (4:13-20, 4:33-34). The disciples also fail to understand the implication of the miracles that he performs before them.[2]

Jesus explain his message not Holy spirit .

 

[javajo]

Jesus explain his message not Holy spirit

Yet Acts 1:2 says: Until the day in which he (Jesus) was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:

Yet Jesus said in John 14: These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

And the Bible says:For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. All scripture is given by inspiration of God (through the Holy Ghost), and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2 Peter 1:21, 2Tim 3:16

but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost. Mark 13:11b

And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied Luke 1:67

I can give so much more scripture that shows that men in both the Old and New Testament were inspired by the Holy Spirit to write scripture. The Old Testament prophet Isaiah, in Isaiah 53 prophesied that Jesus would die bearing our transgressions and would be glorified for it. The New Testament eyewitnesses confirmed this, and Jesus himself said he must die and rise again in fulfillment of Old Testament scripture.

 

[Godobeyer]

Yet Acts 1:2 says: Until the day in which he (Jesus) was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:

Yet Jesus said in John 14: These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

And the Bible says:For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. All scripture is given by inspiration of God (through the Holy Ghost), and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 2 Peter 1:21, 2Tim 3:16

but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost. Mark 13:11b

And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied Luke 1:67

I can give so much more scripture that shows that men in both the Old and New Testament were inspired by the Holy Spirit to write scripture. The Old Testament prophet Isaiah, in Isaiah 53 prophesied that Jesus would die bearing our transgressions and would be glorified for it. The New Testament eyewitnesses confirmed this, and Jesus himself said he must die and rise again in fulfillment of Old Testament scripture.

I know that the (angel of God) Holy spirit was the middle between God and Jesus (pbuh)

look brother to avoid to explain , i can sure that you give me all the verse that contain and relate with Holy spirit , hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
I am very very clear , i give argument you should explian it , (it) , and if you add more infos about HS i don't mind .

the road to Damascus where he experienced a vision of the resurrected Jesus

you told me before that Paul and the other authors did not met Jesus (pbuh), the met Holy Spirit , this verse of new testement proof that jesus (pbuh) met Paul

Jesus uses parables to explain his message and fulfill prophecy

In this case you are in trouble , in the two cases :

1-the case of Jesus (pbuh) fulfill his message at his friends , that mean He explain also the Gospel (it's fulfill ), He did not need to came back 5 times to compelet his message (to Paul,Mark ...etc)


2- and case that He came back to Paul,Mark, Met ,Luke,John ....because in the Gospel He said that when he will go , he will sent the comfort , (not h'll came back 5 times !!!!)

 

[javajo]

I don't know how to explain it more than I have. Its not the same as the 2nd Coming. It is in a different sense, as in a vision. Like Moses and the burning bush. He did not actually see God, but a manifestation. John was in the Spirit caught up in a vision, Jesus did not actually come to earth and sit down with him. God uses the Holy Spirit to bring to remembrance and to share his revelation of what he wants the authors to write down. That is what I believe. The Holy Spirit lives in every one who has trusted Jesus that he paid for our sins and gave us his righteousness in place of our own which is no good to a holy God. Then God the Holy Spirit lives in our heart, seals us so we always have eternal life, and he also guides us and empowers us to tell the Gospel and live right, and so much more.

 

[Godobeyer]

I don't know how to explain it more than I have.

1-that's mean i am right when i considere it a contradiction ,
2-your mother language is the english , you could not explain , what's about me ?!!!)

-Its not the same as the 2nd Coming. It is in a different sense, as in a vision.

that's mean it's not Holy Spirit who was came as you claimed before !!!!!

Like Moses and the burning bush. He did not actually see God, but a manifestation. John was in the Spirit caught up in a vision, Jesus did not actually come to earth and sit down with him. God uses the Holy Spirit to bring to remembrance and to share his revelation of what he wants the authors to write down. That is what I believe. The Holy Spirit lives in every one who has trusted Jesus that he paid for our sins and gave us his righteousness in place of our own which is no good to a holy God. Then God the Holy Spirit lives in our heart, seals us so we always have eternal life, and he also guides us and empowers us to tell the Gospel and live right, and so much more.

God uses (Holy Spirit ) wooooooooow , God uses another God good claim ,

look brother : the Bible said :that Jesus (pbuh) explained and his message and fulfill his prophecy at this life ,to his friends , explain to me how He came 5 times after his rise to God , if He already explain his message (to his friends and believers...) !!!!

you would not understand my point until you open your mind with me ,
the Bible said that Jesus (pbuh) explain to his message to friends and He fulfill his prophecy ....it's over He did not need to came 5 more times to re-explain his message (to Paul,Mark,John...etc)

 

[atanu]

you told me before that Paul and the other authors did not met Jesus (pbuh), the met Holy Spirit , this verse of new testement proof that jesus (pbuh) met Paul

In this case you are in trouble , in the two cases :

1-the case of Jesus (pbuh) fulfill his message at his friends , that mean He explain also the Gospel (it's fulfill ), He did not need to came back 5 times -------

Hello Godobeyer

Why was then another revelation through Muhammad necessary?

 

[atanu]

I don't know how to explain it more than I have. Its not the same as the 2nd Coming. It is in a different sense, as in a vision. Like Moses and the burning bush. He did not actually see God, but a manifestation. John was in the Spirit caught up in a vision, Jesus did not actually come to earth and sit down with him. God uses the Holy Spirit to bring to remembrance and to share his revelation of what he wants the authors to write down. That is what I believe. The Holy Spirit lives in every one who has trusted Jesus that he paid for our sins and gave us his righteousness in place of our own which is no good to a holy God. Then God the Holy Spirit lives in our heart, seals us so we always have eternal life, and he also guides us and empowers us to tell the Gospel and live right, and so much more.

Hello javajo (jaggin?)

The problem, IMO, is because, we restrict Holy spirit with our minds -- just as the above sentence in blue indicates.

Peace

 

[Godobeyer]

Hello Godobeyer

Why was then another revelation through Muhammad necessary?

the revelationof the Quran at the same person (prophet Muhammad pbuh) at the same time/age ,it's not like the revelation of the bible at many persons (authors of the New testement ) in diferent ages/times