outhouse
Atheistically
You do not have a clue what is, or is not credible.
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Was Islam spread by the sword?
- Thread starter ZooGirl02
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You do not have a clue what is, or is not credible.
Again this is a plea to numbers,do you really think only Cristians counted,what about the Sikhs Hindus Homosexuals political prisoners and Gypsies that went through the death camps,Women and Children or don't they count,your appeal to numbers is sad IMO,especially after the quote from your Qur'an that I posted.
It is my opinion that your religion like the proselytising Christians indulge in the same agenda,power corruption and lies,its a human thing check out the Vatican and Saudi Arabia where these practises are the strongest so it is with misery and in plenty,Islam was spread by the sword just like Christianity by hook or by crook,thats an old saying and appropriate IMO.
If that's directed at me then I would say for sure Christianity was spread and enforced by the sword,Islam and Christianity are as you say "frothed with blood" but you could add slavery and freedom of conscience to name just two extras.
outhouse
Atheistically
It factually did not start by the sword.
I started out as Hellenistic Judaism divorcing Judaism. It started out factually peaceful in peoples houses.
While the persecutions of early Christians before 325 CE is steeped in mythology, they were still persecuted.
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
Was Islam spread by the sword?
No.
For example:
Spread of Islam in Burma: [7]
Islam is a minority religion in Burma,[1] practiced by 4% of the population, according to the Myanmar official statistics.[2]
History[edit]
Amarapura[edit]
Muslims in Amarapura were about 20,000 families, at the time of Innwa (Ava) kingdom (1855 AD). Most of them were SunniMuslims. The first mosque in Yangon was built in 1826 AD, at the end of first Anglo-Burmese Wars. It was destroyed in 1852 AD when the British attacked Yangon again.[83]
During the Konbaung dynasty Alaungpaya's attack of Mons near Pyay, Mon warrior Talapan was assisted by Muslim soldiers. Because of their artillery fire, a lot of Burmese soldiers were wounded and died.[98]
In 1755 Alaungpaya conquered Dagon and renamed it Yangon (meaning 'The End of Strife'). Mon soldiers surrendered and four Muslim rich men also surrendered with the expensive presents, ammunitions and four warships.[86] Although conquered Yangon there are more battles to fight with Mons. So Alaungpaya rearranged the army. Pyre Mamet was one of the "Thwe Thauk Gyi" assigned to serve as the Royal Bodyguard.[99] Alaungpaya attacked Thanlyin or Syriam, and many Muslim artillery men were captured.[87]
Alaungpaya captured four warships and Muslim soldiers. They were later allowed to serve him.[88] On the page 203 of the Twin Thin Teik Win's Chronicles of Alaungpaya's battles, it was recorded as only three warships.
After Alaungpaya captured Pegu, and at the parade, those Pathi Muslim soldiers were allowed to march with their traditional uniforms.[100] Four hundred Pathi Indian soldiers participated in the Royal Salute March.[101][102]
King Bodawpaya Bodaw U Wine (Padon Mayor, Padon Min) (17811819) of the Konbaung Dynasty founded Amarapura as his new capital in 1783. He was the first Burmese King who recognized his Muslim subjects officially by the following Royal decree. He appointed Abid Shah Hussaini and assistants, Nga Shwe Lu and Nga Shwe Aye to decide and give judgment regarding the conflicts and problems amongst his Burmese Muslim subjects.[103] Abid Shah Hussaini burial place was well known as a shrine in Amarapura Lin Zin Gone Darga. Before Ramu and Pan War battles, Burmese army had a march.
Among the Burmese army, Captain Nay Myo Gone Narrat Khan Sab Bo's 70 Cavalry (horse) Regiment, was watched by Maha Bandula.[104] Muslim horsemen were famous in that Khan Sab Bo's 70 Cavalry (horse) Regiment. Khan Sab Bo's name was Abdul Karim Khan and was the father of the Captain Wali Khan, famous Wali Khan Cavalry Regiment during King Mindon and King Thibaw. Khan Sab Bo was sent as an Ambassador to Indo China by Bagyidaw. During Bagyidaw's reign, in 1824, Gaw Taut Pallin battle was famous. British used 10,000 soldiers but defeated. During that battle Khan Sab Bo's 100 horsemen fought vigorously and bravely.[105] More than 1300 loyal brave Kala Pyo Muslims (means young Indian soldiers) were awarded with colourful velvety uniforms.[106]
When King Tharrawaddy Min marched to Okkalapa, more than 100 Pathi Muslim Indian cannoners took part.[107] There are also a lot of Muslim soldiers in other parts of the Tharrawaddy Min's army.
But the reign of Pagan Min (184652) there was a blemish in Burmese Muslim history. Amarapura's mayor Bai Sab and his clerk U Pain were arrested and sentenced to death. U Pain was the one who constructed and donated the Taunthaman bridge with more than 1000 teak piles and is still in good condition. Although the real background or aim of building the bridge was not known, before the bridge was built, British Ambassador Arthur Fair's ship could sailed right up to the Amarapura city wall but the bridge actually obstruct the direct access by British.
Islam in Burma - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I don't see any sword in spread of Islam in Burma.
Regards
No.
For example:
Spread of Islam in Burma: [7]
Islam is a minority religion in Burma,[1] practiced by 4% of the population, according to the Myanmar official statistics.[2]
History[edit]
Amarapura[edit]
Muslims in Amarapura were about 20,000 families, at the time of Innwa (Ava) kingdom (1855 AD). Most of them were SunniMuslims. The first mosque in Yangon was built in 1826 AD, at the end of first Anglo-Burmese Wars. It was destroyed in 1852 AD when the British attacked Yangon again.[83]
During the Konbaung dynasty Alaungpaya's attack of Mons near Pyay, Mon warrior Talapan was assisted by Muslim soldiers. Because of their artillery fire, a lot of Burmese soldiers were wounded and died.[98]
In 1755 Alaungpaya conquered Dagon and renamed it Yangon (meaning 'The End of Strife'). Mon soldiers surrendered and four Muslim rich men also surrendered with the expensive presents, ammunitions and four warships.[86] Although conquered Yangon there are more battles to fight with Mons. So Alaungpaya rearranged the army. Pyre Mamet was one of the "Thwe Thauk Gyi" assigned to serve as the Royal Bodyguard.[99] Alaungpaya attacked Thanlyin or Syriam, and many Muslim artillery men were captured.[87]
Alaungpaya captured four warships and Muslim soldiers. They were later allowed to serve him.[88] On the page 203 of the Twin Thin Teik Win's Chronicles of Alaungpaya's battles, it was recorded as only three warships.
After Alaungpaya captured Pegu, and at the parade, those Pathi Muslim soldiers were allowed to march with their traditional uniforms.[100] Four hundred Pathi Indian soldiers participated in the Royal Salute March.[101][102]
King Bodawpaya Bodaw U Wine (Padon Mayor, Padon Min) (17811819) of the Konbaung Dynasty founded Amarapura as his new capital in 1783. He was the first Burmese King who recognized his Muslim subjects officially by the following Royal decree. He appointed Abid Shah Hussaini and assistants, Nga Shwe Lu and Nga Shwe Aye to decide and give judgment regarding the conflicts and problems amongst his Burmese Muslim subjects.[103] Abid Shah Hussaini burial place was well known as a shrine in Amarapura Lin Zin Gone Darga. Before Ramu and Pan War battles, Burmese army had a march.
Among the Burmese army, Captain Nay Myo Gone Narrat Khan Sab Bo's 70 Cavalry (horse) Regiment, was watched by Maha Bandula.[104] Muslim horsemen were famous in that Khan Sab Bo's 70 Cavalry (horse) Regiment. Khan Sab Bo's name was Abdul Karim Khan and was the father of the Captain Wali Khan, famous Wali Khan Cavalry Regiment during King Mindon and King Thibaw. Khan Sab Bo was sent as an Ambassador to Indo China by Bagyidaw. During Bagyidaw's reign, in 1824, Gaw Taut Pallin battle was famous. British used 10,000 soldiers but defeated. During that battle Khan Sab Bo's 100 horsemen fought vigorously and bravely.[105] More than 1300 loyal brave Kala Pyo Muslims (means young Indian soldiers) were awarded with colourful velvety uniforms.[106]
When King Tharrawaddy Min marched to Okkalapa, more than 100 Pathi Muslim Indian cannoners took part.[107] There are also a lot of Muslim soldiers in other parts of the Tharrawaddy Min's army.
But the reign of Pagan Min (184652) there was a blemish in Burmese Muslim history. Amarapura's mayor Bai Sab and his clerk U Pain were arrested and sentenced to death. U Pain was the one who constructed and donated the Taunthaman bridge with more than 1000 teak piles and is still in good condition. Although the real background or aim of building the bridge was not known, before the bridge was built, British Ambassador Arthur Fair's ship could sailed right up to the Amarapura city wall but the bridge actually obstruct the direct access by British.
Islam in Burma - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I don't see any sword in spread of Islam in Burma.
Regards
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
outhouse
Atheistically
And those without education make more then anyone else.
We can agree on that,Humans are quite adept at that.
It factually did not start by the sword.
I started out as Hellenistic Judaism divorcing Judaism. It started out factually peaceful in peoples houses.
While the persecutions of early Christians before 325 CE is steeped in mythology, they were still persecuted.
I don't know how you can say that. Christianity started with the bloody death of Yeshua (Jesus ). Then it continued with the extermination of its followers in Europe. The biggest contributor to the New Testament, Saul who suddenly saw the evil of his ways and became Paul, occupation was to kill Christians. Then when they became the predominate religion in Europe made it their mission to kill Jews and Muslims for not being Christian. Their credo was convert or die. Gee that sounds familiar.
outhouse
Atheistically
Christians did not commit the crime. Romans did. Romans did not advance the religion for over 325 years.
So people killing christians spread it
This is called trying to stop a movement.
it is factually retarding the movement, not spreading it.
Muslims did not exist for the origins of Christianity.
You have a problem understanding origins and beginnings and later issues.
I think you are taking my reply out of context. I'm not getting into an argument about who threw the first stone. I'm merely pointing out the net results. Both religions were spread by the sword. No matter how you dissect my reply you can't escape that fact. Maybe you wanna tell me that the Crusades never happened.
I am not happy that western killed western or muslims killed muslims , i ma just compared between the two history , to tell that the western history is worst if we count .
if i post a fact of history (not lie)about the west,I become automaticaly anti-Westerns ?
is not the credible truth that anti-islam is running like blood inside you ?
you spread hatefull speech against the muslims and you don't accept any critic to the westerns !!!
you called me fanatic , because i just denied your claim about Abrahim (pbuh) and Noah (pbuh) . did not you realize that you the real fanatic one not me ?
outhouse
Atheistically
You purposely take me out of context.
Do you think there is room for improvement in islam?
Why is it so hard for you to see mythology as mythology???
And the fact as mythology, you can still keep your same religion as it is??
outhouse
Atheistically
It is not worse.
We went out and factually defended the world against evil.
How is defending the world bad?
gnostic
The Lost One
Godobeyer said:
Hitler?
I don't think you truly understand at all, godobeyer, that Hitler and the Nazi killing Christians and Jews, had absolutely nothing to do with killing Christians because of their churches or Christianity or killing Jews because of their Judaism.
Nazi Germans killing these people, is far more complex than one person's religion against other religions or other sects. Religion is less of the factor in WW2 than political, social and economical issues.
You would have to look at history of not only the last decade before WW2 began in 1939, but you have to look at history in Germany, before, during and after WW1. You have to look at German history in the last 600 or even more years.
Like the other European kingdoms or nations, before the 20th century, Germany (first with Austria, and later with Prussia) have always to gain more territories through wars and diplomacy.
You would also have to look into the history of Jews living in Europe in those 6 or more centuries.
Briefly looking at Jewish history, Jews didn't have many rights of citizens in the European Christian countries, even they were born in those countries. But they became rich from doing businesses that Christians do not want to do, like banking and finances.
Germany was seriously weakened after their defeat in WW1, politically, socially and economically. Many Germans were living in poverty. There were many minorities living in Germany before either World Wars, among them Jews.
Hitler and the Nazi Party was developed after the WW1, known as the German Workers' Party (Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, or DAP, formed in 1919 and ended the following year).
- This DAP didn't like minorities, so SOCIALLY, they had anti-Semitic sentiment, just like the Nazi party. Racism existed before the Nazi party was formed, their racism against Jews had been fermenting well before the Nazi,formed in 1920, or even the DAP.
The Germans' sentiments against Jews was not because they were anti-Jews ethnically, and not because they were anti-Judaism. I am quite sure you have heard of Nazi ideology of the "Aryan master race" or the Nordic superiority.
And Jews weren't the only minority they were against. They were against blacks, Romani, gays, anyone who were physically or mentally disabled. - ECONOMICALLY, the party and followers didn't like minorities taking jobs that think only "pure" Germans deserved, like the Nazi party. They didn't think minorities deserve to have wealth.
And the Germans didn't like how France and Britain recovered after WW1, while Germany had only stagnated. - POLITICALLY (as well as SOCIALLY), again they (Germans) think they were superior to the non-German people, and believed that minorities have or should have no rights in their country, just like the Nazi party.
They were also anti-Communism or anti-Marxism, just like the Nazi party. The German nationalists fought against fellow Germans who advocated for communism.
All of these factors were what made Nazi what they were, and why WW2 began in the first place.
Germany was economically in poverty, after WW1. They were suffering from economical depression, a decade before the US Great Depression that began in 1929.
So killing Jews during the 30s and 40s were because of racism, and blaming Jews for having more wealth than the Germans.
Why do you think Germans rounded up Jews and placed them in concentration camps, torturing them, experimenting on them or gasing them?
It is not because of Judaism, but because they were not true Germans, and because they gained a lot of wealth by looting Jews. And they had attacking neighboring and what were majority Christians, like France, Britain, Poland, etc, because of political and economical powers can be gained by annexing territories and looting their wealth. Nothing make more money than wars (unless, your country is defeated).
It is not as black-and-white as you make it to be, godobeyer. The issues of why the Nazi killed Christians and Jews had little to do with their religions, and unless you recognized that, you are generalizing.
paarsurrey
Veteran Member
Was Islam spread by the sword?
No.
For example:
Spread of Islam in Burma: [8]
Islam is a minority religion in Burma,[1] practiced by 4% of the population, according to the Myanmar official statistics.[2]
History[edit]
Demographics[edit]
Islam, mainly of the Sunni sect, is practiced by 4% of the population of Burma according to the government census. However, according to the U.S. State Department's 2006 international religious freedom report, the country's non-Buddhist populations were underestimated in the census. Muslim leaders estimate that between 14% and 20% of the population may be Muslim.[116]
Various groups of Burmese Muslims
• Muslims are spread across the country in small communities. The Indian-descended Muslims live mainly in Rangoon. See Burmese Indian Muslims.
• The Rohingya are a minority Muslim ethnic group in Northern Rakhine State, Western Burma. The Rohingya population is mostly concentrated in five northern townships of Rakhine State: Maungdaw, Buthidaung, Rathedaung, Akyab, Sandway, Tongo, Shokepro, Rashong Island and Kyauktaw.
• Panthay, Burmese Chinese Muslims.
• Muslims of Malay ancestry in Kawthaung. People of Malay ancestry are locally called Pashu regardless of religion.
• Zerbadi Muslims are descendent community of intermarriages between foreign Muslim (South Asian and Middle Eastern) males and Burmese females.[117]
• Kamein
Religion and society[edit]
Official policy[edit]
The stated official policy of the government of Burma is that all ethnic, religious, and language groups in Burma are equal. The Lordship of the Supreme Court of Rangoon remarked: "Today, in the various parts of Burma, there are people who, because of the origin and the isolated way of life, are totally unlike the Burmese in appearance of speak of events which had occurred outside the limits of their habitation.
They are nevertheless statutory citizens under the Union (of Burma) Citizenship Act..... Thus mere race or appearance of a person or whether he has a knowledge of any language of the Union is not the test as to whether he is a citizen of the Union".[118] Additionally, in 2005, the Ministry of Religious Affairs issued a declaration concerning freedom of religion:
All ethnic groups in Myanmar have been throughout the country since time immemorial. They have been living united in peace and harmony since the time of ancient Myanmar kings. Myanmar kings, in return, looked after the members of other religious faiths by kindly giving them religious, social and economic opportunities equal to those awarded to Buddhists. It is well known that, to enable his Majesty's royal servants to fulfill their religious duties, Rakhine frame Mosque, Half-broken Mosque, Panthe Mosque, Mandalay Battery Ward Mosque and Christian Churches were allowed to be built and to perform respective religious duties during successive Myanmar kings.
The Parton of the Fifth Buddhist Synod, King Mindone (1854 to 1878), during his rule built Peacock rest house in the Holy City of Mecca, for the Muslims from Myanmar who went there on Hajj pilgrimage to stay comfortably while they were there for about one and a half months. That act was one of the best testimonies in Myanmar history of how Myanmar kings looked after their Muslim subjects benevolently.
Since the time of ancient Myanmar kings until the present day, successive Myanmar governments have given all four major religions an equal treatment. All the followers of each religion have been allowed to profess their respective religious faith and perform their respective duties freely. Myanmar's culture is based on loving kindness; the followers of Islam, Christianity and Hinduism in Myanmar are also kind-hearted people as Myanmar Buddhists are.[97]
Islam in Burma - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I don't see any sword in spread of Islam in Burma.
Regards
No.
For example:
Spread of Islam in Burma: [8]
Islam is a minority religion in Burma,[1] practiced by 4% of the population, according to the Myanmar official statistics.[2]
History[edit]
Demographics[edit]
Islam, mainly of the Sunni sect, is practiced by 4% of the population of Burma according to the government census. However, according to the U.S. State Department's 2006 international religious freedom report, the country's non-Buddhist populations were underestimated in the census. Muslim leaders estimate that between 14% and 20% of the population may be Muslim.[116]
Various groups of Burmese Muslims
• Muslims are spread across the country in small communities. The Indian-descended Muslims live mainly in Rangoon. See Burmese Indian Muslims.
• The Rohingya are a minority Muslim ethnic group in Northern Rakhine State, Western Burma. The Rohingya population is mostly concentrated in five northern townships of Rakhine State: Maungdaw, Buthidaung, Rathedaung, Akyab, Sandway, Tongo, Shokepro, Rashong Island and Kyauktaw.
• Panthay, Burmese Chinese Muslims.
• Muslims of Malay ancestry in Kawthaung. People of Malay ancestry are locally called Pashu regardless of religion.
• Zerbadi Muslims are descendent community of intermarriages between foreign Muslim (South Asian and Middle Eastern) males and Burmese females.[117]
• Kamein
Religion and society[edit]
Official policy[edit]
The stated official policy of the government of Burma is that all ethnic, religious, and language groups in Burma are equal. The Lordship of the Supreme Court of Rangoon remarked: "Today, in the various parts of Burma, there are people who, because of the origin and the isolated way of life, are totally unlike the Burmese in appearance of speak of events which had occurred outside the limits of their habitation.
They are nevertheless statutory citizens under the Union (of Burma) Citizenship Act..... Thus mere race or appearance of a person or whether he has a knowledge of any language of the Union is not the test as to whether he is a citizen of the Union".[118] Additionally, in 2005, the Ministry of Religious Affairs issued a declaration concerning freedom of religion:
All ethnic groups in Myanmar have been throughout the country since time immemorial. They have been living united in peace and harmony since the time of ancient Myanmar kings. Myanmar kings, in return, looked after the members of other religious faiths by kindly giving them religious, social and economic opportunities equal to those awarded to Buddhists. It is well known that, to enable his Majesty's royal servants to fulfill their religious duties, Rakhine frame Mosque, Half-broken Mosque, Panthe Mosque, Mandalay Battery Ward Mosque and Christian Churches were allowed to be built and to perform respective religious duties during successive Myanmar kings.
The Parton of the Fifth Buddhist Synod, King Mindone (1854 to 1878), during his rule built Peacock rest house in the Holy City of Mecca, for the Muslims from Myanmar who went there on Hajj pilgrimage to stay comfortably while they were there for about one and a half months. That act was one of the best testimonies in Myanmar history of how Myanmar kings looked after their Muslim subjects benevolently.
Since the time of ancient Myanmar kings until the present day, successive Myanmar governments have given all four major religions an equal treatment. All the followers of each religion have been allowed to profess their respective religious faith and perform their respective duties freely. Myanmar's culture is based on loving kindness; the followers of Islam, Christianity and Hinduism in Myanmar are also kind-hearted people as Myanmar Buddhists are.[97]
Islam in Burma - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I don't see any sword in spread of Islam in Burma.
Regards
thanks for this reply
I am not very sure that Hilter killed the jews because of their beliefs .but it's very problebly he killed them because of they were jews .
I am not talking about what cause (Why the Westerns killed Westerns , or Why Nazi killed Jews) , i am talkin about the results , they estimated 45 christians killed plus about 6 millions jews killed in WW2.
let me light you about my point :
my point was not "WHY" , my point "How many ".
EDITED ,added:
because outhouse and some others , claim that the history of the muslims was worst than the westerns (or christians ) .
Last edited:
Hilter was seen hero for his people (german) in that time , and the others are evil .
that's was not my point , but it's ok ,i coorperative with you :
fighting the racist Nazi in Europe was good job done by USA ,
since you are fan of historians :
so What was the result human casualty in WW2 ,espacially in Europe ?
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