WHO IS GOD'S TRUE ISRAEL IN THE NEW COVENANT?

[Monty]

Where does it say in the scriptures that Jesus parents did not believe He was a prophet? Not in any of the scriptures you posted above right? His brothers chose not to believe him. That is all the scriptures say. We should be careful not to read into the scriptures what is not written in them.

Where does the bible say that Jesus' parents and family believed that he was a prophet, given that Matt 13:57 obviously says they didn't and why he ignored them (Matt 12:46-50)?

 

[Monty]

Read the context you disregarded in the scripture you posted from Deuteronomy 17:8-13. Civil judgement for sin (context Deuteronomy 17:1-8) under the old covenant is not the same as interpretation of scripture given by God in the new covenant (John 7:`7; John 14:26; John 16:13; 1 John 2:27) to all those who believe and obey what Gods Word says (Acts 5:32; Acts 2:38; 3:19). Deuteronomy 17:8-13 does not say anywhere only Levite Priests can interpret scripture.

Jesus, however, said that every jot and tittle of OT law still applied till heaven and earth pass when all is fulfilled (Matt 5:17-19) including the commandments to abort the pregnancies of adulteresses (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-27).

 

[3rdAngel]

Where does the bible say that Jesus' parents and family believed that he was a prophet, given that Matt 13:57 obviously says they didn't and why he ignored them (Matt 12:46-50)?

I think you missed my post. None of the scriptures you posted say Jesus parents did not believe Jesus was a Prophet. You are reading that into the scripture. There is more scripture for example stating that Mary and Joseph believed Jesus was from God (see Luke 1:26-38; Matthew 1:18-25; Luke 2:22-38).

• Matthew 13:57 says 55, Is not this the carpenter's son? is not his mother called Mary? and his brothers, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas?56, And his sisters, are they not all with us? From where then has this man all these things? 57, And they were offended in him. But Jesus said to them, A prophet is not without honor, save in his own country, and in his own house.

The scripture is not saying anywhere that Jesus parents did not believe in Jesus.

• Matthew 12:46-50 46, While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brothers stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47, Then one said to him, Behold, your mother and your brothers stand without, desiring to speak with you. 48, But he answered and said to him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brothers? 49, And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brothers! 50, For whoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

Again these scriptures also do not say anywhere that Jesus parents did not believe in Jesus. They simply state that Gods true family is all those who choose to believe and obey what Gods Word says. Once again your reading into the scriptures what is not written in them.

Take Care

 

[3rdAngel]

Jesus, however, said that every jot and tittle of OT law still applied till heaven and earth pass when all is fulfilled (Matt 5:17-19) including the commandments to abort the pregnancies of adulteresses (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-27).

Not exactly. Did you notice the scriptures you quote do not match what you say again?

• Leviticus 20:10 10, And the man that commits adultery with another man's wife, even he that commits adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.
  
  
• Numbers 5:20-24 20, But if you have gone aside to another instead of your husband, and if you be defiled, and some man have lain with you beside your husband: 21, Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say to the woman, The LORD make you a curse and an oath among your people, when the LORD does make your thigh to rot, and your belly to swell; 22, And this water that causes the curse shall go into your bowels, to make your belly to swell, and your thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen. 23, And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water: 24, And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causes the curse: and the water that causes the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

You are reading into the scriptures what is not written in them again.

Take Care.

 

[Monty]

Not exactly. Did you notice the scriptures you quote do not match what you say again?

• Leviticus 20:10 10, And the man that commits adultery with another man's wife, even he that commits adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.
  
  
• Numbers 5:20-24 20, But if you have gone aside to another instead of your husband, and if you be defiled, and some man have lain with you beside your husband: 21, Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say to the woman, The LORD make you a curse and an oath among your people, when the LORD does make your thigh to rot, and your belly to swell; 22, And this water that causes the curse shall go into your bowels, to make your belly to swell, and your thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen. 23, And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water: 24, And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causes the curse: and the water that causes the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

You are reading into the scriptures what is not written in them again.

Take Care.

IOW the bible clearly commands the abortion of pregnancies of adulteresses (Leviticus 20:10 Numbers 5:20-28).
If you actually believe otherwise then what is your evidence that adulteresses never ever become pregnant?

Numbers 5:20-28 NIV -
20 But if you have gone astray(A) while married to your husband and you have made yourself impure by having sexual relations with a man other than your husband”— 21 here the priest is to put the woman under this curse(B)—“may the Lord cause you to become a curse[a] among your people when he makes your womb miscarry and your abdomen swell. 22 May this water(C) that brings a curse(D) enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.”
“‘Then the woman is to say, “Amen. So be it.(E)”
23 “‘The priest is to write these curses on a scroll(F) and then wash them off into the bitter water. 24 He shall make the woman drink the bitter water that brings a curse, and this water that brings a curse and causes bitter suffering will enter her. 25 The priest is to take from her hands the grain offering for jealousy, wave it before the Lord(G) and bring it to the altar. 26 The priest is then to take a handful of the grain offering as a memorial[b] offering(H) and burn it on the altar; after that, he is to have the woman drink the water. 27 If she has made herself impure and been unfaithful to her husband, this will be the result: When she is made to drink the water that brings a curse and causes bitter suffering, it will enter her, her abdomen will swell and her womb will miscarry, and she will become a curse.(I) 28 If, however, the woman has not made herself impure, but is clean, she will be cleared of guilt and will be able to have children.

 

[Monty]

I think you missed my post. None of the scriptures you posted say Jesus parents did not believe Jesus was a Prophet. You are reading that into the scripture. There is more scripture for example stating that Mary and Joseph believed Jesus was from God (see Luke 1:26-38; Matthew 1:18-25; Luke 2:22-38).

• Matthew 13:57 says 55, Is not this the carpenter's son? is not his mother called Mary? and his brothers, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas?56, And his sisters, are they not all with us? From where then has this man all these things? 57, And they were offended in him. But Jesus said to them, A prophet is not without honor, save in his own country, and in his own house.

The scripture is not saying anywhere that Jesus parents did not believe in Jesus.

• Matthew 12:46-50 46, While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brothers stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47, Then one said to him, Behold, your mother and your brothers stand without, desiring to speak with you. 48, But he answered and said to him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brothers? 49, And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brothers! 50, For whoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

Again these scriptures also do not say anywhere that Jesus parents did not believe in Jesus. They simply state that Gods true family is all those who choose to believe and obey what Gods Word says. Once again your reading into the scriptures what is not written in them.

Take Care

None of that changes the fact that the bible says that Jesus' parents and family didn't believe that he was a prophet and why he ignored them (Matt 13:57 12:46-50 John 7:5).

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Read the context you disregarded in the scripture you posted from Deuteronomy 17:8-13. Civil judgement for sin (context Deuteronomy 17:1-8) under the old covenant is not the same as interpretation of scripture given by God in the new covenant (John 7:`7; John 14:26; John 16:13; 1 John 2:27) to all those who believe and obey what Gods Word says (Acts 5:32; Acts 2:38; 3:19). Deuteronomy 17:8-13 does not say anywhere only Levite Priests can interpret scripture.

8 If cases come before your courts that are too difficult for you to judge—whether bloodshed, lawsuits or assaults—take them to the place the Lord your God will choose. 9 Go to the Levitical priests and to the judge who is in office at that time. Inquire of them and they will give you the verdict.

It says what it says. There is nothing you can say or argue to undo the fact that it establishes teh Levites and Judges as interpreters of the Law.

 

[3rdAngel]

IOW the bible clearly commands the abortion of pregnancies of adulteresses (Leviticus 20:10 Numbers 5:20-28).
If you actually believe otherwise then what is your evidence that adulteresses never ever become pregnant?

Numbers 5:20-28 NIV -
20 But if you have gone astray(A) while married to your husband and you have made yourself impure by having sexual relations with a man other than your husband”— 21 here the priest is to put the woman under this curse(B)—“may the Lord cause you to become a curse[a] among your people when he makes your womb miscarry and your abdomen swell. 22 May this water(C) that brings a curse(D) enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.”
“‘Then the woman is to say, “Amen. So be it.(E)”
23 “‘The priest is to write these curses on a scroll(F) and then wash them off into the bitter water. 24 He shall make the woman drink the bitter water that brings a curse, and this water that brings a curse and causes bitter suffering will enter her. 25 The priest is to take from her hands the grain offering for jealousy, wave it before the Lord(G) and bring it to the altar. 26 The priest is then to take a handful of the grain offering as a memorial[b] offering(H) and burn it on the altar; after that, he is to have the woman drink the water. 27 If she has made herself impure and been unfaithful to her husband, this will be the result: When she is made to drink the water that brings a curse and causes bitter suffering, it will enter her, her abdomen will swell and her womb will miscarry, and she will become a curse.(I) 28 If, however, the woman has not made herself impure, but is clean, she will be cleared of guilt and will be able to have children.

Nonsense. The scriptures in Numbers 5 are about testing a women faithfulness when the husband has a Spirit of jealousy thinking that the woman has been unfaithful. Its is not a judgement on a women already pregnant and condemned for unfaithfulness and a command for abortion. Again you are reading that into the scripture. Note also that Leviticus 20 has nothing to do with abortion.

• Leviticus 20:10 10, And the man that commits adultery with another man's wife, even he that commits adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

Note: This is a death penalty of a man and a women caught in open public adultery under the civil laws of Israel.

• Numbers 5:20-24 20, But if you have gone aside to another instead of your husband, and if you be defiled, and some man have lain with you beside your husband: 21, Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say to the woman, The LORD make you a curse and an oath among your people, when the LORD does make your thigh to rot, and your belly to swell; 22, And this water that causes the curse shall go into your bowels, to make your belly to swell, and your thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen. 23, And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water: 24, And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causes the curse: and the water that causes the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

Note: These scriptures are a testing curse to see if a women has been unfaithful. Note that when the husband has a Spirit of jealousy thinking that his wife has been unfaithful that this is a test to know if the women is being honest to God. Its is not a judgement on a women already pregnant and condemned for unfaithfulness and a command for abortion. Again you are reading that into the scripture. You are reading into the scriptures what is not written in them again.

Take Care.

 

[3rdAngel]

None of that changes the fact that the bible says that Jesus' parents and family didn't believe that he was a prophet and why he ignored them (Matt 13:57 12:46-50 John 7:5).

Of course it does. The scriptures posted to you prove Jesus parents believed Jesus was from God while there was nothing you posted that states Jesus parents did not believe Jesus was from God. Once again you are reading into the scriptures what is not written in the scriptures. See post # 183 linked.

 

[3rdAngel]

8 If cases come before your courts that are too difficult for you to judge—whether bloodshed, lawsuits or assaults—take them to the place the Lord your God will choose. 9 Go to the Levitical priests and to the judge who is in office at that time. Inquire of them and they will give you the verdict.

It says what it says. There is nothing you can say or argue to undo the fact that it establishes teh Levites and Judges as interpreters of the Law.

Yep it says what it says and there is nothing you can do to deny it is not saying what you are saying that only Levite Priests can interpret the scriptures in the new testament. Note the context you disregard in Deuteronomy 17:1-8 that prove these scriptures are in regards to the Levite Priest and civil judges making judgement to sin and not general interpretation of the scriptures not allowed by anyone else.

DEUTERONOMY 17:1-13

• 1, You shall not sacrifice to the LORD your God any bullock, or sheep, wherein is blemish, or any bad reputation: for that is an abomination to the LORD your God.
• 2, IF THERE BE FOUND AMONG YOU, WITHIN ANY OF YOUR GATES WHICH THE LORD YOUR GOD GIVES YOU, MAN OR WOMAN, THAT HAS WORKED WICKEDNESS IN THE SIGHT OF THE LORD YOUR GOD, IN TRANSGRESSING HIS COVENANT,
• 3, AND HAS GONE AND SERVED OTHER GODS, AND WORSHIPPED THEM, EITHER THE SUN, OR MOON, OR ANY OF THE HOST OF HEAVEN, WHICH I HAVE NOT COMMANDED;
• 4, AND IT BE TOLD YOU, AND YOU HAVE HEARD OF IT, AND INQUIRED DILIGENTLY, AND, BEHOLD, IT BE TRUE, AND THE THING CERTAIN, THAT SUCH ABOMINATION IS WORKED IN ISRAEL:
• 5, THEN SHALL YOU BRING FORTH THAT MAN OR THAT WOMAN, WHICH HAVE COMMITTED THAT WICKED THING, TO YOUR GATES, EVEN THAT MAN OR THAT WOMAN, AND SHALL STONE THEM WITH STONES, TILL THEY DIE.
• 6, AT THE MOUTH OF TWO WITNESSES, OR THREE WITNESSES, SHALL HE THAT IS WORTHY OF DEATH BE PUT TO DEATH; BUT AT THE MOUTH OF ONE WITNESS HE SHALL NOT BE PUT TO DEATH.
• 7, THE HANDS OF THE WITNESSES SHALL BE FIRST ON HIM TO PUT HIM TO DEATH, AND AFTERWARD THE HANDS OF ALL THE PEOPLE. SO YOU SHALL PUT THE EVIL AWAY FROM AMONG YOU.
• 8, IF THERE ARISE A MATTER TOO HARD FOR YOU IN JUDGMENT, BETWEEN BLOOD AND BLOOD, BETWEEN PLEA AND PLEA, AND BETWEEN STROKE AND STROKE, BEING MATTERS OF CONTROVERSY WITHIN YOUR GATES: THEN SHALL YOU ARISE, AND GET YOU UP INTO THE PLACE WHICH THE LORD YOUR GOD SHALL CHOOSE;
• 9, AND YOU SHALL COME TO THE PRIESTS THE LEVITES, AND TO THE JUDGE THAT SHALL BE IN THOSE DAYS, AND INQUIRE; AND THEY SHALL SHOW YOU THE SENTENCE OF JUDGMENT:
• 10, And you shall do according to the sentence, which they of that place which the LORD shall choose shall show you; and you shall observe to do according to all that they inform you:
• 11, According to the sentence of the law which they shall teach you, and according to the judgment which they shall tell you, you shall do: you shall not decline from the sentence which they shall show you, to the right hand, nor to the left.
• 12, And the man that will do presumptuously, and will not listen to the priest that stands to minister there before the LORD your God, or to the judge, even that man shall die: and you shall put away the evil from Israel.
• 13, And all the people shall hear, and fear, and do no more presumptuously.

Did you note that Deuteronomy 17:8-13 does not say anywhere only Levite Priests can interpret scripture. Read the context you disregarded in the scripture you posted from Deuteronomy 17:8-13. Civil judgement for sin (context Deuteronomy 17:1-8) under the old covenant is not the same as interpretation of scripture given by God in the new covenant (John 7:`7; John 14:26; John 16:13; 1 John 2:27) to all those who believe and obey what Gods Word says (Acts 5:32; Acts 2:38; 3:19).

Take Care.

 

[Monty]

IOW Jesus' parents and family didn't believe that he was a prophet and why he ignored them (Matt 13:57 12:46-50 John 7:5).

IOW Jesus' parents and family didn't believe that he was a prophet and why he ignored them (Matt 13:57 12:46-50 John 7:5).

Of course it does. The scriptures posted to you prove Jesus parents believed Jesus was from God while there was nothing you posted that states Jesus parents did not believe Jesus was from God. Once again you are reading into the scriptures what is not written in the scriptures. See post # 183 linked.

Doesn't change the fact that the bible says that Jesus parents and family didn't believe that he was a prophet and why he ignored them (Matt 13:57 12:46-50 John 7:5). And what evidence do you have that his parents believed that he was from a god, given that his biological father was thought to be Heli's son (Luke 3:23) presumably based on a relationship between Heli's son (coincidently also named Joseph) and Joachime's daughter (Mary).

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Yep it says what it says and there is nothing you can do to deny it is not saying what you are saying that only Levite Priests can interpret the scriptures in the new testament. Note the context you disregard in Deuteronomy 17:1-8 that prove these scriptures are in regards to the Levite Priest and civil judges making judgement to sin and not general interpretation of the scriptures not allowed by anyone else.

DEUTERONOMY 17:1-13

• 1, You shall not sacrifice to the LORD your God any bullock, or sheep, wherein is blemish, or any bad reputation: for that is an abomination to the LORD your God.
• 2, IF THERE BE FOUND AMONG YOU, WITHIN ANY OF YOUR GATES WHICH THE LORD YOUR GOD GIVES YOU, MAN OR WOMAN, THAT HAS WORKED WICKEDNESS IN THE SIGHT OF THE LORD YOUR GOD, IN TRANSGRESSING HIS COVENANT,
• 3, AND HAS GONE AND SERVED OTHER GODS, AND WORSHIPPED THEM, EITHER THE SUN, OR MOON, OR ANY OF THE HOST OF HEAVEN, WHICH I HAVE NOT COMMANDED;
• 4, AND IT BE TOLD YOU, AND YOU HAVE HEARD OF IT, AND INQUIRED DILIGENTLY, AND, BEHOLD, IT BE TRUE, AND THE THING CERTAIN, THAT SUCH ABOMINATION IS WORKED IN ISRAEL:
• 5, THEN SHALL YOU BRING FORTH THAT MAN OR THAT WOMAN, WHICH HAVE COMMITTED THAT WICKED THING, TO YOUR GATES, EVEN THAT MAN OR THAT WOMAN, AND SHALL STONE THEM WITH STONES, TILL THEY DIE.
• 6, AT THE MOUTH OF TWO WITNESSES, OR THREE WITNESSES, SHALL HE THAT IS WORTHY OF DEATH BE PUT TO DEATH; BUT AT THE MOUTH OF ONE WITNESS HE SHALL NOT BE PUT TO DEATH.
• 7, THE HANDS OF THE WITNESSES SHALL BE FIRST ON HIM TO PUT HIM TO DEATH, AND AFTERWARD THE HANDS OF ALL THE PEOPLE. SO YOU SHALL PUT THE EVIL AWAY FROM AMONG YOU.
• 8, IF THERE ARISE A MATTER TOO HARD FOR YOU IN JUDGMENT, BETWEEN BLOOD AND BLOOD, BETWEEN PLEA AND PLEA, AND BETWEEN STROKE AND STROKE, BEING MATTERS OF CONTROVERSY WITHIN YOUR GATES: THEN SHALL YOU ARISE, AND GET YOU UP INTO THE PLACE WHICH THE LORD YOUR GOD SHALL CHOOSE;
• 9, AND YOU SHALL COME TO THE PRIESTS THE LEVITES, AND TO THE JUDGE THAT SHALL BE IN THOSE DAYS, AND INQUIRE; AND THEY SHALL SHOW YOU THE SENTENCE OF JUDGMENT:
• 10, And you shall do according to the sentence, which they of that place which the LORD shall choose shall show you; and you shall observe to do according to all that they inform you:
• 11, According to the sentence of the law which they shall teach you, and according to the judgment which they shall tell you, you shall do: you shall not decline from the sentence which they shall show you, to the right hand, nor to the left.
• 12, And the man that will do presumptuously, and will not listen to the priest that stands to minister there before the LORD your God, or to the judge, even that man shall die: and you shall put away the evil from Israel.
• 13, And all the people shall hear, and fear, and do no more presumptuously.

Did you note that Deuteronomy 17:8-13 does not say anywhere only Levite Priests can interpret scripture. Read the context you disregarded in the scripture you posted from Deuteronomy 17:8-13. Civil judgement for sin (context Deuteronomy 17:1-8) under the old covenant is not the same as interpretation of scripture given by God in the new covenant (John 7:`7; John 14:26; John 16:13; 1 John 2:27) to all those who believe and obey what Gods Word says (Acts 5:32; Acts 2:38; 3:19).

Take Care.

OMG you just don't know how to write a post that is concise. Like I've told you many times, when you do this, I just don't bother reading it.

I quoted the relevant verses. Their meaning was clear. That pretty much ends the matter. I'm moving on.

 

[Monty]

Nonsense. The scriptures in Numbers 5 are about testing a women faithfulness when the husband has a Spirit of jealousy thinking that the woman has been unfaithful. Its is not a judgement on a women already pregnant and condemned for unfaithfulness and a command for abortion. Again you are reading that into the scripture. Note also that Leviticus 20 has nothing to do with abortion.

• Leviticus 20:10 10, And the man that commits adultery with another man's wife, even he that commits adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

Note: This is a death penalty of a man and a women caught in open public adultery under the civil laws of Israel.

• Numbers 5:20-24 20, But if you have gone aside to another instead of your husband, and if you be defiled, and some man have lain with you beside your husband: 21, Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say to the woman, The LORD make you a curse and an oath among your people, when the LORD does make your thigh to rot, and your belly to swell; 22, And this water that causes the curse shall go into your bowels, to make your belly to swell, and your thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen. 23, And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water: 24, And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causes the curse: and the water that causes the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

Note: These scriptures are a testing curse to see if a women has been unfaithful. Note that when the husband has a Spirit of jealousy thinking that his wife has been unfaithful that this is a test to know if the women is being honest to God. Its is not a judgement on a women already pregnant and condemned for unfaithfulness and a command for abortion. Again you are reading that into the scripture. You are reading into the scriptures what is not written in them again.

Take Care.

Nonsense.
None of that changes the unequivocal fact that the bible clearly commands the pregnancies of adulteresses to be aborted because of the property rights of men and their ownership of women (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-28). And unless you can present evidence that adulteresses never ever become pregnant then you are just grasping at straws. But it's your choice if you don't believe what the bible actually says and means.

Numbers 5:22 - Bible Gateway

CSB May this water that brings a curse enter your stomach, causing your belly to swell and your womb to shrivel.’ “And the woman will reply, ‘Amen, Amen.’
CEB And may the water that brings these curses enter your stomach and make your womb discharge and make you miscarry.” And the woman will say, “I agree, I agree.”
CJB May this water that causes the curse go into your inner parts and make your abdomen swell and your private parts shrivel up!” — and the woman is to respond, “Amen! Amen!”
ERV The priest must say, ‘You must drink this water that causes trouble. If you have sinned, you will not be able to have children. Any baby you have will die before it is born.’ And the woman should say, ‘I agree to do as you say.’
EXB This water that brings a curse will go inside you and make your ·stomach get big [or uterus drop] and make your ·body unable to give birth to another baby [womb discharge; L your thigh waste away/wither; 5:21].” “‘The woman must say, “I agree.”
GW ‘May this water that can bring a curse go into your body and make your stomach swell and your uterus drop!’ “Then the woman will say, ‘Amen, amen!’
NOG ‘May this water that can bring a curse go into your body and make your stomach swell and your uterus drop!’ “Then the woman will say, ‘Amen, amen!’
NABRE May this water, then, that brings a curse, enter your bowels to make your belly swell and your uterus fall!” And the woman shall say, “Amen, amen!”
NIV May this water that brings a curse enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.” “‘Then the woman is to say, “Amen. So be it.”
NRSVA now may this water that brings the curse enter your bowels and make your womb discharge, your uterus drop!’ And the woman shall say, ‘Amen. Amen.’
VOICE If you are guilty, may this curse-causing water run through your bowels, make your belly swell, and your womb miscarry.” And the woman shall say, “Amen. Let it be so.”

 

[3rdAngel]

Doesn't change the fact that the bible says that Jesus parents and family didn't believe that he was a prophet and why he ignored them (Matt 13:57 12:46-50 John 7:5). And what evidence do you have that his parents believed that he was from a god, given that his biological father was thought to be Heli's son (Luke 3:23) presumably based on a relationship between Heli's son (coincidently also named Joseph) and Joachime's daughter (Mary).

See post # 183 linked that is in disagreement with you and goes through the scriptures in detail that you choose to ignore and proves what you are posting is unbiblical. There is no scripture that says Jesus parents rejected him or did not believe he was of God. Your making that up. You are just repeating yourself while ignoring the posts and scriptures that prove what you are saying is not true.

 

[3rdAngel]

Nonsense.
None of that changes the unequivocal fact that the bible clearly commands the pregnancies of adulteresses to be aborted because of the property rights of men and their ownership of women (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-28). And unless you can present evidence that adulteresses never ever become pregnant then you are just grasping at straws. But it's your choice if you don't believe what the bible actually says and means.

Numbers 5:22 - Bible Gateway

CSB May this water that brings a curse enter your stomach, causing your belly to swell and your womb to shrivel.’ “And the woman will reply, ‘Amen, Amen.’
CEB And may the water that brings these curses enter your stomach and make your womb discharge and make you miscarry.” And the woman will say, “I agree, I agree.”
CJB May this water that causes the curse go into your inner parts and make your abdomen swell and your private parts shrivel up!” — and the woman is to respond, “Amen! Amen!”
ERV The priest must say, ‘You must drink this water that causes trouble. If you have sinned, you will not be able to have children. Any baby you have will die before it is born.’ And the woman should say, ‘I agree to do as you say.’
EXB This water that brings a curse will go inside you and make your ·stomach get big [or uterus drop] and make your ·body unable to give birth to another baby [womb discharge; L your thigh waste away/wither; 5:21].” “‘The woman must say, “I agree.”
GW ‘May this water that can bring a curse go into your body and make your stomach swell and your uterus drop!’ “Then the woman will say, ‘Amen, amen!’
NOG ‘May this water that can bring a curse go into your body and make your stomach swell and your uterus drop!’ “Then the woman will say, ‘Amen, amen!’
NABRE May this water, then, that brings a curse, enter your bowels to make your belly swell and your uterus fall!” And the woman shall say, “Amen, amen!”
NIV May this water that brings a curse enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.” “‘Then the woman is to say, “Amen. So be it.”
NRSVA now may this water that brings the curse enter your bowels and make your womb discharge, your uterus drop!’ And the woman shall say, ‘Amen. Amen.’
VOICE If you are guilty, may this curse-causing water run through your bowels, make your belly swell, and your womb miscarry.” And the woman shall say, “Amen. Let it be so.”

Wrong! Which bible translation do you think God is commanding forced abortion? There is nothing you have posted here that is in disagreement with what I have already shared with you from the scriptures accept your interpretation of what those scriptures are saying and your claims that Leviticus 20:10 and Numbers 5:20-24 teaches God commanding forced abortion. Lets examine if any of these scriptures teach forced abortion so there is no more wiggle room left for you.

• Leviticus 20:10 10, And the man that commits adultery with another man's wife, even he that commits adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

Note: This is a death penalty of a man and a women caught in open public adultery under the civil laws of Israel. There is nothing at all in Leviticus 20 like you claimed earlier that is even talking about abortion now is there.

• Numbers 5:11-31 11, And the LORD spoke to Moses, saying, 12, Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them, If any man's wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him. 13, And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner; 14, And the spirit of jealousy come on him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be defiled: or if the spirit of jealousy come on him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be not defiled: 15, Then shall the man bring his wife to the priest, and he shall bring her offering for her, the tenth part of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil on it, nor put frankincense thereon; for it is an offering of jealousy, an offering of memorial, bringing iniquity to remembrance. 16, And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the LORD: 17, And the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel; and of the dust that is in the floor of the tabernacle the priest shall take, and put it into the water: 18, And the priest shall set the woman before the LORD, and uncover the woman's head, and put the offering of memorial in her hands, which is the jealousy offering: and the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that causes the curse: 19, And the priest shall charge her by an oath, and say to the woman, If no man have lain with you, and if you have not gone aside to uncleanness with another instead of your husband, be you free from this bitter water that causes the curse. 20, But if you have gone aside to another instead of your husband, and if you be defiled, and some man have lain with you beside your husband: 21, Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say to the woman, The LORD make you a curse and an oath among your people, when the LORD does make your thigh to rot, and your belly to swell; 22, And this water that causes the curse shall go into your bowels, to make your belly to swell, and your thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen. 23, And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water: 24, And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causes the curse: and the water that causes the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter. 25, Then the priest shall take the jealousy offering out of the woman's hand, and shall wave the offering before the LORD, and offer it on the altar: 26, And the priest shall take an handful of the offering, even the memorial thereof, and burn it on the altar, and afterward shall cause the woman to drink the water. 27, And when he has made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causes the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people. 28, And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed. 29, This is the law of jealousies, when a wife goes aside to another instead of her husband, and is defiled; 30, Or when the spirit of jealousy comes on him, and he be jealous over his wife, and shall set the woman before the LORD, and the priest shall execute on her all this law. 31, Then shall the man be guiltless from iniquity, and this woman shall bear her iniquity.

Note: These scriptures in Numbers 5 with the full context added in is the law of jealousy curse. It is not a judgement for abortion and no where in these scriptures is it talking about abortion. Numbers 5:11-31 is a testing curse to see if a women has been unfaithful or unfaithful. Note that when the husband has a Spirit of jealousy thinking that his wife has been unfaithful that this is a test to know if the women is being honest to God. Its is not a judgement on a women already pregnant and condemned for unfaithfulness and a command for abortion. Again you are reading that into the scripture. You are reading into the scriptures what is not written in them again.

Now to leave you no wiggle room post me a single scripture with context that is God commanding forced abortion. You cannot because there is none. You need to read that into the scriptures because it is not there. It does not matter what version of the bible you use not a single bible translation is talking about God commanding forced abortion in Leviticus 20 or in Numbers 5. Receive Gods correction and be blessed ignoring it does not make the scriptures disappear. You are peddling false teachings.

Take Care.

 

[3rdAngel]

OMG you just don't know how to write a post that is concise. Like I've told you many times, when you do this, I just don't bother reading it.
I quoted the relevant verses. Their meaning was clear. That pretty much ends the matter. I'm moving on.

Post # 190 linked, proves from the scriptures and the scripture context you chose to disregard why your claims that only Levite Priest can interpret scripture is unbiblical and your unwillingness to address this post only proves to me you are unable to do so. Receive Gods correction and be blessed. Ignoring Gods Word that is in disagreement with you does not make it disappear.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Post # 190 linked, proves from the scriptures and the scripture context you chose to disregard why your claims that only Levite Priest can interpret scripture is unbiblical and your unwillingness to address this post only proves to me you are unable to do so. Receive Gods correction and be blessed. Ignoring Gods Word that is in disagreement with you does not make it disappear.

3rdAngel: you quoted the ENTIRE CHAPTER when in fact the only verses that are relevant to our discussion are verses 8-13, and of those, only verses 8 and 9 are essential. There is something seriously wrong that you cannot be succinct, and as I've said, when you do this, I just ignore your post.

 

[Monty]

Wrong! Which bible translation do you think God is commanding forced abortion? There is nothing you have posted here that is in disagreement with what I have already shared with you from the scriptures accept your interpretation of what those scriptures are saying and your claims that Leviticus 20:10 and Numbers 5:20-24 teaches God commanding forced abortion. Lets examine if any of these scriptures teach forced abortion so there is no more wiggle room left for you.

• Leviticus 20:10 10, And the man that commits adultery with another man's wife, even he that commits adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

Note: This is a death penalty of a man and a women caught in open public adultery under the civil laws of Israel. There is nothing at all in Leviticus 20 like you claimed earlier that is even talking about abortion now is there.

• Numbers 5:11-31 11, And the LORD spoke to Moses, saying, 12, Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them, If any man's wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him. 13, And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner; 14, And the spirit of jealousy come on him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be defiled: or if the spirit of jealousy come on him, and he be jealous of his wife, and she be not defiled: 15, Then shall the man bring his wife to the priest, and he shall bring her offering for her, the tenth part of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil on it, nor put frankincense thereon; for it is an offering of jealousy, an offering of memorial, bringing iniquity to remembrance. 16, And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the LORD: 17, And the priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel; and of the dust that is in the floor of the tabernacle the priest shall take, and put it into the water: 18, And the priest shall set the woman before the LORD, and uncover the woman's head, and put the offering of memorial in her hands, which is the jealousy offering: and the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that causes the curse: 19, And the priest shall charge her by an oath, and say to the woman, If no man have lain with you, and if you have not gone aside to uncleanness with another instead of your husband, be you free from this bitter water that causes the curse. 20, But if you have gone aside to another instead of your husband, and if you be defiled, and some man have lain with you beside your husband: 21, Then the priest shall charge the woman with an oath of cursing, and the priest shall say to the woman, The LORD make you a curse and an oath among your people, when the LORD does make your thigh to rot, and your belly to swell; 22, And this water that causes the curse shall go into your bowels, to make your belly to swell, and your thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen. 23, And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water: 24, And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causes the curse: and the water that causes the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter. 25, Then the priest shall take the jealousy offering out of the woman's hand, and shall wave the offering before the LORD, and offer it on the altar: 26, And the priest shall take an handful of the offering, even the memorial thereof, and burn it on the altar, and afterward shall cause the woman to drink the water. 27, And when he has made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causes the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people. 28, And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed. 29, This is the law of jealousies, when a wife goes aside to another instead of her husband, and is defiled; 30, Or when the spirit of jealousy comes on him, and he be jealous over his wife, and shall set the woman before the LORD, and the priest shall execute on her all this law. 31, Then shall the man be guiltless from iniquity, and this woman shall bear her iniquity.

Note: These scriptures in Numbers 5 with the full context added in is the law of jealousy curse. It is not a judgement for abortion and no where in these scriptures is it talking about abortion. Numbers 5:11-31 is a testing curse to see if a women has been unfaithful or unfaithful. Note that when the husband has a Spirit of jealousy thinking that his wife has been unfaithful that this is a test to know if the women is being honest to God. Its is not a judgement on a women already pregnant and condemned for unfaithfulness and a command for abortion. Again you are reading that into the scripture. You are reading into the scriptures what is not written in them again.

Now to leave you no wiggle room post me a single scripture with context that is God commanding forced abortion. You cannot because there is none. You need to read that into the scriptures because it is not there. It does not matter what version of the bible you use not a single bible translation is talking about God commanding forced abortion in Leviticus 20 or in Numbers 5. Receive Gods correction and be blessed ignoring it does not make the scriptures disappear. You are peddling false teachings.

Take Care.

That's your choice if you don't believe what the bible actually says and means. But it doesn't change the fact that the bible commands that the pregnancies of adulteresses be aborted because of the property rights of men who own the women (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-27)

Numbers 5:22-23 CEB -
22 And may the water that brings these curses enter your stomach and make your womb discharge and make you miscarry.”
And the woman will say, “I agree, I agree.”
23 The priest will write these curses in the scroll and wipe them off into the water of bitterness.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

That's your choice if you don't believe what the bible actually says and means. But it doesn't change the fact that the bible commands that the pregnancies of adulteresses be aborted because of the property rights of men who own the women (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-27)

Numbers 5:22-23 CEB -
22 And may the water that brings these curses enter your stomach and make your womb discharge and make you miscarry.”
And the woman will say, “I agree, I agree.”
23 The priest will write these curses in the scroll and wipe them off into the water of bitterness.

I think you have a profound misunderstanding of the passage.

It is a response to the fact that some men have irrational jealousy, imagining that their wives are having affairs when they are not. The water of bitterness of course has no affect, and the jealous husband is mollified.

 

[Monty]

See post # 183 linked that is in disagreement with you and goes through the scriptures in detail that you choose to ignore and proves what you are posting is unbiblical. There is no scripture that says Jesus parents rejected him or did not believe he was of God. Your making that up. You are just repeating yourself while ignoring the posts and scriptures that prove what you are saying is not true.

You're just wasting your time, since none of your cherry picking changes the fact that the bible says that Jesus' parents and family didn't believe that he was a prophet (Matt 13:57 Mark 6:4 John 7:5) and why he rejected them (Matt 12:46-50 Mark 3:31-35 Luke 8:19-21).
And it's your choice if you don't believe what the bible actually says and means.