AbuQuteiba
Active Member
TehuTi said:
Could you please put the exact reference to every hadeeth on here?
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Who wrote the Quran, and is it infallible ?
- Thread starter michel
- Start date
Could you please put the exact reference to every hadeeth on here?
AbuQuteiba
Active Member
Laila said:
The Prophet Muhammed(SAWS) was an illiterate. Allah(SWT) says in the Holy Qur'an:
[157] "Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (Scriptures) - in the Law and the Gospel - for he commands them what is just and forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure); he releases them from their heavy burdens and from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honour him, help him, and follow the Light which is sent down with him, it is they who will prosper."
[158] Say: "O men! I am sent unto you all, as the Messenger of Allah, to Whom belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth: there is no god but He: it is He that giveth both life and death. So believe in Allah and His Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, who believed in Allah and His Words: follow him that (so) ye may be guided."[7.157-158]
Wallahu A'lam
Popeyesays
Well-Known Member
Submission.org is an Islamic site, but it is a site most Muslims will be uncomfortable with. The people who run submission.org do not accept ANY hadith . . . period.
Regards,
Scott
Regards,
Scott
AbuQuteiba
Active Member
gnostic said:
The Qur'an holds the main (general) message of the Islam. The Prophet(SAWS)'s sayings and actions are what make The Message practical. The Qur'an is indeed, all Muslims need. It refers us to the Prophets sunnah, example--(authentic hadeeth).
YmirGF
Bodhisattva in Recovery
I have always been fascinated what a psychiatrist would make of people who have a penchant for this sort of linguistic abuse. Like, It Is So Difficult And Unnatural To Capitalize Each Word In A Sentence, That It Can Only Be A Distinct Conscious Effort. To me, it says a lot about the person typing in those terms. Add to that the odd penchant for using words that do not exist, like "overstand". To me, it sounds like he/she/it is saying "understand" or "overplay" or something. Who knows, really.Popeyesays said:
Then you look at the "all knowing" context of the diatribe and it really does make, what is perhaps a "thinking" person, wonder about the writer's grasp of reality. What's with that Scott? You're a smart guy, I'd be interested in your stance on this. Are folks like this a sandwhich shy of a picnic perchance? Now being a good member of RF, I could never directly suggest such a thing, but some people might think just that. What do you think Scott? Is it nothing more than a need for attention perhaps?
Popeyesays
Well-Known Member
YmirGF said:
I wouldn't say one stitch short of a bedsheet; however, it shows that normal communication and thought and more importantly communicating one's thoughts in a way which can be understood have been given up as impossible by the person who uses such stylistic nonsense.
Marshall McCluhan was a brilliant man in many ways, but the MASSAGE rarely includes much message., and the media really only is an attempt to communicate, or it's pointless.
Regards,
Scott
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
Cannot speak for the others in terms of motive but the Messenger was offered everything of this world to get him to stop, money, women, property, slaves, camels goats. etc. the keys to kabba, and kingship over them. The Messenger of Allah said if you were to put the sun in my right hand and the moon in my left NEVER WILL I STOP MY MESSAGE WHICH IS FROM GOD.YmirGF said:
I disagree the evidence of God is evident through His attributes such as He is the Creator and all things are created with design involved not hap hazard. Like an explosion. A controled explosion like the big bang where order came and not chaos.
That would all depend on if their source is absolute truth, which is unaltered. If your souce is 100% truth then they will not have a meaningful rebuttal if it is flawed anyway then people will expose it and put it out. The problem really lies in the knowledge of hte people. And the student who is asked is generally the one who leads. So it is the ignorant and blind leading the blind. Blind to truth that is.
Again it depends on the account and whether or not you heard the story from the fisherman himself or someone he told it to. In islams case we have the Quran still it has not been changed.
From his and the testimony of his enemies in terms of his character. Even after the fact they knew he was not lying. He never lied ever. This is something the enemy testifies to. If your enemy told you you are a truthful person I would have to believe him. For if he said something good about you it would amaze me knowing the hatred he has for you.
Again from the testimony of others. A christian is the one who told Muhammed that it was Gabriel.
That would depend on whether or not you beleive Muhammed and all the others before him like the jews, and christians when they have mentioned him.
Well then let us examine his integrity. Read the Abab al Mufrad by Sahih Bukhari or a book called the ideal muslim. That is the akhlaq or personal morality of the Messenger. May I will start a post on it from these books for I have them both.
Again I cannot speak about the others like Baha'u'llah but we know the validity of Musa, Ibrahim, and Issa through the testimony of God Almight and His Messenger Muhammed. He is validated by not only his people but his enemies. This is something that is not questioned. If you are truly a Messenger of Allah then what you say is truth absolute without error. For Allah makes no errors. If there are mistakes then it is through human error and not Allah, that is why the Quran is the criterion or measure of truth for us. For it is Allah's words not Muhammed's and it has not been changed or altered and is under the protection of Allah as stated within the text.
When you say what he said. It is different for us. For Allah tells us to believe in the Messenger. There is a post i did authority of the Sunnah from the Quran. And someone would have to be pretty arrogant to think that they can come up with something better then Allah's word. Allah has already challenged people to try and come up with something similar to the Quran. You know this alreay.
No they accept it because this is what Allah commands the believers to do. Allah said that the Quran is truth. Besides the Prophet pbuh did not know any of these answers before Allah gave them to him. Neither did any of his people. If you read the poetry of that day it is not very phylisophical. It is just observations. The arabs were not corrupted by the methodologies of the Greeks and Romans nor by the wealth of those nations. They were simple people liveing a simple life and their religion reflected that. Nothing real indept as far as religous concepts. They made an idol prayed to it and held on to some virtures. Like loyalty, courage, etc.
Sure look at what they have done and compare to others. Islam as I am sure you know is very indepth in terms of literature to look over. We look at what all the scholars said and try to learn from them.
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
Hope this helps The Authority and Importance of the Sunnah - Religious Educationgnostic said:
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
Did not what write the Quran. Well there are many verses where Allah is addressing him directly besides the Prophet was unlettered of a people who were mostly unlettered. As stated in the Quran 62:2Apple Pie said:
And Quran is not the only authority in our religion we have the authentic hadith.
Almost every christian I speak with. It is the word of God as they say.
Like who, what is your evidence. Give the source the if it is wikiislam you are misguided for that is not a source.
What is alright for you to lie and make up things about Islam.
Where is your evidence.
the Torah was a revealed book of Moses and since the jews altered it it is no longer the Torah given to Moses. It is something else. Where is your evidence for any of this.
And since when as I and many others have said is that a source. Guess this is why you are misguided.
then it is no wonder you are misguided. Take sources from something anyone can edit.
It is obvious you are lying. For if you read it you would know it is not a copy of the bible.
Besides the bible is a copy of itself. And it is still a work in progress. Meaning you guys still change it.
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
Ma'sha Allah Thank you Scott for your posts in defense of our nabi and religion. :clapPopeyesays said:
Popeyesays
Well-Known Member
Someone (I think Ymir) said:
In effect, are not the followers of the various religions simply saying, What he said! because they themselves cannot think of anything better?
I don't think "Because He said so" is a logically sound argument. You might find this essay interesting:
http://bahai-library.com/file.php5?file=abizadeh_moral_reasoning&language=All
First couple paragraphs:
Published in the Bahá'í Studies Review, vol. 5.1 (1995)
My aim here is to deal with one faulty way of justifying a normative Bahá'í position, not because it carries any serious philosophical weight, but because of its apparent popularity amongst those who wish to eliminate, right at the outset, any need for further moral reflection and consultation. This is the "because-Bahá'u'lláh-said-so" school of thought. Such-and-such is wrong, it is asserted tout court, because Bahá'u'lláh said it is wrong, and no other reason need be provided. This "answer", though philosophically bankrupt, is rhetorically powerful, because its proponents can immediately end any dissent by making agreement with them seem like a matter of faithfulness to the Covenant.(1) Because the rhetorical power of pulling the "Covenant card" here heralds an end to the independent investigation of truth and consultation, it is a particularly insidious non-answer that we would do well to consider carefully.
Let us first distinguish two senses of saying that x is wrong because Bahá'u'lláh says it is wrong (where x is some activity, action, state of affairs, etc). First, one might simply be asserting that Bahá'u'lláh's saying that x is wrong gives us a (peremptory) reason for believing that it is so. Much of the rhetorical power of the because-Bahá'u'lláh-said-so school rests on this intuition. But this is besides the point when one is engaged in moral justification. When we demand the basis of the Bahá'í normative position on x, we are asking for (a) the philosophical justification of the position that x is wrong, and not for (b) the reason for the belief that it is so, or for the moral agent's reason for action according to that position.(2)
One may, for example, have very good reasons for believing that something is true, but without knowing the reasons why it is that it is true. Second, one might be asserting that Bahá'u'lláh (or God) saying that morality is such and such makes it so. That is, one might adopt the position of divine voluntarism, which holds that the moral good is the moral good simply because it is willed as the moral good by the divine Will. Here then, one could reject the because-Bahá'u'lláh-said-so school by rejecting voluntarism. One would accuse the school of getting it backwards: x is not wrong because Bahá'u'lláh said it is wrong, rather, Bahá'u'lláh said it is wrong because it is wrong.(3) But I wish to remain agnostic on this issue, and leave open the possibility, without committing myself to it, that Bahá'í ethics presupposes divine voluntarism. For example, one might cite, in favour of a voluntarist position, the passage in The Kitáb-i-Aqdas in which Bahá'u'lláh urges religious leaders not to judge the word of God by their own prevalent standards since God's word itself is the standard of right and wrong, truth and error: "the Book itself is the unerring Balance established amongst men" (¶99). This passage need not at all be taken to be one in support of the voluntarist position, but my argument here does not depend on settling that issue one way or the other. . . .
Regards,
Scott
In effect, are not the followers of the various religions simply saying, What he said! because they themselves cannot think of anything better?
I don't think "Because He said so" is a logically sound argument. You might find this essay interesting:
http://bahai-library.com/file.php5?file=abizadeh_moral_reasoning&language=All
First couple paragraphs:
Because Baha'u'llah said so: dealing with a non-starter in moral reasoning
by Arash Abizadeh
by Arash Abizadeh
Published in and html formatted by the Bahá'í Studies Review, vol. 5.1 (1995).
Mirrored with permission from
http://bahai-library.com/bsr/bsr05/57_abizadeh_because.htm.
Copyright restrictions apply.
Mirrored with permission from
http://bahai-library.com/bsr/bsr05/57_abizadeh_because.htm.
Copyright restrictions apply.
Published in the Bahá'í Studies Review, vol. 5.1 (1995)
My aim here is to deal with one faulty way of justifying a normative Bahá'í position, not because it carries any serious philosophical weight, but because of its apparent popularity amongst those who wish to eliminate, right at the outset, any need for further moral reflection and consultation. This is the "because-Bahá'u'lláh-said-so" school of thought. Such-and-such is wrong, it is asserted tout court, because Bahá'u'lláh said it is wrong, and no other reason need be provided. This "answer", though philosophically bankrupt, is rhetorically powerful, because its proponents can immediately end any dissent by making agreement with them seem like a matter of faithfulness to the Covenant.(1) Because the rhetorical power of pulling the "Covenant card" here heralds an end to the independent investigation of truth and consultation, it is a particularly insidious non-answer that we would do well to consider carefully.
Let us first distinguish two senses of saying that x is wrong because Bahá'u'lláh says it is wrong (where x is some activity, action, state of affairs, etc). First, one might simply be asserting that Bahá'u'lláh's saying that x is wrong gives us a (peremptory) reason for believing that it is so. Much of the rhetorical power of the because-Bahá'u'lláh-said-so school rests on this intuition. But this is besides the point when one is engaged in moral justification. When we demand the basis of the Bahá'í normative position on x, we are asking for (a) the philosophical justification of the position that x is wrong, and not for (b) the reason for the belief that it is so, or for the moral agent's reason for action according to that position.(2)
One may, for example, have very good reasons for believing that something is true, but without knowing the reasons why it is that it is true. Second, one might be asserting that Bahá'u'lláh (or God) saying that morality is such and such makes it so. That is, one might adopt the position of divine voluntarism, which holds that the moral good is the moral good simply because it is willed as the moral good by the divine Will. Here then, one could reject the because-Bahá'u'lláh-said-so school by rejecting voluntarism. One would accuse the school of getting it backwards: x is not wrong because Bahá'u'lláh said it is wrong, rather, Bahá'u'lláh said it is wrong because it is wrong.(3) But I wish to remain agnostic on this issue, and leave open the possibility, without committing myself to it, that Bahá'í ethics presupposes divine voluntarism. For example, one might cite, in favour of a voluntarist position, the passage in The Kitáb-i-Aqdas in which Bahá'u'lláh urges religious leaders not to judge the word of God by their own prevalent standards since God's word itself is the standard of right and wrong, truth and error: "the Book itself is the unerring Balance established amongst men" (¶99). This passage need not at all be taken to be one in support of the voluntarist position, but my argument here does not depend on settling that issue one way or the other. . . .
Regards,
Scott
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
No the recitation is the original. Take any Quran anywhere change one letter of it. give it to a hafiz and see if he will accept it or not notice your addition.TehuTi said:
So list them
The Koran Was Revealed In The Dialect Of The Prophet Muhammad
(Koran 43:2, 106:1).
Muslims Say It Was In Muhammad's Dialect
And His Dialect Was The Quraish Dialect Which They
Say Was Not The Most Intelligent Dialect. [/quote] Who is they? you?
Neither did the Ansar. Neither did most of arabia for Quraish was the guardians of the Kabba.
Wow, I did not realize you had created a time machine and went back and got the companions who learned the Quran from Muhammed and then wrote it down with the marks of punctuation.
So you are saying the companions did not know the Quran. Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthman, and Ali etc. etc. did not know the Quran by heart or how the Messenger recited it. so when the original scriptures without the marks authored by the companions was rewritten by the same companions to add the marks to help those without the dialect of the Messenger to pronounce the words in line with his way or sunnah. You are saying somehow they got it wrong. When they brought two witnessess for every verse even though they already knew it because they were there.
Wow. That is amazing. You are really insightful and I am glad you have figured it out for us as muslims. I mean for over 1400 years we have been getting it wrong in terms of recitations and so have the other billion muslims out there.
Well thank you brother for you insight. I have only one way to repay you and it is with a gift :foot:
Don't leave it too long though just when you have more insightful comments on the history of the revelation of our text.
Oh. Next time try to put some evidence to support your statements that may help. I know evidence for many is a difficult concept but it it what it is. You need some to validate your claims.
Some Muslims Will Say , Of Course Not , The Qur'aan itself Poetry , and Muhammad wasn't A Poet , So he couldn't have possibly written The Qur'aan or received it . because Allah is not A Poet . And Poetry was forbidden in Islam , Because it was used by the pagans during the time of Muhammad .
Quraan 36;69 ( Yusef Ali's Translation ) And I Quote ; '' We Have Not Instructed The ( Prophet ) In Poetry . Nor Is It Meet For Him This Is No Less Than A Message And A Quraan Making Things Clear ''
In Quraan 114 , The Quraan is contradicting itself . LQQk and read for yourself . This is definites '' Sh'ir '' Poetry '' either Allah doesn't know what he is talking about , Or someone else other than Muhammad write this .
Verse 1 ) Qul' A - Uuzu - Bi - Rabbin - Naas
Verse 2 ) Malikin ---- Naas
Verse 3 ) Ilahin ---- Nass
Verse 4 ) Min - Sharril - Waswaasil - Khan --- Naas
Verse 5 ) Allazii - Yuwas - Wisu - Fii - Suduu - Rin - Naas,
Verse 6 ) Minal - Jinnati - Wan - Naas
This is The 114th Chapter of The Q uraan , called '' An -Naas meaning '' The People '' , And it was revealed as the 21th Chapter originaly , In the year 616 A.D. Poetry simply means, In the most cases , Rhythm And Rhyme In Tones . Such as Rose Are Red , Violets Are Blue ; The fact that Red and Violets Rhyme , it would be classified as Poetry . And the above chapter from The Quraan , that is poetry .
It would be classified as Poetry , And the above chapter from The Quraan , That is Poetry , Even though Islam claims Poetry is wrong
Quraan 36;69 m '' Shiyn '' Aiyn '' Raa , '' Poetry , '' or Shi'r The word is right there in The Arabic in The Quraan and Muhammad was not instructed in Poetry , Yet this and many other Suwrahs are right out Poetry , Why ? Quraan 69;41 , Clearly says '' The Quraan Is Not The Saying Of A Poet . Yet , The Redundant Sound Naas Is Poetry , Let Me Explain This .
If the Muslims will take time to Notice , If you read The Quraan , You will see that there are different writers there , For instance , 1.One Is A Poet , That's Musaylimat Ibn Habiyb , Who was A known Poet , And whose work was said to influence The Prophet's Quraan . Take A LQQk at Chapter 52 ( Suwratul Tuwr ) , It reads like this ,in part ; Wat Tuwr , Wa Kitaabin Masstuwr , Fiy Raqqin Manshuwr , Wal Baytil Ma;muwr , Nothing but poetry , And Musaylimat Ibn Habiyb qas A CERTIFIED pOET . tHEN YOU HAVE . 2. The Wretched ,Miserable Person in The Quraan , Who wrote about hell ;Not 1King , but ( 7 ) Different kinds ; why couldn't it be the other way around , 7 Heaven for the doers of good deeds ?
And one hell ? anyway , Here are the 7 Hell as found in the Quraan ; Lazaa ( Quraan 70;15 ) , Saqar ( Quraan 54;48 ) Hutamah ( Quraan 104;4 ) , Jahiym ( Quraan 2;119 ), Jahannam ( Quraan 2;206 ) Sa'yr
( Quraan 4;10 ) Haawiyah ( Quraan 101;9 ) ; One 1 Jannat ( Quraan 2;25
Garden or Heaven which sounds and LQQks so much like The Arabic Arabic word Jinn . for '' Devil , or Possessed , Malevolent being . It Is Just To Close For Comfort . Why Couldn't Allah Or Whoever Wrote This Quraan Used Another Word ? ( 3 ) . Another Writer Wrote These Sadistic , Qur'aan Quote About Hell '' Talking About Boiling Water Ripping Their Intestines And Bowels Apart ( Quraan 47;15 ) . Then The Sinner Will Be Given Boiling Hot Water To Drink , And They Will Never Be Satisfied .
Or Nourished By The Water ( Quraan 88;5-7 ) , Then the writers changed ; For Another , Talked About The Doers Of Good - They Will Have Bubbling Spring Raised Couches And Goblets And Rich Carpets ( Quraan 88;10-16 ) . ( 4 ) . Obviously , This Write Was A Poor Man . Who Didn't Have None Of These Earthly .Material Wealths , And Was LQQking Forward , Yearning For That One Day , He May ! What's So Sad And Ironic Is That , All Of These Things Can Happen And Be Found Right Here On Earth . People Kill Everyday And Rip And Cut People Apart .If You Boil Tea , You Are Drinking Boiling Hot Water With Sugar . Honey And Other Flavors Added To It . There Are Springs In Heaven Or Wherever The Garden Is ;
These Same Springs Can Be Found Right Here On Earth . Either Cold Or Hot . Remember Water Consists Of Oydrogen And Oxygen ; So Does That Means Heaven Is Like Earth . Up There In SPACE SomeWhere ( Where There Is No Oxygen ) , Or Earth Is Like Heaven ? You Can Go To Any Department Store And Buy A Thousand Dollar Couch And Rich , Oriental Carpets , Gold Braceltes , Etc . LQQk At The Multimillionaire , Hugh Hefner , He Has Maids Walking Around Serving Him And His Guests Daily ; Fruit , Grapes , Milk . Honey And A Variety Of Foods As Found In ( Quraan 47;15,78;32 And 16;11 ) .
Then When You LQQk Around His Magnificent Mansion , There Are Beautiful Trees , Flowers , As Found In Quraan 16'67 And 36;34 . Hugh Even Has A Flowing River Quraan 98;8 . That Runs Throughout His House With Glass , Transparent Floors , Runing Outside Into A Cave As Found In Quraan 2;25 . These Are All Things The Quraan Has Promised , But As You Can See , All Of It Is Right Here . It Would Seem Like A Lot To The Desert Arabs Back Then , Because The Desert . Is Basically Lifeless , And It Was Tremendously Harsh On Their Lives . So Everything Most Fortunate People Take For Granted . The People Back In Muhammad's Time . Why Couldn't Allah , The Razzaq = The Provider '' Just Provide ( His Faithful Believers With All Of These Common Things ; All Which Could Be Found Right Here On Earth ? Seems Like Allah Likes To Leaven His People Shorthanded ?
Quraan 36;69 ( Yusef Ali's Translation ) And I Quote ; '' We Have Not Instructed The ( Prophet ) In Poetry . Nor Is It Meet For Him This Is No Less Than A Message And A Quraan Making Things Clear ''
In Quraan 114 , The Quraan is contradicting itself . LQQk and read for yourself . This is definites '' Sh'ir '' Poetry '' either Allah doesn't know what he is talking about , Or someone else other than Muhammad write this .
Verse 1 ) Qul' A - Uuzu - Bi - Rabbin - Naas
Verse 2 ) Malikin ---- Naas
Verse 3 ) Ilahin ---- Nass
Verse 4 ) Min - Sharril - Waswaasil - Khan --- Naas
Verse 5 ) Allazii - Yuwas - Wisu - Fii - Suduu - Rin - Naas,
Verse 6 ) Minal - Jinnati - Wan - Naas
This is The 114th Chapter of The Q uraan , called '' An -Naas meaning '' The People '' , And it was revealed as the 21th Chapter originaly , In the year 616 A.D. Poetry simply means, In the most cases , Rhythm And Rhyme In Tones . Such as Rose Are Red , Violets Are Blue ; The fact that Red and Violets Rhyme , it would be classified as Poetry . And the above chapter from The Quraan , that is poetry .
It would be classified as Poetry , And the above chapter from The Quraan , That is Poetry , Even though Islam claims Poetry is wrong
Quraan 36;69 m '' Shiyn '' Aiyn '' Raa , '' Poetry , '' or Shi'r The word is right there in The Arabic in The Quraan and Muhammad was not instructed in Poetry , Yet this and many other Suwrahs are right out Poetry , Why ? Quraan 69;41 , Clearly says '' The Quraan Is Not The Saying Of A Poet . Yet , The Redundant Sound Naas Is Poetry , Let Me Explain This .
If the Muslims will take time to Notice , If you read The Quraan , You will see that there are different writers there , For instance , 1.One Is A Poet , That's Musaylimat Ibn Habiyb , Who was A known Poet , And whose work was said to influence The Prophet's Quraan . Take A LQQk at Chapter 52 ( Suwratul Tuwr ) , It reads like this ,in part ; Wat Tuwr , Wa Kitaabin Masstuwr , Fiy Raqqin Manshuwr , Wal Baytil Ma;muwr , Nothing but poetry , And Musaylimat Ibn Habiyb qas A CERTIFIED pOET . tHEN YOU HAVE . 2. The Wretched ,Miserable Person in The Quraan , Who wrote about hell ;Not 1King , but ( 7 ) Different kinds ; why couldn't it be the other way around , 7 Heaven for the doers of good deeds ?
And one hell ? anyway , Here are the 7 Hell as found in the Quraan ; Lazaa ( Quraan 70;15 ) , Saqar ( Quraan 54;48 ) Hutamah ( Quraan 104;4 ) , Jahiym ( Quraan 2;119 ), Jahannam ( Quraan 2;206 ) Sa'yr
( Quraan 4;10 ) Haawiyah ( Quraan 101;9 ) ; One 1 Jannat ( Quraan 2;25
Garden or Heaven which sounds and LQQks so much like The Arabic Arabic word Jinn . for '' Devil , or Possessed , Malevolent being . It Is Just To Close For Comfort . Why Couldn't Allah Or Whoever Wrote This Quraan Used Another Word ? ( 3 ) . Another Writer Wrote These Sadistic , Qur'aan Quote About Hell '' Talking About Boiling Water Ripping Their Intestines And Bowels Apart ( Quraan 47;15 ) . Then The Sinner Will Be Given Boiling Hot Water To Drink , And They Will Never Be Satisfied .
Or Nourished By The Water ( Quraan 88;5-7 ) , Then the writers changed ; For Another , Talked About The Doers Of Good - They Will Have Bubbling Spring Raised Couches And Goblets And Rich Carpets ( Quraan 88;10-16 ) . ( 4 ) . Obviously , This Write Was A Poor Man . Who Didn't Have None Of These Earthly .Material Wealths , And Was LQQking Forward , Yearning For That One Day , He May ! What's So Sad And Ironic Is That , All Of These Things Can Happen And Be Found Right Here On Earth . People Kill Everyday And Rip And Cut People Apart .If You Boil Tea , You Are Drinking Boiling Hot Water With Sugar . Honey And Other Flavors Added To It . There Are Springs In Heaven Or Wherever The Garden Is ;
These Same Springs Can Be Found Right Here On Earth . Either Cold Or Hot . Remember Water Consists Of Oydrogen And Oxygen ; So Does That Means Heaven Is Like Earth . Up There In SPACE SomeWhere ( Where There Is No Oxygen ) , Or Earth Is Like Heaven ? You Can Go To Any Department Store And Buy A Thousand Dollar Couch And Rich , Oriental Carpets , Gold Braceltes , Etc . LQQk At The Multimillionaire , Hugh Hefner , He Has Maids Walking Around Serving Him And His Guests Daily ; Fruit , Grapes , Milk . Honey And A Variety Of Foods As Found In ( Quraan 47;15,78;32 And 16;11 ) .
Then When You LQQk Around His Magnificent Mansion , There Are Beautiful Trees , Flowers , As Found In Quraan 16'67 And 36;34 . Hugh Even Has A Flowing River Quraan 98;8 . That Runs Throughout His House With Glass , Transparent Floors , Runing Outside Into A Cave As Found In Quraan 2;25 . These Are All Things The Quraan Has Promised , But As You Can See , All Of It Is Right Here . It Would Seem Like A Lot To The Desert Arabs Back Then , Because The Desert . Is Basically Lifeless , And It Was Tremendously Harsh On Their Lives . So Everything Most Fortunate People Take For Granted . The People Back In Muhammad's Time . Why Couldn't Allah , The Razzaq = The Provider '' Just Provide ( His Faithful Believers With All Of These Common Things ; All Which Could Be Found Right Here On Earth ? Seems Like Allah Likes To Leaven His People Shorthanded ?
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
Why don't you study the history and sciences of the Hadith first. Because it is obvious you do not know what we know to be authentic and what is daief. And how a certain hadith gets that level.TehuTi said:
Exactly that is why we accept from the people whom Allah said he is pleased with. And that is the generation of Muhammed and the two after that. Their testimony is what is accepted. The scholars have done this already you just have to know where to look in terms of what is authentic and what is not. Unfortunately as you may know many of these types of books are only in arabic. So many things written by many scholars are not seen or heard by the massess because they do not know the language.
And as far as the issue with sects yes the quran says to not form into sects but the Messenger of Allah said we would in the hadith where the jews will divide into 71 sects, christians 72, and my ummah will be 73 a even bigger fitnah. But he gave us the measure or criterion to know what to do. And that is the one's who follow the Quran and His sunnah.
His last speech is hadith Mutawattir the highest level of sahih. He mentions what is needed again. The quran and sunnah is what he left us follow it and you will be guided.
Popeyesays
Well-Known Member
Quoting a single verse is often insufficient:
"17:80 Observe prayer at sunset, till the first darkening of the night, and
the daybreak reading - for the daybreak reading hath its witnesses,
And watch unto it in the night: this shall be an excess in service: it
may be that thy Lord will raise thee to a glorious station:
And say, "O my Lord, cause me to enter with a perfect entry, and to come
forth with a perfect forthcoming, and give me from thy presence a helping
power:"
And say: Truth is come and falsehood is vanished. Verily, falsehood is
a thing that vanisheth.
And we send down of the Koran that which is a healing and a mercy to the
faithful: But it shall only add to the ruin of the wicked.
When we bestow favours on man, he withdraweth and goeth aside; but when
evil toucheth him, he is despairing.
Say: Every one acteth after his own manner: but your Lord well knoweth
who is best guided in his path.
And they will ask thee of the Spirit. Say: The Spirit proceedeth at my
Lord's command: but of knowledge, only a little to you is given.
If we pleased, we could take away what we have revealed to thee: none
couldst thou then find thee to undertake thy cause with us.
Save as a mercy from thy Lord; great, verily, is his favour towards
thee." ~ Rodwell
"78 Establish worship at the going down of the sun until the dark of night, and (the recital of) the Qur'án at dawn. Lo! (the recital of) the Qur'án at dawn is ever witnessed.
79 And some part of the night awake for it, a largess for thee. It may be that thy Lord will raise thee to a praised estate.
80 And say: My Lord! Cause me to come in with a firm incoming and to go out with a firm outgoing. And give me from Thy presence a sustaining Power.
81 And say: Truth hath come and falsehood hath vanished away. Lo! falsehood is ever bound to vanish.
82 And We reveal of the Qur'án that which is a healing and a mercy for believers though it increase the evil-doers in naught save ruin.
83 And when We make life pleasant unto man, he turneth away and is averse; and when ill toucheth him he is in despair." ~ Pickthall
Scott
"17:80 Observe prayer at sunset, till the first darkening of the night, and
the daybreak reading - for the daybreak reading hath its witnesses,
And watch unto it in the night: this shall be an excess in service: it
may be that thy Lord will raise thee to a glorious station:
And say, "O my Lord, cause me to enter with a perfect entry, and to come
forth with a perfect forthcoming, and give me from thy presence a helping
power:"
And say: Truth is come and falsehood is vanished. Verily, falsehood is
a thing that vanisheth.
And we send down of the Koran that which is a healing and a mercy to the
faithful: But it shall only add to the ruin of the wicked.
When we bestow favours on man, he withdraweth and goeth aside; but when
evil toucheth him, he is despairing.
Say: Every one acteth after his own manner: but your Lord well knoweth
who is best guided in his path.
And they will ask thee of the Spirit. Say: The Spirit proceedeth at my
Lord's command: but of knowledge, only a little to you is given.
If we pleased, we could take away what we have revealed to thee: none
couldst thou then find thee to undertake thy cause with us.
Save as a mercy from thy Lord; great, verily, is his favour towards
thee." ~ Rodwell
"78 Establish worship at the going down of the sun until the dark of night, and (the recital of) the Qur'án at dawn. Lo! (the recital of) the Qur'án at dawn is ever witnessed.
79 And some part of the night awake for it, a largess for thee. It may be that thy Lord will raise thee to a praised estate.
80 And say: My Lord! Cause me to come in with a firm incoming and to go out with a firm outgoing. And give me from Thy presence a sustaining Power.
81 And say: Truth hath come and falsehood hath vanished away. Lo! falsehood is ever bound to vanish.
82 And We reveal of the Qur'án that which is a healing and a mercy for believers though it increase the evil-doers in naught save ruin.
83 And when We make life pleasant unto man, he turneth away and is averse; and when ill toucheth him he is in despair." ~ Pickthall
Scott
mohamedhassan
Member
TehuTi said:
Oh you made a mistake. Its not the words of men its the words of a man, the prophet (saw). You seem to pay attention to Buhkari (rahumullah) but how about the sahaba who wrote hadeeth during the prophets(saw) [don't quote that misused hadeeth] How about the students of the Sahaba who had personal books of hadeeth? where these hundrends of years after the death of the prophet (saw)? how about Imam Maliks Muwatta? How about the thousands who listened to the prophet (saw)'s last speech? where those all lies? what did the prophet(saw) do in Isra and Miraj Allah mentions where he went but what did he do? What happened to the people in surah Buruj? I can find you THOUSANDS of stories/events from the quran that will stumble you and you'll never be able to explain them with out quran
Also Please don't subject the sunnah of the prophet (saw) to your own preferences and feelings. Just because you don't want to follow it or because you don't like it dosent mean you label it as you wish, please respect the sunnah of the prophet (saw). If Allah commanded people us saying: O you who believe! Raise not your voices above the voice of the Prophet (SAW), nor speak aloud to him in talk as you speak aloud to one another, lest your deeds may be rendered fruitless while you perceive not
the best we can do is to respect his sunnah
Lastly, to Laila if you claim that the prophet Muhammad wasn't Illierate tell me what hand did he write with? left or right? if you can prove he could write, and also tell and issues where HE WROTE, i.e: what he did in Hudaybiay wasn't writing!