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Trump is losing the debate acting like a raving lunatic

Clizby Wampuscat

Well-Known Member
So easy to say, isn't it? You buy something made in, say, Canada and the sticker price is $100. Then you add the 10% tariff, which is $10, which the purchaser pays (Canada doesn't pay it). The result is, you pay $110.

So different from a sales tax, where you buy something for $100, and with a 10% sales tax, you would add $10, which the purchaser pays. The result is, you pay $110.

Oh, wait -- don't those look remarkably similar?
I have said many time a tariff can increase prices on certain products, a national sales tax increased prices on all goods.
Let's look at it another way. Let's put 30% tariffs on, say, French and Italian wines -- in order to help California vintners thrive. So, you drive the purchase price in the U.S. for a bottle of a a good cabernet sauvignon to $30. Meanwhile, an equivalent from a California vinyard is selling at $16. Well, what sort of behavior do you think you might be encouraging -- isn't it likely the California seller is likely to take advantage of market forces and raise his price, so to something closer to $20? Now, that's still cheaper than the French wine, but it is also inflationary -- in fact, it's a 25% increase!

And that is another truth about what tariffs actually do.
I never argued against this. So why did Biden/Harris keep tariffs in place? They are in charge now, why don't they remove them?
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
No, a tariff is not on all products,
All products from China, which is a massive number of products.
a national sales tax is. That is a big difference.
It's is a national tax on all tariffed products, so no different. It's never been claimed to be a national sales tax on ALL products sold. Call it a fee if that makes you feel better. It is an added financial cost that the government collects, just like a sales tax.

Nice try to deflect and misrepresent.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
I have said many time a tariff can increase prices on certain products,
Tariffs DO increase the cost of the selected products.
a national sales tax increased prices on all goods.
Only in the false context you are trying to create. Harris never said tariffs will add cost to all products. The national sals tax ONLY referred to those products that the tariffs added costs to, nothing else. Nice atempt to misrepresent. Remember, tariffs are NATIONAL since imports apply to the category of products being brought into the USA for sale.
I never argued against this. So why did Biden/Harris keep tariffs in place? They are in charge now, why don't they remove them?
For the third time, they kept tariffs in place for imports of products that are made in the USA for a higher cost. The tariffs make the cheaper imports equal in cost so that the American made products can be financially competitive. Does it make sense now? Or are you going to remain deliberately confused and ask again?
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
Again, a tariff does not apply to all products, a national sales tax does.
Already explained. The national sales tax is ONLY on those items with tariffs.
I disagree. I think that is media and the dems telling you this. If you listen to his interviews he has substance and can talk about issues off the cuff. harris cannot do that.
You are becomming more MAGA. Trump is clearly disturbed, as we all saw in his debate performce, and in other video clips. Trump might be able to make an occassional stable comment, but those rare examples get massively offset by his disgusting racist lies. You must not be seeing his disturbed racist rants. He;s been debunked, but as we know Trump does not care about facts and reality, only that he gets attention. Voters like yourself remain committed to him, and deny he is declining.
I never said it wasn't like a tax, I said it is not a national sales tax.
Yet tariffs apply nationally. So WTF? Are you really this confused?
 

Argentbear

Well-Known Member
Again, a tariff does not apply to all products, a national sales tax does.

I disagree. I think that is media and the dems telling you this. If you listen to his interviews he has substance and can talk about issues off the cuff. harris cannot do that.
evidence from the debate sys otherwise
 

We Never Know

No Slack
If a voter can't recognize the threat that Trump is, and poses for the future, they might be merely ignorant or MAGA (I argue that MAGA is ignorant as well, but have emotionally committed to the dogma). But in any regards their support for the criminal candidate reveals flawed thinking. Trump was rejected in 2012 in the republican primary, which showed good sense among conservatives as they selected Romney. But each election cycle since has seen Trump getting more disturbed, more extreme, and less fit, but more attractive to the conservative voter. The voters who support him are not making a sound and rational decision. Their judgment is flawed and being guided by emotions. The growing list of former Trump officials, and republicans who support Harris, can articulate their reasoning to oppose Trump. It doesn't seem to influence the average conservative voter. That suggets Trump supporters are committed emotionally, not rationally.

I've heard undecided voters interviewed and most every one seems poorly informed and unsure why Trump is in legal trouble. What I wonder is how they can't understand why he's in legal trouble when there is literally hundreds of reputable articles by reputable news agencies reporting on it, and stories available for free on the internet. To my mind these are lazy thinkers who lack any understanding that they need to extend effort to inform themselves, and only from reputable sources. These undecided voters are so frustrating to listen to because their dilemma is so easily solved by reading. One guy explained how concerned he was about the headlines he's seen about Trump, and turned off by things he's said in video clips, yada yada yada, but then concluded that he was leaning towrds voting for Trump. Jesus, this guy spent 45 seconds explaining why Trump is not a good candidate, but then admitted that he might vote for him anyway.

Ask a person why they won't vote for Harris and the usual answer is I don't like dems and/or their platform. That's politics.

Ask a person why they won't vote for Trump and the usual answer is I don't like Trump or I hate Trump. That's emotion.
 

Ebionite

Well-Known Member
evidence from the debate sys otherwise
Wrong.

While Kamala did not receive the exact question the moderators asked, she allegedly received sample questions so she’d know generally what to expect.

 

Clizby Wampuscat

Well-Known Member
All products from China, which is a massive number of products.

It's is a national tax on all tariffed products, so no different. It's never been claimed to be a national sales tax on ALL products sold. Call it a fee if that makes you feel better. It is an added financial cost that the government collects, just like a sales tax.

Nice try to deflect and misrepresent.
Just stop. I never misrepresented anything. I even agreed tariffs can increase costs. They are objectively not a national sales tax. You told me I was scum anyway so I guess we are done.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
Because Trump was fact checked constantly and Harris was not even though she was blatantly lying. Like I have been saying, even I knew when she was lying so certainly the mods did.
Not "constantly." About three times. As already pointed out by several posters along with the apparent reason why.
I am not going to go through the entire transcript of the debate again, or google whatever again. Knock yourself out if that's what you like.
Then quit making claims you can't back up.
 

Pogo

Well-Known Member
Again, a tariff does not apply to all products, a national sales tax does.
There is no national sales tax on all products except there are taxes on some products like 18.4 cents per gallon on gasoline.
Oops blew that one didn't you.
I disagree. I think that is media and the dems telling you this. If you listen to his interviews he has substance and can talk about issues off the cuff. harris cannot do that.

I never said it wasn't like a tax, I said it is not a national sales tax.
First definition of a tax:
a compulsory contribution to state revenue, levied by the government on workers' income and business profits, or added to the cost of some goods, services, and transactions.
"higher taxes will dampen consumer spending"


In this case it is added to the cost of the goods imported from a given country. That it is not added at time of sale to the end user does not make it not a tax.
In fact, a tariff is a type of tax.

A tariff is a tax on the import or export of goods between countries. Tariffs are a type of trade barrier that can help regulate foreign trade and protect domestic industries.

Now you understand some more English words.
 

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
I have said many time a tariff can increase prices on certain products, a national sales tax increased prices on all goods.
Not at all. Canada has a national sales tax -- and exempt goods include medical equipment, groceries and exports. If you give lessons, such as how to play the piano or guitar, or you provide childcare, you're exempt from collecting and remitting GST/HST. The CRA deems any business with $30,000 or less in revenue to be a small supplier, and they are not required to collect and remit GST/HST
I never argued against this. So why did Biden/Harris keep tariffs in place? They are in charge now, why don't they remove them?
Because some tariffs are useful tools for government use. But Trump is not promising "some." He is promising tariffs on ALL imports, and very high tariffs on ALL imports from China.

Face it, the U.S. does not manufacture everything that its citizens buy, so everything in that category would go up. When the U.S. becomes self-sufficient (or nearly so) in manufacturing computer chips, it may well be a good idea to impose tariffs on imports -- but until then, it would increase the cost of absolutely everything that has a chip (or many chips).
 

We Never Know

No Slack
Yes, I hate rapists. Do you have an affinity for them?

I have no use for rapists.

I also question convictions were there was no witnesses, no physical or scientific evidence used.

You accept his guilt through bias and dislike.

If you were convicted for something based on he said she said, wouldn't you like me to question it, or blindly believe it because I didnt like you?
 
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