What is your belief in regards to God?

[Parsimony]

No, it's the other way round. Grace allows you to believe, and therefore, as it comes from God, you know. That is why you only need faith that is very small.

Regardless of what allows belief, how does belief equate to knowing in this sense? People who believe in God don't necessarily do so because they gained knowledge of
His existence. I think you are conflating two difference scenarios. Just to give an example with Bigfoot: a person may never have had an encounter with Bigfoot, but after reading about the encounters that others have had, looking at footprint casts, reviewing photographs and so on, they come to gain a belief in Bigfoot. This is belief, not knowledge. If, on the other hand, a person comes face-to-face with Bigfoot, they don't need other evidence to prove to that it exists. They've seen it for themselves. This then is knowledge gained from personal experience. Likewise, some people believe in God due to studying evidence and others come to a knowledge of God after experiencing Him. These are not the same thing.

In their own reality, he doesn't. Ultimately, he does.

Then you agree that belief isn't the same as knowing. If you imply that belief comes from God, and that a belief from God cannot be wrong, then does that mean a belief in Bigfoot cannot be wrong? If a belief in Bigfoot does not come from God, then where does it come from? If it then is possible for a belief to exist that did not come from God, then how do you know that a belief in God comes from God without using circular reasoning?

But you are looking at "belief" in God as the same as all other beliefs. You can't do that.

Why not? There are plenty of people who are taught to believe in God as children and therefore believe before they have had any kind of spiritual experiences with Him. So you most certainly can belief in God without knowing that He is there. There are plenty of theists who are willing to admit that they don't know for sure that God exists (agnostic theists) but believe that He does for one reason or another. Go ahead and ask around. I think leibowde84 is one of them.

If he pulls away from someone, then their faith dies. That is grace. We do nothing of ourself, it is the gift of God.

How exactly does that make them forget about God? Forget about their experiences with Him?

 

[jonathan180iq]

No, you shift to one based in reality, a reality a few can't see. Many can.

But certainly you would agree that consensus doesn't necessitate reality, right?

Billions of people believe that Mohammed is the only true Prophet of the One True God, and his name is Allah... Yet I don't you see you giving up your faith in Yahweh.

There is no comparison between the two. If you take theology down to that level you might as well do the same with everything, and then all arguments are stupid.

But you've yet to explain why your theology is any better than a well-developed Jedi theology, other than simply saying "because it is so and many people can see that." In any other scenario you know you wouldn't accept such a cop-out as an answer.

I said:
"You can't say that. That is false. If I meet someone and then they leave, are you telling me that that was not fact because no one else was there? I think you will find it was fact."

What do your comments have to do with that.

The whole point of the Santa thing was to reference the obvious difference between conviction of beliefs and reality of situations. The point was that even the deepest conviction says nothing at all about reality. So, again, why is your convicted stance and reference to god based on? If it's not simply conviction, then please tell me what it is.

There will obviously be the source of all knowledge and we can therefore say that that is the purest form of that knowledge. Are you saying I shouldn't believe in one over the other? Your argument seems stupid and desperate.

I'm only asking you to explain what it's based on. You prefer one over the other, and I imagine you see your chosen faith as being more accurate and valid than the other ones. Like I've asked you a dozen times already; why? What makes your claim to god any more valid than any other claim to god. The claims are extremely different, especially regarding the nature and character of the deity. If they're supposedly referencing the same deity, as you say, then there's some serious issues with the quality of the information you're all using.

We replicate him in lower forms. What is below is above.

So the transcendent god who lives in a realm above ours is limited in gender?
What do female gods look like? Are there female gods?

You know where it comes from, you just refuse to accept it.

No. You're right. I don't accept it. And even though I've given you multiple chances to explain why I should accept your source of divine information, all you've really told me is that "it's above us, and we are below it." "All faiths speak to the same source." "The source that I believe in is the most accurate depiction of that source." and "It is this way because a lot of people can see that it is."

Like I said before, if we were talking about Baseball statistics, you wouldn't be using arguments like that... You know you wouldn't.

What is it exactly that you're referring to when you're referring to God?

 

[viole]

haha... Clever Viole.
He is the son who beget himself, the Father of Father, the giver of life, the smallest part that died for the many, the all, so that the all could live.

Hold your horses. He did not really die, did He?

He has his reasons for that of course: the all is him. To me, that is amazing. To you, it is words on a screen. One day, perhaps you will remember these things in another reality, otherwise I think there would be little point saying them.

A reason to do what, exactly? To get a short break, knowing that soon after that He would rule the Universe forever?

The one who comes second, is first. But how can he be first if he is second. How can one born after, be the one that bares all? In that is separation I think, otherwise it would not work. It is marvelous.

Marvelous, is not exactly the firsrt word that comes to my mind.

Ciao

- viole

 

[tonyamendola]

I experienced God back in 2003 although the experience is timeless and Infinite and the I that experienced, is not the i called tony.
I wasnt spiritual or on a spiritual path as far as i was aware before and did not read any theology.
Some things Jesus spoke caught my eye in a film and some things Buddhist spoke came before me again watching tv and for
whatever reason they made sense to me so i walked them in my day to day life ... non judgement .... not worrying about being
used or stolen from or when i was ill and thought my time was up ...... which led to what Jesus speaks of as coming
upon the clouds and what Buddha speaks of as the full moon.
Both are speaking of the same Experience and the same is spoken of in many other theology`s from Zen to Upanishads to
Shakespeare......Rumi... and on.
Basically Love made sense to me and so did non judgement and as i walked it and refined what Love/Compassion really is
i came close enough in mind to Truth that i connected and found the True I ..... call that Christ Buddha many names that point...
its way beyond the words that point to what is unspeakable.
So what else can i say other than what all of the messengers have always said.... simply ....
Love to Love .... Love all as your Self because they are ALL your family, hold none outside of that because as you hold another
outside, you hold your self outside, hence cease judgement...... and you will see for your SELF
Ohhh and there is nothing to fear....... only perfect LOVE awaits You

 

[QuestioningMind]

What is your belief in regards to God? Is it theistic, atheistic, or agnostic? (Please explain why for your choice.)

I am a theist because I believe "God" qualifies as the only explanation to the mystery of existence.

I am and will remain an atheist, as long as no verifiable evidence for a god exists. Should such evidence ever present itself, then I'll alter my viewpoint.

 

[Milton Platt]

What is your belief in regards to God? Is it theistic, atheistic, or agnostic? (Please explain why for your choice.)

I am a theist because I believe "God" qualifies as the only explanation to the mystery of existence.

I was raised in a household that was indifferent to religion. My parents didn't go to a church (ever) but they never identified as atheist to my knowledge. There was no prayer or mention of religion at all.
I am an atheist because the evidence to support a god hypothesis is severely lacking.

Your statement that a god is the best explanation for the mystery of life is a non starter. It actually explains nothing at all. It's like this magic dumpster where you throw things that you don't have an answer for.

Plus, so far, every "mystery" that a god has been presumed responsible for has been shown by science to be explainable by natural means.

When you can come up with testable, falsifiable hypotheses about precisely how the god came into being and exactly what methodology it used to produce a given mystery, you have my full attention. Until then, saying that "god did it" is just an unsupported assertion used to fill a void in your knowledge. It's called an argument from ignorance, which is not saying you are ignorant in the pejorative sense, just that your conclusion about a god rests only upon your lack of information rather than positive information that actually supports your conclusion.

That is a weak position to base your world view on.

Just realized I was on one of my soap boxes.....well, I'll let it stand.

 

[Rick B]

I am a believer of the existence of the God of the Bible because of the impossibility of the contrary.

 

[Ron Hackel]

Milton Platt
Here is an easy question for you, if science has explained everything. What came first the chicken or the egg?

 

[Andrew Gooding]

I'm a theist. I believe that we exist in, with and through God, Who is both Immanent and transcendent. I believe in the Holy Trinity, but I also believe that God's Life dwells in us all as an impersonal as well as personal force. God's impossible to describe, but I do hold certain views about Him and here they are!

 

[Parsimony]

Milton Platt
Here is an easy question for you, if science has explained everything. What came first the chicken or the egg?

Where did he say that science has explained everything? Eggs were around a long time before chickens, by the way. Perhaps what you meant was "which came first, the chicken or the chicken egg"?

 

[bnabernard]

The only common denominator is nothing, define nothing and you'll know everything.

bernard (hug)

 

[outhouse]

I am a believer of the existence of the God of the Bible because of the impossibility of the contrary.

What is impossible about ancient men creating and living lives based on previous mythology?

 

[outhouse]

The only common denominator is nothing, define nothing and you'll know everything.

bernard (hug)

That brings up a good point.

Those who try and define nothing, reveal their own errors and weakness.

 

[outhouse]

I'm a theist. I believe that we exist in, with and through God, Who is both Immanent and transcendent

I'm a strong atheist and an x luthren.

I believe the same exact thing.

Now define god as a feeling that lives in your conscious mind of those who believe, as you have described. And we would both think the same thing.

He does not have to exist, and everything you said still applies in total 100%.

 

[bnabernard]

That brings up a good point.

Those who try and define nothing, reveal their own errors and weakness.

That brings up a good point.

Those who try and define nothing, reveal their own errors and weakness.

While those who can;t define nothing are weak and in continual error .

bernard (hug)

 

[outhouse]

While those who can;t define nothing are weak and in continual error .

I did not say that. You did.

These people have a chance at being correct.

Sometimes the best answer is none at all.

You factually cannot describe nothing, and doing so only shows one imagination by how they fill nothing with something, if they try and describe it.

 

[Rick B]

What is impossible about ancient men creating and living lives based on previous mythology?

I am interested how you would respond to "infinite regress" in your belief system.

 

[outhouse]

I am interested how you would respond to "infinite regress" in your belief system.

Aristotle comes to mind. But that also is overthinking it.

When you use philosophy improperly one can throw credible knowledge out the window.

 

[Rick B]

Aristotle comes to mind. But that also is overthinking it.

When you use philosophy improperly one can throw credible knowledge out the window.

OK, while I acknowledge that not only ancient men but also present men live their lives according to mythology, how is mythology "previous" to man who wrote it? And how can (why would) a rational person base their lives on a myth - defined as an imaginary, fictitious tale? That worldview lacks any credible knowledge to justify a logical existence.

 

[Robert Landbeck]

What is your belief in regards to God? Is it theistic, atheistic, or agnostic? (Please explain why for your choice.)

I am a theist because I believe "God" qualifies as the only explanation to the mystery of existence.

I have no problem with that idea. But I'm not prepared to accept project 'theology' as a valid means to comprehend the mind of God. So to my mind tradition is a fraud and true religion has yet to begin.