We need to have an honest discussion about race in America

[Kfox]

But by that same argument, we cannot claim that the language we use here has any basis in science, biology, or genetics

Nobody is making that claim.

You wanted to have an honest debate about race; part of that honesty is acknowledging that the topic under discussion is largely one of politics, prejudice, and ingrained cultural habits.

I do not disagree with anything you’ve said here, I’m just not gonna bury my head in the sand and pretend racial differences do not exist.

 

[Kfox]

Trust me, our ears are pretty specifically different to other people’s - especially once we’ve gone bald; then we may even be talking a whole different species different!

Fair enough; I'll trust you on that one (LOL)

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

What do rights have to do with any of this?

Sorry Kfox,

I did not realise that by “honest discussion about race” you meant a chat about “specific” physical traits, established by you (of which ears, teeth, hair and behaviour do not apply), excluding any relevant social context.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Sorry Kfox,

I did not realise that by “honest discussion about race” you meant a chat about “specific” physical traits, established by you (of which ears, teeth, hair and behaviour do not apply), excluding any relevant social context.

Maybe he already have the answer he want, and anything anyone else say would be seen as wrong

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

Maybe he already have the answer he want, and anything anyone else say would be seen as wrong

Which is all the more bewildering, considering their very own previous comment:

Yeah; I was more so talking about people who claim they want to have a discussion about race, but want to dictate instead.

 

[Kfox]

Sorry Kfox,

I did not realise that by “honest discussion about race” you meant a chat about “specific” physical traits, established by you (of which ears, teeth, hair and behaviour do not apply), excluding any relevant social context.

Nobody here suggested those of different races should not have the same rights as others, so I’m kinda at a loss as to why you would ask if rights should be based on race. OF COURSE NOT!!!

 

[Aštra’el]

If views aren't causing harm there's no problem. If views are hateful, discriminatory, and calling for violence it doesn't deserve respect.

Extremist ideology in general doesn't deserve respect.

I can respect certain intolerant, “hateful”, discriminatory, violent Weltanschauung.

I respect who and whatever I will.

I respect many sides of human nature. Some of these sides are beautiful, some of these sides are terrible. It is what it is.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

…/if rights should be based on race. OF COURSE NOT!!!

I 100% agree with you on this answer Kfox.

But if you look back, I did not ask that question and the reason for not having done so, is that IMO there is no question about the “should” in regards to this matter.

The problem lays in the “does”. Because in practice, nor laws, rules or rights apply the same to different people and a very big part of that is this insane concept of “race”.

If you cannot see that or think it irrelevant, then my humble guess is that you happen to be considered “white”.

 

[RestlessSoul]

No. What brought you to that conclusion?

Our ancestors were nomadic. They interbred with every tribe, nation and and race they came in contact with, Neanderthals included.

 

[RestlessSoul]

Mostly class, where I'm from.

And accents.

Whenever one Englishman opens his mouth, another Englishman instinctively hates him.
- George Bernard Shaw

 

[Stevicus]

America is not racist, it is well past that. Everyone can do well for themselves no matter what their race, if they are responsible and hard working.

There are however certain groups of people who will obsessively look for every possible way to interpret everything around them as “racist”. Their delusions are fueled by their ideology but most of all by their favorite media and politicians who keep the idea of racism fresh in their minds for their own personal gain.

There has been some progress made in terms of American racism, although I don't think we can say that we are "past that."

 

[We Never Know]

The KKK, infamous for only ever looking at people badly, and not doing anything about it.
Do you actually believe that?

Did I say that? I don't like they klan but lets face facts. Gays don't like they klan and the klan doesn't like gays.

 

[We Never Know]

View attachment 59302

@We Never Know, I can honestly say that I think that only someone who have never really not been free would express themselves like this.


Humbly
Hermit

Hows that? Example John doesn't like guns but I do and I have guns..my freedom to own guns is disliked by John.

 

[We Never Know]

The problem with justifying the existence of white supremacy in a community that values freedom by invoking that value of freedom is that its like defecating on the plate you eat from.

In a free community people have a right to voice their beliefs about even things like white supremacy, but that belief must ultimately be criticized and ostracized lest it take hold and negate the rights of others.

Be a Klansman, but don't expect respect by people that actually value the American ethos of liberty and justice for all (despite the historically cruddy practical application of it).

I don't like the klan. I don't like BLM. Yet both have the freedom to be who they are even though I don't like them.

 

[We Never Know]

If you truly see it like that, then you are a very lucky person.

I see it the same. If thats lucky, then I guess I'm lucky.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I'm not christian or klansman. Tell me again how being gay harms no one.....

"While men who have sex with men represent only 2% to 7% of the U.S. population, 70% of all new HIV infections in 2019 were in this group"

They tend to have more unprotected sex than others. But still that's not harming others and something easily remedied.

So don't tell me "being gay doesnt harm anyone".
It spreads a deadly disease.

Bull. Being gay in itself doesn't spread disease and lots of gay guys have none.
And when it comes to disease lesbians have the fewest. So try again.

 

[We Never Know]

They tend to have more unprotected sex than others. But still that's not harming others and something easily remedied.

Bull. Being gay in itself doesn't spread disease and lots of gay guys have none.
And when it comes to disease lesbians have the fewest. So try again.

Lesbians are not referred to as gay.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

America is not racist, it is well past that. Everyone can do well for themselves no matter what their race, if they are responsible and hard working.

There are however certain groups of people who will obsessively look for every possible way to interpret everything around them as “racist”. Their delusions are fueled by their ideology but most of all by their favorite media and politicians who keep the idea of racism fresh in their minds for their own personal gain.

Even California has racism. For the most part it does tend to be more subtle than in places like Indiana, but there's still more overt racism here.
In Indiana, it's very racist amd I'd get frequent warnings about staying out of the black part of town, told I need to be careful where they "have black people," lots of people telling me how black people are and that we should still be able to own them, and where I lived is bizarrely proud of its Klan history. People don't keep it to themselves there and will openly air it.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Lesbians are not referred to as gay.

You're still using a bad and informed argument to try to say being gay is harmful. Conservative Christians used that same arguement to say gay marriage should be illegal and our kids must be protected from it. But it's missing the part it isn't being gay, it's having lots of unprotected sex with a bunch of different partners. Gay or straight, that's a good way to catch STIs.

 

[The Hammer]

Science, biology, and genetics don't always make up the rules when it comes to language used in real world situations

So you agree that race is merely political then.