What do you feel is wrong with Islam?

[TashaN]

I would say this is where you argument falls down. In the past Islam was only sucessful and "tolirent" in comparison to other cultures at the time. However while these cultures have developted and adapted Islam has stayed in the past.

It's not about Islam, but about Muslims.

See above, they were only in comparison to even worse things. Just because it was better than the others that were around at the time doesn't make it good.

It wasn't better, but the best, and it remain the same, and will be.

 

[frg001]

It's not about Islam, but about Muslims.

Weird thing I have to add here... I really really do not like Islam (subjugation,slavery(even to a god), inequality (of gender/sexuality/religion), obedience! are NOT good things)...But I have yet to personally meet a Muslim I didn't like as a person, and usually, very much.(And I know quite a few, from Pakistan, North Africa, ex-Yugoslavia, ex-USSR etc

 

[TashaN]

Weird thing I have to add here... I really really do not like Islam (subjugation,slavery(even to a god), inequality (of gender/sexuality/religion), obedience! are NOT good things)...But I have yet to personally meet a Muslim I didn't like as a person, and usually, very much.(And I know quite a few, from Pakistan, North Africa, ex-Yugoslavia, ex-USSR etc

We are not saying Mulims are bad. They are just, not like what they used to be in term of contribution to humanity in our lovely planet.

Regarding the things you said about Islam, i'm really surprised, because none of them has anything to do with Islam "this became the default answer for many unfair claims but i'll remain saying so until someone prove these claims to me".

 

[EiNsTeiN]

Weird thing I have to add here... I really really do not like Islam (subjugation,slavery(even to a god), inequality (of gender/sexuality/religion), obedience! are NOT good things)...But I have yet to personally meet a Muslim I didn't like as a person, and usually, very much.(And I know quite a few, from Pakistan, North Africa, ex-Yugoslavia, ex-USSR etc

Weird claims frg001!

I would say this is where you argument falls down. In the past Islam was only sucessful and "tolirent" in comparison to other cultures at the time. However while these cultures have developted and adapted Islam has stayed in the past.

Weird explanation Panda!

 

[frg001]

Weird claims frg001!

Ok. I dont want to be rude.
Slavery and subjigationm and obedience. You freely enslave yourslef to your god.
You give your life to your god. You obey your teachings...(without question)
...For me that is not a good thing... The human race learns by example, and experience. You create a rulebook 1600 years old and rigidly stick to it, then where is the 'learning'?

Inequality of gender... It may not be in 'Islam' but the majority of Islamic countries practice it... It's no good saying that it isn't Islam, if the only examples of its culture are patently showing the rest of the world that 'in practice'...it is.

Inequality of sexuality...Same as most religions, but taken to an extreme in cases the same as above. Try being gay, and Iranian.

Inequality of religion...Again...Try being for example being Baha'i in Iran, Egypt


-
Again I must stress, that all the muslims I know are fine men and women...

 

[Popeyesays]

Islam in the time of the Spanish Occupation was a bright spot in history beyond doubt. However Islam has not remained progressive and embracing. It has become a backwater of technology and personal freedom.

I believe that is BECAUSE Islam is no longer willing to draw the best from other cultures, amalgamate those good things and progress as a result.

Regards,
Scott

 

[EiNsTeiN]

Ok. I dont want to be rude.
Slavery and subjigationm and obedience. You freely enslave yourslef to your god.
You give your life to your god.

What you don't know dear frg001, is that it's my honor to be the slave of God..
And I'm living this life only hoping that God would accept it for His sake..

Ask any muslims, and he would tell you the same...We are proud to be God's slaves..
And if I'm not, I feel in a big trouble!.

About the claims you pointed out, I recommend you check the last 10-15 pages in this thread, cuz they were all about them..

Being God's slave, means not being a slave for ANYTHING else..
Means complete safety and complete satisfaction...Means that you realize nothing in this world worth...How would you become afraid of anything, while being the slave of the most merciful, most powerful, and most knowing God??

 

[Popeyesays]

What you don't know dear frg001, is that it's my honor to be the slave of God..
And I'm living this life only hoping that God would accept it for His sake..

Ask any muslims, and he would tell you the same...We are proud to be God's slaves..
And if I'm not, I feel in a big trouble!.

About the claims you pointed out, I recommend you check the last 10-15 pages in this thread, cuz they were all about them..

Being God's slave, means not being a slave for ANYTHING else..
Means complete safety and complete satisfaction...Means that you realize nothing in this world worth...How would you become afraid of anything, while being the slave of the most merciful, most powerful, and most knowing God??

Baha`u'llah puts it like this:
"The tie of servitude established between the worshiper and the adored One, between the creature and the Creator, should in itself be regarded as a token of His gracious favor unto men, and not as an indication of any merit they may possess."

(Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 193)

Regards,
Scott

 

[kai]

Islam in the time of the Spanish Occupation was a bright spot in history beyond doubt. However Islam has not remained progressive and embracing. It has become a backwater of technology and personal freedom.

I believe that is BECAUSE Islam is no longer willing to draw the best from other cultures, amalgamate those good things and progress as a result.

Regards,
Scott

for my two pennies worth , i agree compared to the goths the muslims especially in spain were ahead of their time ,but the goths have evolved on to become modern nations while the muslims are still very much stuck in the middle ages, and i dont think Islam is flexible enough for them to move on , i dont think any nation can move into the 21st century without some secular input, only time will tell

 

[England my lionheart]

Although islam had a brief golden spell its best architecture was built by byzantium craftsmen who built the immayyad mosque in damascus and the dome of the rock jerualem.
This is the most surprising thing about islam in that it was surrounded by so much knowledge ie byzantium but stood still while everywhere else progressed or adapted to new ways and here we are 2008 and the middle east is still in the middle ages with medaeval ideas and no way of changing.

 

[Sahar]

Muslims in the middle east should invent some kind of a new qur'an and by this all their problems will be solved, they will wake up in the next day finding themselves on the top of the political, economic and social world's map. I really think Muslims should take this suggestion seriously.....I really do...

 

[kai]

Although islam had a brief golden spell its best architecture was built by byzantium craftsmen who built the immayyad mosque in damascus and the dome of the rock jerualem.
This is the most surprising thing about islam in that it was surrounded by so much knowledge ie byzantium but stood still while everywhere else progressed or adapted to new ways and here we are 2008 and the middle east is still in the middle ages with medaeval ideas and no way of changing.

it didnt just stand still it conqured the byzantines and the sassanids, maybe rome needed to fall in order for the western people to progress and diversify, the islamic empire of the ottoman has only been gone a few decades and their lands were carved up and exploited by the west, muslims need time to grow and progress also from an imperial past . whether Islam can handle modern technology,and issues time will tell

 

[Sahar]

only time will tell

The best thing you said...I am with you on this.

 

[kai]

Muslims in the middle east should invent some kind of a new qur'an and by this all their problems will be solved, they will wake up in the next day finding themselves on the top of the political, economic and social world's map. I really think Muslims should take this suggestion seriously.....I really do...

perhaps a genie and a magic lamp would suffice , and a new bible while your at it , and a new car for me , you will have three wishes after all.:yes:

 

[Sahar]

perhaps a genie and a magic lamp would suffice , and a new bible while your at it , and a new car for me , you will have three wishes after all.:yes:

Ehm....no car for me?

 

[kai]

Ehm....no car for me?

dont be greedy think of others.:yes:

 

[England my lionheart]

I have been looking at islam online and it has been very enlightening,as i mentioned a long way back in this thread it does look like the qur'an is a re-write of the torah as is the bible.
The torah was written first followed by the bible and then the qur'an,it is plain to me that the qur'an has basically the same stories ie Adam and Eve etc that these must have been copied so how can the qur'an be an original work.

 

[Sahar]

I have been looking at islam online and it has been very enlightening,as i mentioned a long way back in this thread it does look like the qur'an is a re-write of the torah as is the bible.
The torah was written first followed by the bible and then the qur'an,it is plain to me that the qur'an has basically the same stories ie Adam and Eve etc

With some corrections.
IslamOnline is a good website.
This is MOHAMMAD (about the life of the prophet)

dont be greedy think of others.:yes:

Have you thought of me? :flirt:

 

[credance]

Why are you trying to impose your own values on me and my fellow Muslims?

So, a woman is free to walk in the street half naked and she is not free to choose a more decent clothes for herself just because you think it's ugly and dark?

This is so offensive to me and the Muslims and i can't accept it.

I am not trying to impose my values on anyone. We were discussing freedom to choose. Would I go into a tribe of Pygmies and try to make the women cover their breast? No! But I wouldn't want them moving into my neighborhood without making some adjustments to assimilate into our culture. The agenda for a lot of Muslims is to intergrate and then change the culture and laws to suite them. A good example is the U.K.
YouTube - Muslims Invade Britain & Begin On USA
YouTube - England - Islam Victory in Europe - Muslims

 

[EiNsTeiN]

for my two pennies worth , i agree compared to the goths the muslims especially in spain were ahead of their time ,but the goths have evolved on to become modern nations while the muslims are still very much stuck in the middle ages, and i dont think Islam is flexible enough for them to move on , i dont think any nation can move into the 21st century without some secular input, only time will tell

Although islam had a brief golden spell its best architecture was built by byzantium craftsmen who built the immayyad mosque in damascus and the dome of the rock jerualem.
This is the most surprising thing about islam in that it was surrounded by so much knowledge ie byzantium but stood still while everywhere else progressed or adapted to new ways and here we are 2008 and the middle east is still in the middle ages with medaeval ideas and no way of changing.

I can't take those as valid argumentations, unless you provide an evidence that links that "directly" to Islam..

Cuz in our belief, Islam is a self-developed religion, and it adabtes itself with the changes...
I totally see it doing that..

Waiting your proofs

I have been looking at islam online and it has been very enlightening,as i mentioned a long way back in this thread it does look like the qur'an is a re-write of the torah as is the bible.
The torah was written first followed by the bible and then the qur'an,it is plain to me that the qur'an has basically the same stories ie Adam and Eve etc that these must have been copied so how can the qur'an be an original work.

Well, that would be true if the Quran was written by a human being who would copy and paste..
While the Quran is the last revelation of God, and God included the stories humanity needed from the past revelations, as well as adding new ones..

So basically, it's logical to find the same stories, cuz both are from the same God