Which One do you think is more faithful and loyal ?

[Vinayaka]

Isn't it supposed to?

Supposed to what?

If the divorce rate is a sign of loyalty, atheist outperform theists by a small margin, in most studies. But personally I know all 4 kinds.

 

[LuisDantas]

Supposed to what?

If the divorce rate is a sign of loyalty, atheist outperform theists by a small margin, in most studies. But personally I know all 4 kinds.

Isn't religion supposed to help in making people loyal?

Divorce rate may or may not be a good indication of loyalty. I don't think it is, though. There are way too many reasons why people divorce, including simple understanding that they simply do not want to remain together. Divorce may actually improve the quality of a relationship under certain circunstances.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Dumb question. Neither.

This.

Depends on the person as an individual.

 

[George-ananda]

Us theists are more respectable. Atheists even lie about the existence of God.

How do we know it's not the theists that are lying about the existence of God?

Please re-read my first five words above.

 

[Vinayaka]

Isn't religion supposed to help in making people loyal?

Yes, that would be the claim. But I don't believe it's backed up by any great research. Of course, as you know, I see religion as an incredibly wide spectrum, crossing many cultures and beliefs. So some might increase loyalty whereas others might diminish it.

But I'm also not sure what exactly everyone in this discussion means by loyalty.

 

[Triumphant_Loser]

Please re-read my first five words above.

I have... The question still stands.

 

[Iti oj]

Also if all I knew was there theistic stance then I would choose neither.

 

[chinu]

I would not trust it to someone who may potentialy divulge it to his Pastor, Priest, Imam or Rabbi.

Am taking about believing in Present-God rather than any pastor, priest, Imam or rabbi etc.

 

[chinu]

Religious belief isn't related to loyalty towards others.

Sorry! Vinayaka.
I think you didn't got my point.

Rather than belief in any religion/sect, am just talking about believing in God.

 

[chinu]

To be brutally honest, sight unseen I have a higher worry about the moral standards and degree of discernment of theists.

Belief in God is often very ok and may be even necessary for the proper moral development of many people.

However, for so many people it ends up being "third-partying" several important personal responsibilities that it is sad.

People's self-assessment as theists or atheists may on occasion be confused or confusing, but still, going blindly I would assume an atheist to feel responsible for his own behavior and to be ready to live with the consequences.

I would not assume the same of a generic Theist.

Sorry! Luis.
Rather than someone who address him/herself as theist, am talking about the one who very strongly believe in the existence of God.

I don't think the one who address him/herself as theist also has very strong believing in the existence of God. Believing in the existence of God depends on one's conduct and character, imo.

For example: I have seen many theists getting afraid of just two year child while doing any illegal/wrong work, But they don't fear omnipresent God when they are alone somewhere doing any illegal/wrong work. And such people aren't theists according to me

 

[chinu]

3rd: The one who acknowledges that God can neither be proven nor disproven, but makes their decision based upon evidence they find supporting one or the other. (Regardless of what conclusion they come to.)

Dear, I think you didn't concentrated on the option 1st of OP.

BELIEVING in the existence of God doesn't mean one is SURE. There's lot of difference between BELIEVING and being SURE of something.

 

[chinu]

This idea that people whom don't believe in a God are somehow more evil, or lacking morals, is outdated, ridiculous, and insulting.


Multiple studies have been done over the years showing that religious people commit as much crime as the non-religious.


"A growing body of social science research reveals that atheists, and non-religious people in general, are far from the unsavory beings many assume them to be. On basic questions of morality and human decency— issues such as governmental use of torture, the death penalty, punitive hitting of children, racism, sexism, homophobia, anti-Semitism, environmental degradation or human rights — the irreligious tend to be more ethical than their religious peers, particularly compared with those who describe themselves as very religious." - USC's RD Magazine



*

Dear, there's a very big difference between a religious person and the one who believe in the existence of God, Imo.

For example: I have seen many theists getting afraid of just two year child while doing any illegal/wrong work, But they don't fear omnipresent God when they are alone somewhere doing any illegal/wrong work. And such people aren't theists according to me

 

[chinu]

Trick question: they both believe in God.

What do I win, chinu?

No,

1st believe 99%
2nd believe 1%

100% means SURE and there's no room for any BELIEVE thereafter.
0% is impossible.

 

[chinu]

Which one is nicer: The one who likes basketball or the one who likes football?

And what about the one who likes to play basketball with foots ?

 

[LuisDantas]

Sorry! Luis.
Rather than someone who address him/herself as theist, am talking about the one who very strongly believe in the existence of God.

So am I. Why did you think that I were not?

I don't think the one who address him/herself as theist also has very strong believing in the existence of God. Believing in the existence of God depends on one's conduct and character, imo.

How does actually believing in the existence of God figure into that, Chinu?

Maybe it does not?

For example: I have seen many theists getting afraid of just two year child while doing any illegal/wrong work, But they don't fear omnipresent God when they are alone somewhere doing any illegal/wrong work. And such people aren't theists according to me

If you say so. That is an unusual understanding of the word, though.

 

[Gordian Knot]

There are two kind of persons.

1st: The one who believe in the existence of God
2nd: Who Doesn't believe in the existence of God.

Which One do you think is more faithful and loyal towards others and why ?

With all due respect, to suggest one over the other is naive. There are people who are faithful and loyal, and others who are not. The belief in God, or not, is not a deciding factor in how people will act.

 

[natasha levchenko]

There are two kind of persons.

1st: The one who believe in the existence of God
2nd: Who Doesn't believe in the existence of God.

Which One do you think is more faithful and loyal towards others and why ?

some people may pretend being good and devout and commit crime and cast veil over it. some devout believers also can do something bad .but all the time
they are trying to improve themselves.
Heb 4:12*For the word of God is alive and exerts power and is sharper than any two-edged sword and pierces even to the dividing of soul and spirit, and of joints and [their] marrow, and [is] able to discern thoughts and intentions of [the] heart. if a person wants to be better the Bible will be a nice adviser.

there is no cut separation between the 1st and 2nd. if i do want to do bad towards others i will no matter what religion I profess

 

[ChristineES]

There are two kind of persons.

1st: The one who believe in the existence of God
2nd: Who Doesn't believe in the existence of God.

Which One do you think is more faithful and loyal towards others and why ?

Personally, you can't truly judge someone about how loyal they are by whether they believe in God or not.

 

[Ingledsva]

This idea that people whom don't believe in a God are somehow more evil, or lacking morals, is outdated, ridiculous, and insulting.


Multiple studies have been done over the years showing that religious people commit as much crime as the non-religious.


"A growing body of social science research reveals that atheists, and non-religious people in general, are far from the unsavory beings many assume them to be. On basic questions of morality and human decency— issues such as governmental use of torture, the death penalty, punitive hitting of children, racism, sexism, homophobia, anti-Semitism, environmental degradation or human rights — the irreligious tend to be more ethical than their religious peers, particularly compared with those who describe themselves as very religious." - USC's RD Magazine

Dear, there's a very big difference between a religious person and the one who believe in the existence of God, Imo.

For example: I have seen many theists getting afraid of just two year child while doing any illegal/wrong work, But they don't fear omnipresent God when they are alone somewhere doing any illegal/wrong work. And such people aren't theists according to me

Which does not address my answer in relation to your original post.

Your original post implies there are differences in morality, trust, loyalty, and faithfulness, - between Theists and Non-Theists.

These ideas are outdated and ridiculous.



*

 

[Sabour]

No relation between belief in god and loyalty to others, yeah. In my view.

Well okay. Could be the case for some

Whether or not all religions are about peace and love and whether or not belief in god is beneficial and brings out the best in people.

I don't know how else to put it. May be if you rephrase the question.

My question was why do you think a person wouldn't view his religion's message to be peaceful and loving.

Well my point was is that maybe the problem is not the religion. Maybe the problem is that people are not willing to understand it.