Why did god create homosexuality?

[BSM1]

Why did God create homosexuality? Probably for the same reason He created shrimp, oysters, lobsters, scallops, clams, flounder, catfish, mussels, and other things in the waters without fin or scale.

 

[sojourner]

Debating with Christian "intellectuals"... They throw every argument out there they can think of to justify their beliefs, and twist anything you say to create another argument that has nothing to do with the original point. The "debate" becomes so wrapped up in semantics that it becomes more of a contest to see who can use the most words to effectively say absolutely nothing. By the end when you've decided it's going nowhere and is not worth the headache, they claim victory and give the credit to almighty God... Hallelujah

Some do -- some don't. If you feel you have to put "intellectuals" in quotation marks, you probably haven't spent much time debating intellectuals -- either that, or you don't understand enough about Christian theology to know what you're talking about. There are many Christians who know what they're talking about, and can do it without the gymnastics you describe. That being said, there are also a lot of crackpots out there.

With regard to your comment about being "wrapped up in semantics": Theological terms are very broad. Words like "faith," "religion," "sin," "ministry," etc. have a range of meaning -- and subtle shades of grey. It helps if we know which shade we're talking about, so that we can be as precise as possible. If someone makes a claim about faith, for example, "Christians say that they are saved by faith," what does that mean? Most of the arguments I've seen are poor because the premises are either too broad or misunderstood from the outset.

Again, that being said, there are a lot of crackpots, too...

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

The word never was "infallible." I don't know who dreamed that up, but it never was meant to be "infallible."

Why would God need to correct anything? Our faith is not predicated upon the bible, but upon the relationship of the community of believers -- always has been.

So you're telling me the bible had absolutely nothing to do with you being a Christian? Jesus came to you in a vision, told you to believe in him, and not to listen to the words in the only book that acknowledges his existence because it was written by fallible men?

 

[sojourner]

Humorous fact. Watch a debate with a Christian verses a Muslims, a Christian verses a Hindu and a Christian vs an Atheist. Christianity is the only religion that looses to all other religion then the lack there of .

Funny is it not. If you remove Christian inerrancy from the table the other religion immediately looks better but if you add Biblical infallibility it ruins the argument still.

The problem is that religion isn't a contest to be "won" or "lost." There are only shades of understanding. Christianity only "loses" to other religions or viewpoints when the advocate tries to be too absolute or infallible, or too black-and-white. much of the time, we have to establish what is true about the argument before a real debate can even begin. For example, the statement about Xy being "infallible." Patently untrue. That falsehood needs to be dealt with before an argument can begin. There are so many misconceptions and generalizations about Xy out there, that at times it does seem like we're going in circles, because arguments are founded upon false premises.

 

[sojourner]

So you're telling me the bible had absolutely nothing to do with you being a Christian? Jesus came to you in a vision, told you to believe in him, and not to listen to the words in the only book that acknowledges his existence because it was written by fallible men?

The bible had much less to do with my being a Christian than the Tradition in which I was reared. We are not part of the "bible only" crowd. The faith (once again -- wish you had actually read my post the first time) is transmitted through the relationships we build -- not through a book.

 

[sojourner]

Why did God create homosexuality? Probably for the same reason He created shrimp, oysters, lobsters, scallops, clams, flounder, catfish, mussels, and other things in the waters without fin or scale.

Catfish have fins. And they're FABULOUS!

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

The bible had much less to do with my being a Christian than the Tradition in which I was reared. We are not part of the "bible only" crowd. The faith (once again -- wish you had actually read my post the first time) is transmitted through the relationships we build -- not through a book.

So if your faith is in the community and not the bible, why not just cut out the dogma and the magic and fairy tales? What need does a happy community have of Jesus?

 

[sojourner]

So if your faith is in the community and not the bible, why not just cut out the dogma and the magic and fairy tales? What need does a happy community have of Jesus?

Faith isn't in the community, it's transmitted through the community. See, this illustrates my earlier post, and also your argument that Xtians argue semantics. I was very clear about my wording, and yet it very quickly became twisted.

As a matter of fact, my church has very little -- if any -- dogma, no magic and no fairy tales. We do have beliefs, grace and Tradition...

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

So you do believe in the Bible?

 

[sojourner]

So you do believe in the Bible?

Believe in it? Heck! I've seen it!

Seriously, though, "believe" is one of those broad terms. What, specifically, do you mean by "believe in the bible?" Do I think it's literally factual? Not much of it. Do I buy into its mythic thrust? Yes. am I moved by the theology of love, justice and radical hospitality I find in its stories, poetry, and narrative? Yes.

But the bible is part of the Tradition -- not the Tradition entirely. The bible was created by the Tradition, not the other way 'round.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Believe in it? Heck! I've seen it!

Seriously, though, "believe" is one of those broad terms. What, specifically, do you mean by "believe in the bible?" Do I think it's literally factual? Not much of it. Do I buy into its mythic thrust? Yes. am I moved by the theology of love, justice and radical hospitality I find in its stories, poetry, and narrative? Yes.

But the bible is part of the Tradition -- not the Tradition entirely. The bible was created by the Tradition, not the other way 'round.

I'll clarify what I mean by "believe" in the bible. Basically do you believe that the people mentioned inside were real people and that the events actually happened? If not, then why not just pass on a message of community and caring without labeling yourself as a Christian?

 

[sojourner]

I'll clarify what I mean by "believe" in the bible. Basically do you believe that the people mentioned inside were real people and that the events actually happened? If not, then why not just pass on a message of community and caring without labeling yourself as a Christian?

Some of them. Some not. Faith isn't predicated on fact. it's the assurance of things hoped for. There's a fundamental difference between a community and a community centered in Christ.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Some of them. Some not. Faith isn't predicated on fact. it's the assurance of things hoped for. There's a fundamental difference between a community and a community centered in Christ.

1) how do you choose which statements are true?

2) what is the difference between said communities? Do majority non-Christian neighborhoods have higher crime rates or are the people any less neighborly?

 

[sojourner]

Do you mean which are factual?
Fact isn't chosen, it's discovered. Scholarship and exegesis go a long way.

There is no difference as I think you mean it here, based upon the last clause of your second question, because one isn't cloistered from the other. At my church, we assert that, not only do we seek to be in the community -- but we seek to be the heart of the community. Christians are called to be salt and light. Salt interacts with the food. Light works within the framework of nature.

The difference I'm talking about is one of perspective -- and it can be formed by any community -- whether that community identifies as "Christian" or not. That's the beauty of Xy -- it's not a closed system of exclusive beliefs. Rather, it's an open system of inclusive outlook. Love and selflessness are not exclusively Christian, but they lie at the center of Christian thought. The Tradition and mythos of Xy provide focus and impetus for us to foster those tenets more deeply in the communities in which we find ourselves.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Do you mean which are factual?
Fact isn't chosen, it's discovered. Scholarship and exegesis go a long way.

So which people/events in the Bible have been proven factual? I don't know of any.

 

[Ken Brown]

You know, I think I will let Elohim Himself explain as to why He created homosexuality. I'm sure He will do a much better job than I have done. KB

 

[sojourner]

So which people/events in the Bible have been proven factual? I don't know of any.

We have record of Judaic kings. We have record of Jesus. We have record of the Twelve and Paul. we have record of several people in the NT, such as Timothy, Silas, Lydia, Priscia, Phoebe, etc. It is not generally debated that these people did not exist, for they wrote letters, or were mentioned in letters.

 

[sojourner]

You know, I think I will let Elohim Himself explain as to why He created homosexuality. I'm sure He will do a much better job than I have done. KB

So you will go away unconvinced? You will turn aside the testimony of your peers -- some of whom are learned in biblical scholarship -- in favor of your own interpretation of ancient writings, which were never intended to be law for the Gentile? What did the early church do, before they had a bible? They listened to the testimony of the learned among them. But you will not do the same?

Amazing.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

We have record of Judaic kings. We have record of Jesus. We have record of the Twelve and Paul. we have record of several people in the NT, such as Timothy, Silas, Lydia, Priscia, Phoebe, etc. It is not generally debated that these people did not exist, for they wrote letters, or were mentioned in letters.

The ONLY record of Jesus is the Bible. Name one secular source that mentions him... I'll concede the gospel writers and Paul. I'm not sure about the Judaic kings, but I've never heard of any record of them besides the Bible.

 

[sojourner]

The ONLY record of Jesus is the Bible. Name one secular source that mentions him... I'll concede the gospel writers and Paul. I'm not sure about the Judaic kings, but I've never heard of any record of them besides the Bible.

Tacitus.

Remember, though, that the bible isn't a single source. It's a library of source material. There are 27 canonical books, and many others that are non-canonical -- all dealing with Jesus. I doubt that I'm mentioned in as many books, yet no one doubts my existence.