What does it take to get to Heaven?

[waitasec]

i thought the word christian originated in the bible

 

[Katzpur]

i thought the word christian originated in the bible

The word is mentioned in the Bible, but I would challenge you or anyone else to show me where it's defined in the Bible. The closest the Bible comes to defining the word "Christian" is when Jesus Christ himself says that the way people will be able to recognize His disciples is by the love they show to one another. How ironic.

 

[Shermana]

The Antioch Church Christians led by Peter are referred to as "Christians" by outsiders in Acts.

 

[Shades-o-Blue]

The Bible defines what a Christian is, not me.

Really? Care to show me where?

 

[Matthew78]

Here is the nutshell explanation from lds.org

"Latter-day revelations speak of hell in at least two ways. First, it is another name for spirit prison, a temporary place in the postmortal world for those who died without a knowledge of the truth or those who were disobedient in mortality. Second, it is the permanent location of Satan and his followers and the sons of perdition, who are not redeemed by the Atonement of Jesus Christ."

I thank you and Katzpur, especially, for helping me to understand better.

 

[Shades-o-Blue]

I thank you and Katzpur, especially, for helping me to understand better.

And thank you, as well. Your honesty is refreshing.

 

[Katzpur]

And thank you, as well. Your honesty is refreshing.

Ditto.

 

[waitasec]

The word is mentioned in the Bible, but I would challenge you or anyone else to show me where it's defined in the Bible. The closest the Bible comes to defining the word "Christian" is when Jesus Christ himself says that the way people will be able to recognize His disciples is by the love they show to one another. How ironic.

well let me ask you then, in acts 26:28 what is the context for which the term christian came from? seems to me this is the 1st time the jesus movement separated it self from the jews. it was the jews that wanted paul dead.

acts 26: 4 “The Jewish people all know the way I have lived ever since I was a child, from the beginning of my life in my own country, and also in Jerusalem. 5 They have known me for a long time and can testify, if they are willing, that I conformed to the strictest sect of our religion, living as a Pharisee. 6 And now it is because of my hope in what God has promised our ancestors that I am on trial today. 7 This is the promise our twelve tribes are hoping to see fulfilled as they earnestly serve God day and night. King Agrippa, it is because of this hope that these Jews are accusing me. 8 Why should any of you consider it incredible that God raises the dead?...
“ ‘I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting,’ the Lord replied. 16 ‘Now get up and stand on your feet. I have appeared to you to appoint you as a servant and as a witness of what you have seen and will see of me. 17 I will rescue you from your own people and from the Gentiles. I am sending you to them 18 to open their eyes and turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, so that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.’

19 “So then, King Agrippa, I was not disobedient to the vision from heaven. 20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and then to the Gentiles, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and demonstrate their repentance by their deeds. ...

25 “I am not insane, most excellent Festus,” Paul replied. “What I am saying is true and reasonable. 26 The king is familiar with these things, and I can speak freely to him. I am convinced that none of this has escaped his notice, because it was not done in a corner. 27 King Agrippa, do you believe the prophets? I know you do.”

28 Then Agrippa said to Paul, “Do you think that in such a short time you can persuade me to be a Christian?”

so a christian isn't a jew or a gentile according to verse 17
christians are also sanctified in vs 18

i think christian was defined in the bible as i'm sure the term mormon is defined in the book of mormon...

 

[brian12]

A man can go to heaven if he has done good work and will go heaven if he has done bad work.A man remains in the people's mind then only he can go to heaven.

 

[gnostic]

What does it take to get to Heaven?

A Space Shuttle?

 

[smidjit]

Moses' case is up to debate whether he murdered or was saving the Israelite's life. Either way, Moses was not exempt from curses. He did not even get to live to see the Holy Land because he didn't give the Father the glory over the rock-spring.

King David was cursed with terrible curses, most of his life was in shame, on the run, and in civil war due to his sons. Where does it say they were excused?

Everyone must pay their consequences.

I am saying that there will be murderers in heaven. King David, and Moses, and the Apostle Paul are all examples.

 

[smidjit]

What? How am I lowering the standard? If anything, I'm raising it! And why would you think I was suggesting that I believe we can attain Heaven on our own merits? After all, I specifically said, "I believe it's absolutely impossible for a human being to live in such a way that he doesn't need a Savior." You are accusing me of saying the opposite of what I actually said.

God doesn't grade, period.

Good grief. I didn't suggest anything of the sort. Stop putting words in my mouth. If you want to tell me what I said, then quote me. Don't even attempt to paraphrase me, because you suck at it.

What I heard you say, and maybe I misinterpreted, was that even though we are saved, to live a rebellious lifestyle would be a sure means to dismissal from the family. I didn't mean to misquote you if I did. What I was saying that even at our best behavior we fall way below the standard.

Ps 39:5 Behold, thou hast made my days as an handbreadth; and mine age is as nothing before thee: verily every man at his best state is altogether vanity. Selah.

 

[Katzpur]

i think christian was defined in the bible as i'm sure the term mormon is defined in the book of mormon...

Well, I'll tell you what I think, waitasec. I think you have a real hard time with word usage. You weren't able to make a distinction between "true" and "complete." Now you're getting "mentioned" mixed up with "defined."

As to the "definition" of Mormon as found in the Book of Mormon... Proper nouns, particularly when they denote names of specific individuals, don't have definitions.

Do you suppose we could get back to the topic of the OP now? It's "What does it take to get to Heaven?" Not "What's the definition of a Christian?"

 

[Katzpur]

What I heard you say, and maybe I misinterpreted, was that even though we are saved, to live a rebellious lifestyle would be a sure means to dismissal from the family. I didn't mean to misquote you if I did. What I was saying that even at our best behavior we fall way below the standard.

Okay then, I agree. Even at our best behavior, we fall way below the standard. We are expected to obey Christ's commandments, but our obedience would be worth absolutely nothing without His sacrifice. None of us would get to heaven on our own merits. We all need Him to atone for our sins. All I was really saying is that, as Christians, we're expected to do more than just talk the talk. We're expected to walk the walk -- to the best of our ability. I have found that the gospel of Jesus Christ inspires me to be a better person. Isn't that what He'd want?

 

[Many Sages One Truth]

Pretty much sums up my answer on getting to heaven:

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/general-discussion/119821-i-am-heaven-right-now-you.html

 

[Shermana]

I am saying that there will be murderers in heaven. King David, and Moses, and the Apostle Paul are all examples.

And would they be there if they didn't repent? Apparently repentance and bearing the earthly consequences is a conditional.

PS You don't know if Paul went to Heaven or not.

 

[waitasec]

Well, I'll tell you what I think, waitasec. I think you have a real hard time with word usage. You weren't able to make a distinction between "true" and "complete." Now you're getting "mentioned" mixed up with "defined."

i'm wondering why you are so hostile to my observations...
i guess you don't want to get into it.
i understand...

As to the "definition" of Mormon as found in the Book of Mormon... Proper nouns, particularly when they denote names of specific individuals, don't have definitions.

that isn't at all true.
it's not a proper noun it's an adjective or a noun, like christian is a ajective...howver i do know some people who's name is christian, but we both know that's not what we are talking about, or i could be called mormon too

Do you suppose we could get back to the topic of the OP now? It's "What does it take to get to Heaven?" Not "What's the definition of a Christian?"

let me remind you, i was commenting on your post


besides that post was very relevant to the OP...
you just don't want to admit that for some reason

 

[Katzpur]

i'm wondering why you are so hostile to my observations...
i guess you don't want to get into it.
i understand...

No, you really don't. I don't want to get into it with you because you have an agenda at this point and that's all you're focused on. You make absolutely to effort whatsoever to understand where your opponents are coming from. You're not a debater. You're just somebody with an ax to grind. I have better things to do than try to have a dialogue with you. I have given you the benefit of the doubt far longer than I should have done, and I'm through. That's all.

 

[InChrist]

I believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.

I believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are:
first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ;
second, Repentance;
third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins by one holding the proper priesthood authority;
fourth, receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost through the laying on of hands again by someone holding the proper priesthood authority,
and fifth, enduring to the end.

And in order to reach the highest level of heaven doesn't the LDS church also state the following requirements?



Requirements for Exaltation

The time to fulfill the requirements for exaltation is now (see Alma 34:32–34). President Joseph Fielding Smith said, “In order to obtain the exaltation we must accept the gospel and all its covenants; and take upon us the obligations which the Lord has offered; and walk in the light and understanding of the truth; and ‘live by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God’ ” (Doctrines of Salvation, 2:43).
To be exalted, we first must place our faith in Jesus Christ and then endure in that faith to the end of our lives. Our faith in him must be such that we repent of our sins and obey his commandments.
He commands us all to receive certain ordinances:
· 1. We must be baptized and confirmed a member of the Church of Jesus Christ.
· 2. We must receive the laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
· 3. We must receive the temple endowment.
· 4. We must be married for time and eternity.
In addition to receiving the required ordinances, the Lord commands all of us to—
· 1. Love and worship God.
· 2. Love our neighbor.
· 3. Repent of our wrongdoings.
· 4. Live the law of chastity.
· 5. Pay honest tithes and offerings.
· 6. Be honest in our dealings with others and with the Lord.
· 7. Speak the truth always.
· 8. Obey the Word of Wisdom.
· 9. Search out our kindred dead and perform the saving ordinances of the gospel for them.
· 10. Keep the Sabbath day holy.
· 11. Attend our Church meetings as regularly as possible so we can renew our baptismal covenants by partaking of the sacrament.
· 12. Love our family members and strengthen them in the ways of the Lord.
· 13. Have family and individual prayers every day.
· 14. Honor our parents.
· 15. Teach the gospel to others by word and example.
· 16. Study the scriptures.
· 17. Listen to and obey the inspired words of the prophets of the Lord.
Finally, each of us needs to receive the Holy Ghost and learn to follow his direction in our individual lives.

http://classic.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp

 

[waitasec]

No, you really don't. I don't want to get into it with you because you have an agenda at this point and that's all you're focused on. You make absolutely to effort whatsoever to understand where your opponents are coming from. You're not a debater. You're just somebody with an ax to grind. I have better things to do than try to have a dialogue with you. I have given you the benefit of the doubt far longer than I should have done, and I'm through. That's all.

what is my agenda exactly?
i am here to debate... if i posit an argument that you refuse to address i am only going to think you cannot address it...
why should i consider where you are coming from? i'm here to debate a concept of something as absolute perfection., not people and it seems you have a problem distinguishing between the 2...