whats your beef with brexit?

[LionLooking]

....... let's get out, 2% majority or not.

No, let's remain.
2% is way too small. If only Cameron had had the sense to insist on a minimum of 60%, or better still, had the sense not to indulge the far right of his party

 

[ImmortalFlame]

It wasn't such a good deal, the EU.
My friend married a Dutch Lady and moved to Holland to live with her. He couldn't get a job over there.......... the authorities told him to go home if he wanted a job, or go home and apply for a contract job which involved him returning and working in Holland. Nor was he elligble for any benefits.

Very one sided deals. Nah....... let's get out, 2% majority or not.

How will leaving the EU make that situation better?

 

[oldbadger]

No, let's remain.
2% is way too small. If only Cameron had had the sense to insist on a minimum of 60%, or better still, had the sense not to indulge the far right of his party

Micro-majorities have always worried me, no less after general and council elections.
Farage was on telly last night, actually suggesting a re-run of the referendum..... true.
You may get your wish...........
But I do hope Brexit goes through.

 

[oldbadger]

How will leaving the EU make that situation better?

It won't, English spouses will still get a rubbish deal in some EU countries, so, no change there.

But, honestly, stuff 'em. At least we'll be thinking of giving our jobs, health-care, services, etc to ours.

I often wondered why so many wanted to arrive on Brit shores........... the deal was very one sided, that's why.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

It won't, English spouses will still get a rubbish deal in some EU countries, so, no change there.

So why did you bring it up?

But, honestly, stuff 'em. At least we'll be thinking of giving our jobs, health-care, services, etc to ours.

But we barely have a large enough work force to cover them, and the loss of EU expertise and funding will significantly negatively impact all of those things.

I often wondered why so many wanted to arrive on Brit shores........... the deal was very one sided, that's why.

Do you have any idea what the EU has done for the UK?

 

[England my lionheart]

So when Brexit campaigners moan about Europe, it's "positive words", but when anti-Brexit campaigners moan about leaving Europe, it's just moaning?

I meant leave had an upbeat campaign but remains was built on fear which had exactly the opposite effect to what they hoped.

This childish, divisive attitude has to stop. It does no one any good.

I agree

 

[England my lionheart]

Oh, so campaigning to leave is ok, but campaigning to remain is 'whinging and moaning'? That sounds fair.

Campaigning after its over seems a bit like closing the stable door after the horse has run off.

I'm voicing my concerns. If you see that as 'project fear' then do you wonder why remainers feel that they are being poo-pooed?

Well we all have those rights I suppose.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I agree

Well, at least you're honest about it.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I meant leave had an upbeat campaign but remains was built on fear which had exactly the opposite effect to what they hoped.

So, THIS isn't a fear campaign?:

 

[oldbadger]

So why did you bring it up?

Just showing what a bull-dusty one sided deal our folks get over there in some EU countries.

But we barely have a large enough work force to cover them, and the loss of EU expertise and funding will significantly negatively impact all of those things.

Rubbish! IT and Robotics are tearing in to the available positions here and redundancies are going to increase immensely.
Go into your local bank and see how micro-processed systems are replacing tellers. Go shopping and count the self-tills. The list of dissappearing positions increases and we need to place our own in available jobs.

Do you have any idea what the EU has done for the UK?

Do you have any idea what we can buy from the EU in future with the funds that we can save, once out of this top heavy, corrupt, mess of bureacrats?
See? If we need something we will buy it, rather than pay............ Buying and paying are different actions in my book.

 

[England my lionheart]

So, THIS isn't a fear campaign?:

Yes but built on what people already thought so a rallying point if you like whereas remain didn't have anything like that.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Just showing what a bull-dusty one sided deal our folks get over there in some EU countries.

And some bicycles have big front wheels, but what's that got to do with the price of fish?

Rubbish! IT and Robotics are tearing in to the available positions here and redundancies are going to increase immensely.
Go into your local bank and see how micro-processed systems are replacing tellers. Go shopping and count the self-tills. The list of dissappearing positions increases and we need to place our own in available jobs.

Which also has nothing to do with the EU. You're talking about jobs that are pure manpower, not expertise. The fact is that the average EU immigrant to the UK has higher qualifications than the average UK native. The kinds of roles they are more likely to fill aren't the kinds of roles being replaced by machines - they're doctors, nurses and lawyers. If anything, the expanse of robotics and elimination of such positions will make a non-EU British workforce even worse off, because we'll have more people with zero qualifications who can't work because their positions don't even exist anymore, and far less people able to work jobs that require actual qualifications. Not to mention the millions of jobs the EU directly created.

Do you have any idea what we can buy from the EU in future with the funds that we can save, once out of this top heavy, corrupt, mess of bureacrats?

Not much, because we'll have a smaller economy, worse trade deals, and overall be much worse off according to basically all financial evaluations.

See? If we need something we will buy it, rather than pay............ Buying and paying are different actions in my book.

This is just pure nonsense.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Yes but built on what people already thought so a rallying point if you like whereas remain didn't have anything like that.

"When we use fear tactics it's fine because some people already agree with us".

 

[oldbadger]

And some bicycles have big front wheels, but what's that got to do with the price of fish?

Bicycles and fish? Why pick rubbish analogies?
I was showing one example in many of an unequal deal.
We don't want unequal deals.

Which also has nothing to do with the EU.

.....and now you're going to talk about how it is something to do with the EU >>>>>

You're talking about jobs that are pure manpower, not expertise. The fact is that the average EU immigrant to the UK has higher qualifications than the average UK native. The kinds of roles they are more likely to fill aren't the kinds of roles being replaced by machines - they're doctors, nurses and lawyers.

Now I know that you're completely out of tune with our employment situations here.
When we get clear of the EU, we can BUY any professionals that we might have unfilled vancancies for, but we need to start thinking about protecting working positions for our own working people, because IT is slowly clearing out positions. And if you think that Retail Staff and Bank Tellers are without expertise then that tells me bookloads about you.

If anything, the expanse of robotics and elimination of such positions will make a non-EU British workforce even worse off, because we'll have more people with zero qualifications who can't work because their positions don't even exist anymore, and far less people able to work jobs that require actual qualifications. Not to mention the millions of jobs the EU directly created.

Take a tip from me.............. a person with, say, ten year's work in retail, or driving a forklift, or delivering mail etc, is QUALIFIED with and by EXPERIENCE, a very valuable qualification.

If you want to sideline folks who haven't got a paper qualification when you could be thinking of ways to refloat their lives then you're not going to worth hearing in discussions about the future of our UK.

Not much, because we'll have a smaller economy, worse trade deals, and overall be much worse off according to basically all financial evaluations.

You and your financial evaluations....
IMO you've shown that you've overlooked too many important values to get any accirate maths from your model of a financial evaluation.

This is just pure nonsense.

NO, it's not. There's a difference between choosing to buy and being made to pay..............

 

[LionLooking]

Campaigning after its over seems a bit like closing the stable door after the horse has run off.

Well, Farage and co continued to campaign after we joined the EU. He carried on until he got his way. I, and millions like me, will do likewise.

 

[Notanumber]

So, THIS isn't a fear campaign?:

I wonder what percentage of those have British values.

 

[Altfish]

I wonder what percentage of those have British values.

Probably a lot larger percentage of them than those people who hark on about British Values but constantly prove that they don't know what they are.

 

[England my lionheart]

Well, Farage and co continued to campaign after we joined the EU. He carried on until he got his way. I, and millions like me, will do likewise.

15 or 20 years time the eu won't be a thing so campaign away.

 

[Altfish]

15 or 20 years time the eu won't be a thing so campaign away.

One huge retrograde step that will be.

 

[Notanumber]

One huge retrograde step that will be.

Only if you are a supporter of protection rackets.